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1478 posts

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  Reply # 1878450 6-Oct-2017 13:09
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SepticSceptic:

 

And why didn't she take the train / bus /ferry instead of flying ?

 

 

Four legs good, two legs better


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Uber Geek
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  Reply # 1878588 6-Oct-2017 17:28
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Wiggum:

 

 

 

She was probably off to another climate conference.

 

ote

 

 

 

 

Now that cartoon is funny. And not too far from the truth! Note to MODS, I tried to cut the cartoon, but couldn't.


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  Reply # 1878626 6-Oct-2017 18:42
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DaveB:

 

 

 

Now that cartoon is funny. And not too far from the truth! Note to MODS, I tried to cut the cartoon, but couldn't.

 

 

It always amuses me that Green MPs have some of the highest airfare and taxi expenses but never stop saying how we should all be walking, cycling and using buses.


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  Reply # 1878652 6-Oct-2017 19:59
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Wiggum:

 

MikeB4:

 

I have no issue with James Shaw as Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Finance, he would certainly do a better job with the later than Steven Joyce and his manner compliments Bill English well. He also has a long history in sustainable management.

 

 

I think our political system is seriously screwed up if we have to resort to giving big positions to minority party members in Government. I don't care who that person is, or how good they are, If they were not democratically elected to be there, then they should not be there.

 

Our MMP system is seriously flawed, A party with 7% of votes, should never be in a position to decide who will be government.

 

 

So you have an issue with appointing a Minister, based on "or how good they are"  I think good is good.

 

I asked before but you may have missed it. Propose a system that is better than FPP or MMP when the major party minority 46% of the popular vote


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  Reply # 1878653 6-Oct-2017 20:01
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Wiggum:

 

MikeB4:

 

 

 

James Shaw is in parliament by way of a democratic election. A party with 7% is not deciding it is either a party with circa 46%  or circa 36%. that is making the ultimate decision and the voting public made it so. Just because you may not agree with the outcome does not make undemocratic.

 

 

I'm not saying he should not be in parliament.

 

I am referring to suggestions that he should be deputy PM, and finance minister. Its ludicrous to say that democratically he deserves those positions when his party only managed to secure 5.9% of the votes.

 

 

What about List MP's who got a free ride in?


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  Reply # 1878811 7-Oct-2017 09:12
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Today is specials day, I would love to see Mr Shaw dethrone Mr Peters as king maker. Not going to happen but it would be nice to hit reset on the Winston smugness and ego.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1879608 9-Oct-2017 09:10
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It's turning out that the Green Party is Green no longer, it's turned permanently RED!

 

Don't you think we need a NEW Green Party that stays Green and is prepared to negotiate with EITHER National OR Labour?

 

Why vote for a RED Green party in the future?


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  Reply # 1879610 9-Oct-2017 09:17
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frednz:

 

It's turning out that the Green Party is Green no longer, it's turned permanently RED!

 

Don't you think we need a NEW Green Party that stays Green and is prepared to negotiate with EITHER National OR Labour?

 

Why vote for a RED Green party in the future?

 

 

I think its so sad to see Greens be so left, rather do whats best for the Green movement. Its well known that Maori's have always done better under National by a long shot. The things the Maori party were able to achieve was quite immense. Maybe they needed to shout out about the wins a bit more. A red government with the Greens and NZ First fighting could be intense.


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  Reply # 1879660 9-Oct-2017 09:28
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I must have hoped into the Tardis, "Red Government" really! is this the 50s/60s? 





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


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Uber Geek
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  Reply # 1879761 9-Oct-2017 10:46
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MikeB4:

 

I must have hoped into the Tardis, "Red Government" really! is this the 50s/60s? 

 

 

More like the 70s, if you've seen Labour's employment policies


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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1881749 11-Oct-2017 09:50
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http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/10/greens-could-be-stumbling-block-to-labour-victory-patrick-gower.html

 

The above article mentions that:

 

New Zealand First leader Winston Peters has said he will only negotiate with Labour, and not the Greens - even though they may end up sitting around the same Cabinet table together.

 

Gower says that this means any deal cooked up between Labour and NZ First might not be acceptable to the Greens' base.

 

Gower said the Green Party membership would need to be consulted on any deal to support a Government - and this would require 75 percent approval.

 

Gower considers that the Greens ..."won't be walked over by Winston Peters," he says. "If the Greens fall over, the left falls over."

