They lost the war on drugs

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#1719865 14-Feb-2017 10:36

Rikkitic:

Not sure what to make of this but an item on Voxy indicates that Peter Dunne is being taken to court for violation of cannabis laws!

http://www.voxy.co.nz/politics/5/274911

until verified I see as particles on a salt lake beach. Probably electioneering.

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#1719919 14-Feb-2017 12:00

Just seems like a massive bureaucratic PITA.

Why not just legalise weed via licensed retailers, with appropriate tax and a maximum THC content?

Result: adults can enjoy what many are already enjoying and what I suspect many more would enjoy if the criminality was removed, the government makes more money from taxes and everyone is happier....

JimmyH

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#1721492 16-Feb-2017 18:52

Pumpedd:

I dont believe you get high as such from Sativex. Even so most people cannot afford it as it costs $3k just to import it each time plus the thousands the drug costs. It is still crazy that the patient needs to go to a GP...the to a specialist...then the MoH decides. In my mind the Government did nothing today. If Pharmac decide to supply then that would be something.

I don't care whether you do get high from Sativex, or any other type of medication in these circumstances. Honestly, if it relieves the suffering of someone with a terminal illness then just give it to them. If they happen to heel a bit stoned or happy for a wee while as a consequence, then who am I to begrudge them that.

I don't understand the focus on ensuring that a medicine can't get someone high.

And trust me, while IV morphine (which we all seem fine with for someone in excruciating pain) does indeed remove pain, it can also get you very, very out of it. Been there, and very grateful that the A&E dept just gave me what I needed when I was in agony, without worrying whether (shock horror) I might get some enjoyable sensations along the way.

gzt

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#1722146 18-Feb-2017 10:23

It is interesting that many people who consume marijuana recreationally are actually against legalisation and often less than enthusiastic about decriminalisation. Generally these people prefer the current situation on various grounds.

What does the current situation look like? Well, those people are more or less free to make that [recreational] choice in the privacy of their own homes, and the homes of like minded people.

Decriminalising it in exactly that situation would preserve the current situation.

Rikkitic

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#1722156 18-Feb-2017 11:01

I don't follow you on this. Why would decriminalisation preserve the status quo? Do you have any sources for your observation that people who use dope prefer to keep it illegal?

I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney

Fred99

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#1725391 23-Feb-2017 20:37

Time to declare war on puffer fish:

Rikkitic

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#1725674 24-Feb-2017 13:39

I wasn't sure where to put this, but finally decided the appropriate place was here.

There are items on RNZ at the moment about alcohol home delivery services, and also alcohol in powder form being smuggled into events. This raises a number points in my mind that are worthy of discussion. For example, is alcohol so addictive, and people so desperate to have it, and so unable to enjoy anything without it, that they have to resort to pathetic measures like this? Are they going to start injecting it next? Is it not time that the producers of this stuff were held to account? Normally when people push intoxicating powders there are stiff prison sentences attached. Who actually needs alcohol in powder form, for F sake?

The home delivery people say their service improves safety by keeping party animals off the streets. The police say it makes things worse by increasing alcohol availability even more, not to mention accessibility to the young. I'm not sure what I think. This one is up for debate. Feel free to chime in.

I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney

Fred99

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#1725704 24-Feb-2017 15:14

As I understand, the powdered alcohol is micro-encapsulated, and when mixed with water then it's about the same alcohol content as a beer, and it's not really feasible to mix it much stronger - I expect it's very expensive too.

I haven't heard the discussion on RNZ, but guess that "novelty value" is why it might appeal to youth. Probably a "classier" drink than alcohol hand sanitiser gel, but not by much IMO. Sounds truly bloody awful.

Young (under 18) NZers don't seem to have too much problem getting anything they want as it is.

I don't see "powdered alcohol" and "home delivery" being a significant issue vs "booze culture" in general.

frankv

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#1725744 24-Feb-2017 16:29

Rikkitic:

alcohol in powder form being smuggled into events.

