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774 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  # 1981380 22-Mar-2018 10:55
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Jumping in here...  A green focus would absolutely be my choice.

 

But it would have to be a sensible, pragmatic green focus rather than the idealistic balderdash that is currently being served up by the Green Party.

 

(Case in point, Julie Anne Genter this morning on NewsTalkZB advocating for shutting down AirNZ's regional airline service and replacing it with an electric train service)


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  # 1981384 22-Mar-2018 11:06
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I am happy with any party that has both a social and green focus as these are both issues that matter to me. I fully agree with JA that climate change is today's nuclear-free challenge. I don't agree with those who maintain that New Zealand is too insignificant on the world stage to matter, so we should not be the ones to take any initiative. That is a cop-out. Someone has to be first. Someone has to be an example to others. New Zealand has been first in the past, with social change as it happens, and that was very significant. At the same time, any government pushing change has a broader responsibility. Change must occur gradually enough that it does not undermine business and destroy the economy, which benefits no-one. But some pain should be accepted as a necessary part of the process. Otherwise nothing changes.

 

I believe that a decent standard of living for the poorest and most deprived in society is essential for the health of that society. If those in need are not given a hand up, the result is drugs, crime, more prisons, wasted lives, brutalisation, innocents getting hurt, fear of walking the streets. If a significant portion of the population is treated like crap, it will behave like crap. If people are treated with respect, most will respond accordingly. This is what I believe, so a social focus is just as important to me as a green one. I know it is trendy at the moment to talk about blue-greens, but I don't think you can have one without the other. Respect for the environment goes with respect for the individual. 

 

Can we afford this Utopian vision? I don't know, but we can certainly afford to do better than we have done.

 

 

 

  





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


 
 
 
 


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Ultimate Geek
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  # 1981391 22-Mar-2018 11:26
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I believe that a decent standard of living for the poorest and most deprived in society is essential for the health of that society. If those in need are not given a hand up...

 

 

I agree in principle, but where I differ from you is the threshold that determines the 'poorest' and what level of hand up they should get.

 

 

If people are treated with respect, most will respond accordingly.

 

 

That certainly is a utopian view. If social welfare played out like that in the real world it would be great


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  # 1981401 22-Mar-2018 11:50
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Immediately post election and being a National voter I was prepared to give the Coalition time to see how things go and I have also expressed some support for them on these forums. However, in the last month I have become more and more concerned about their performance and some of the individuals are  showing they are simply not fit for the tasks assigned. As for Jacinda Ardern I feel that in the last month she has shown that she is struggling in the position and could well be out of her depth. I am more and more feeling negative about our future, that maybe influenced by pain and meds but I were still in business I would be feeling quite uneasy and would be looking closely at my investments, reducing debt exposure and increasing risk mitigation especially in the human resources.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

There is no planet B

 

 


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  # 1981406 22-Mar-2018 11:58
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6FIEND:

 

Jumping in here...  A green focus would absolutely be my choice.

 

But it would have to be a sensible, pragmatic green focus rather than the idealistic balderdash that is currently being served up by the Green Party.

 

(Case in point, Julie Anne Genter this morning on NewsTalkZB advocating for shutting down AirNZ's regional airline service and replacing it with an electric train service)

 

 

 

 

Good one! I look forward to an electric train to replace the now defunct Masterton to Auckland flights...! Provided, of course, by 'electric train' she means 'Shinkansen'.






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  # 1981408 22-Mar-2018 12:00
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MikeB4:

 

Immediately post election and being a National voter I was prepared to give the Coalition time to see how things go and I have also expressed some support for them on these forums. However, in the last month I have become more and more concerned about their performance and some of the individuals are  showing they are simply not fit for the tasks assigned. As for Jacinda Ardern I feel that in the last month she has shown that she is struggling in the position and could well be out of her depth. I am more and more feeling negative about our future, that maybe influenced by pain and meds but I were still in business I would be feeling quite uneasy and would be looking closely at my investments, reducing debt exposure and increasing risk mitigation especially in the human resources.

 

 

 

 

She is of course also struggling with *something else we can't mention* which, allegedly, was not going to have any effect and indeed was only going to keep her away from work for 6 weeks...






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  # 1981409 22-Mar-2018 12:02
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Pumpedd:

 

and the topic is Jacinda Ardern.....

 

 

 

 

I thought she was supposed to be god? cool






 
 
 
 


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  # 1981424 22-Mar-2018 12:08
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6FIEND:

 

Case in point, Julie Anne Genter this morning on NewsTalkZB advocating for shutting down AirNZ's regional airline service and replacing it with an electric train service

 

 

I'm always doubtful of my thinking when I agree with the Greens ... but conceptually that makes sense to me.  I'm unsure if any of it would be economically feasible though.

 

Regional flights generally fly to/from a larger hub (AKL/WLG/CHC).  Having regional flights doesn't ease air-congestion at the main airports.

 

For example a rail-service from WRE - AKL  or  HLZ - AKL could replace a feeder flight. For those travelling between Auckland and Whangarei or Hamilton a CBD to CBD rail link would be useful.  People who want to fly from Kapiti could be well served by a train to Wellington Airport. 

 

I think more regional airport consolidation is inevitable in NZ.  For example: Do we really need all of Rotorua, Tauranga, Hamilton and Taupo airports?  Perhaps there are safety benefits in maintaining those airports.