 

And this is Llloyd Burr's view on it all:

 

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/10/lloyd-burr-greens-are-getting-shafted-again.html

 

Burr's conclusion is that:

 

"James Shaw needs to put his foot down and leverage the power his party holds, instead of letting Winston and Labour walk all over the Greens (again)." 


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  Reply # 1881771 11-Oct-2017 09:57
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frednz:

 

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/10/greens-could-be-stumbling-block-to-labour-victory-patrick-gower.html

 

The above article mentions that:

 

New Zealand First leader Winston Peters has said he will only negotiate with Labour, and not the Greens - even though they may end up sitting around the same Cabinet table together.

 

Gower says that this means any deal cooked up between Labour and NZ First might not be acceptable to the Greens' base.

 

Gower said the Green Party membership would need to be consulted on any deal to support a Government - and this would require 75 percent approval.

 

Gower considers that the Greens ..."won't be walked over by Winston Peters," he says. "If the Greens fall over, the left falls over."

 

And this is Llloyd Burr's view on it all:

 

http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/10/lloyd-burr-greens-are-getting-shafted-again.html

 

Burr's conclusion is that:

 

"James Shaw needs to put his foot down and leverage the power his party holds, instead of letting Winston and Labour walk all over the Greens (again)." 

 

 

Thats one stance. The other is that the Greens are not joined at the hip to Labour, all they have is a MOU, and Shaw stated that Adern is taking the lead, and the Greens and Labour are also talking, so its a bit of a stretch to say that the Greens are being walked over. If National had the Maori seats but was still short, would Maori expect to meet with Peters? No.

 

Its just media making a story, filling in some news columns,  as from the election two weeks ago till now, there is no news to tell, as we all know the situation, nothing has changed.


601 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1881998 11-Oct-2017 15:44
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Pumpedd:

 

frednz:

 

It's turning out that the Green Party is Green no longer, it's turned permanently RED!

 

Don't you think we need a NEW Green Party that stays Green and is prepared to negotiate with EITHER National OR Labour?

 

Why vote for a RED Green party in the future?

 

 

I think its so sad to see Greens be so left, rather do whats best for the Green movement. Its well known that Maori's have always done better under National by a long shot. The things the Maori party were able to achieve was quite immense. Maybe they needed to shout out about the wins a bit more. A red government with the Greens and NZ First fighting could be intense.

 

 

Instead of being so vague why don't you say what maori achieved and why it was so immense. 

 

I would suggest to you that Maori didn't achieve so much under a national government and that is why the electorate voted out the maori party.

 

As evidence to support my case i have here suicide statistics for maori and non-maori. Note the upward trend for maori suicides under the recent national government.

 

 

Reference: https://ourarchive.otago.ac.nz/bitstream/handle/10523/7390/MAORI%20REPORT%202015_20170620.pdf?sequence=5&isAllowed=y

 

Have a read. None of the health statistics for maori are better than for non-maori.


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  Reply # 1882302 12-Oct-2017 09:33
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http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11932023

 

A good article in the Herald this morning about the last day of negotiations for New Zealand First, National and Labour. The article mentions that:

 

In a bid to improve Labour's case, the Green Party members could be asked to approve its deal with Labour as soon as today with little notice of the agreement's details.

 

Labour wants to ensure the Greens are formally on board before Peters and his team make their final decision so they can guarantee they have the numbers.

 

Shaw and the Green team are working blind, without knowing the details of what Ardern is set to offer Peters. He has said he is leaving it to trust to ensure the Greens' deal is not worse than any NZ First might get.

 

It seems that the primary focus of the Greens is simply to change the Government even if it means that Labour and NZ First trample all over them! It looks like James Shaw will agree to anything to keep National out of power, but it's now obvious that the Greens would have done far better if they had negotiated with National.

 

I'm not sure why James Shaw is pictured in the article wearing a blue tie, he must surely have lots of red ones to pick from by now!

 

 


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  Reply # 1882327 12-Oct-2017 10:12
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I almost look forward to the Greens being in power. No longer will their members be able to be part of the "anti everything" brigade, they will find out very quickly that with the baubles of power comes the responsibility of power, decisions have to be made for the benefit of the majority, not the minority and that sometimes, a little compromise is required to get things done. I think these are things they will struggle with


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