Lots of these events have alcohol outlets, who pay big rentals in return for the monopoly on alcohol sales, and consequently charge enormous prices. So I think that powdered alcohol is as much about avoiding that as fuelling an addiction.

Rikkitic

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#1725758 24-Feb-2017 16:53

Fred99:

As I understand, the powdered alcohol is micro-encapsulated, and when mixed with water then it's about the same alcohol content as a beer, and it's not really feasible to mix it much stronger - I expect it's very expensive too.

I haven't heard the discussion on RNZ, but guess that "novelty value" is why it might appeal to youth. Probably a "classier" drink than alcohol hand sanitiser gel, but not by much IMO. Sounds truly bloody awful.

Young (under 18) NZers don't seem to have too much problem getting anything they want as it is.

I don't see "powdered alcohol" and "home delivery" being a significant issue vs "booze culture" in general.

The fact that there is an apparent market for these is a symptom of the booze culture. Things won't improve if it continues to be pandered to. Tolerate this and the marketing demons will dream up something even worse. It just continues to escalate. I am not in favour of banning booze, which wouldn't work anyway, but I don't see why a curb could not be put on gimmicks designed to pour ever more down the gullets of susceptible consumers, like force-feeding geese.

I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney

Rikkitic

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#1725763 24-Feb-2017 16:58

frankv:

Rikkitic:

alcohol in powder form being smuggled into events.

Lots of these events have alcohol outlets, who pay big rentals in return for the monopoly on alcohol sales, and consequently charge enormous prices. So I think that powdered alcohol is as much about avoiding that as fuelling an addiction.

Why does everything have to be about maximum greed all the time? I used to attend plenty of events in Europe where the cost of a beer was just the normal price. They don't always have to gouge everyone for everything they can get.

I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney

Fred99

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#1725770 24-Feb-2017 17:09

Rikkitic:

Fred99:

As I understand, the powdered alcohol is micro-encapsulated, and when mixed with water then it's about the same alcohol content as a beer, and it's not really feasible to mix it much stronger - I expect it's very expensive too.

I haven't heard the discussion on RNZ, but guess that "novelty value" is why it might appeal to youth. Probably a "classier" drink than alcohol hand sanitiser gel, but not by much IMO. Sounds truly bloody awful.

Young (under 18) NZers don't seem to have too much problem getting anything they want as it is.

I don't see "powdered alcohol" and "home delivery" being a significant issue vs "booze culture" in general.

The fact that there is an apparent market for these is a symptom of the booze culture. Things won't improve if it continues to be pandered to. Tolerate this and the marketing demons will dream up something even worse. It just continues to escalate. I am not in favour of banning booze, which wouldn't work anyway, but I don't see why a curb could not be put on gimmicks designed to pour ever more down the gullets of susceptible consumers, like force-feeding geese.

I hear you - but it's all gimmicks designed to get you to pour stuff down your throat - be that working class bourbon and coke alcopop, or $100 bottles of Pinot.

Rikkitic

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#1732623 7-Mar-2017 16:17

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/03/06/health/israel-decriminalizes-cannabis-marijuana/index.html

Since NZ government policy seems to be to do what everyone else does first, another step in a good direction.

I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney

Dulouz

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#1732632 7-Mar-2017 16:40

Rikkitic:

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/03/06/health/israel-decriminalizes-cannabis-marijuana/index.html

Since NZ government policy seems to be to do what everyone else does first, another step in a good direction.

I really hope so. I have no idea why NZ is dragging their heels on this issue. Seems that Peter Dunne is a major blocking stone. Must of had a bad trip once.

Amanon

Fred99

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#1735835 13-Mar-2017 15:58

Some data from testing sewage in Auckland:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11817303

Not sure why they didn't extrapolate that out, but assuming a street price of $800/g and not taking into account that product on the street will be (probably very significantly) "cut" and impure, then for 1.3 million people in that sewage catchment, there's about 170 kg of pure methamphetamine being used per year, as a cost of about $136 million.

Nearly 70 per cent of regular methamphetamine users said they commonly used social welfare payments to buy drugs last year. (source)

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