 

I almost never fly into Whangarei, Tauranga, Rotorua or Hamilton.  I take a fight to AKL and drive a rental car.  It's normally cheaper and I may have had to fly through Auckland anyway. 

 

 

 

 





Mike

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  # 1981427 22-Mar-2018 12:20
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I also see no problem with the idea of a train service. Actually, this is what many other countries do. I would love to see trains connecting the regions. The more public transport, the better. Whether it is affordable or not, I do not know, but the idea is not ridiculous.

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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Ultimate Geek
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  # 1981428 22-Mar-2018 12:22
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A rail link would have it's place for a select few City to city connections maybe. Hamilton-auckland, whangarei-Auckland.
Anywhere else the infrastructural cost would be prohibitive.

I would love a good rail connection between New Plymouth and Wellington or Auckland, but they would have to be high speed, journey time of less than 2 hours. Which isn't going to happen, or be worthwhile until NZ has a population similar to UK.

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  # 1981429 22-Mar-2018 12:24
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Rikkitic:

 

I also see no problem with the idea of a train service. Actually, this is what many other countries do. I would love to see trains connecting the regions. The more public transport, the better. Whether it is affordable or not, I do not know, but the idea is not ridiculous.

 

 

 

 

I would as well....as long as they were viable. When I say viable they may need some taxpayer assistance but it must be minimal. 

 

A lot of things are nice to have. All the regions are now dusting out their silly ideas cabinet in the hope that Minister Jones or PM may sprinkle some gold dust their way. Kapiti (where I live) have dusted off some tower monstrosity...uggg.


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  # 1981430 22-Mar-2018 12:24
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MikeB4:

 

Immediately post election and being a National voter I was prepared to give the Coalition time to see how things go and I have also expressed some support for them on these forums. However, in the last month I have become more and more concerned about their performance and some of the individuals are  showing they are simply not fit for the tasks assigned. As for Jacinda Ardern I feel that in the last month she has shown that she is struggling in the position and could well be out of her depth. I am more and more feeling negative about our future, that maybe influenced by pain and meds but I were still in business I would be feeling quite uneasy and would be looking closely at my investments, reducing debt exposure and increasing risk mitigation especially in the human resources.

 


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  # 1981438 22-Mar-2018 12:35
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Rikkitic:

 

I also see no problem with the idea of a train service. Actually, this is what many other countries do. I would love to see trains connecting the regions. The more public transport, the better. Whether it is affordable or not, I do not know, but the idea is not ridiculous.

 

 

 

 

Whether it ridiculous would almost entirely depend on cost surely? If it cost, let's say.. $4B (and to be honest considering much smaller patches of road cost as much if not more it seems unlikely it would be such a small number), it would be better for the Government (purely financially and excluding environmental impacts etc etc) to PAY Air NZ to run those services in order to cover their losses to service the area.  In reality it would be MUCH MUCH higher cost I would imagine (I don't have any numbers so I can't give a ballpark). 

 

I love the idea of an Electric train, but practically, it's somewhat unlikely to occur. I can't recall what the Government estimated it would cost to build our MUCH needed rail to the Auckland airport from the city? Any know? 

 

 

 

Also worth taking into account, who would build said rail area, we are at pretty low unemployment and it's unlikely those unemployed now are going to have the skills to build it, back to immigration which Labour wants to strong curtail.

 

 


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Ultimate Geek
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  # 1981469 22-Mar-2018 13:25
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networkn:

Rikkitic:


I also see no problem with the idea of a train service. Actually, this is what many other countries do. I would love to see trains connecting the regions. The more public transport, the better. Whether it is affordable or not, I do not know, but the idea is not ridiculous.


 



Whether it ridiculous would almost entirely depend on cost surely? If it cost, let's say.. $4B (and to be honest considering much smaller patches of road cost as much if not more it seems unlikely it would be such a small number), it would be better for the Government (purely financially and excluding environmental impacts etc etc) to PAY Air NZ to run those services in order to cover their losses to service the area.  In reality it would be MUCH MUCH higher cost I would imagine (I don't have any numbers so I can't give a ballpark). 


I love the idea of an Electric train, but practically, it's somewhat unlikely to occur. I can't recall what the Government estimated it would cost to build our MUCH needed rail to the Auckland airport from the city? Any know? 


 


Also worth taking into account, who would build said rail area, we are at pretty low unemployment and it's unlikely those unemployed now are going to have the skills to build it, back to immigration which Labour wants to strong curtail.


 



Public transport needs population, not just to build it, but also to use it. There's a handful of cities in NZ that could actually sustain a city rail service, which is what is needed first, otherwise when these travellers arrive in the city they have no way of getting around. So that will be x billion first. Then the cost of building a high speed (in excess of 400kph) rail link (say from kapiti to Auckland) would be many billions. Admittedly it could service Levin, Palmerston, Taupo, Rotorua and Hamilton. I don't think the business case would stack up very well.

Transmission gully is costing $3 billion by comparison. If we estimate a good rail corridor to be about a 1/4 cost per km of a four lane highway, then it would equates to $27 million per km of rail. Or total cost for a 550km link to Auckland of $14 billion, not including train stations, or the cost of trains/rolling stock themselves.

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  # 1981471 22-Mar-2018 13:33
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rjt123: A rail link would have it's place for a select few City to city connections maybe. Hamilton-auckland, whangarei-Auckland.
Anywhere else the infrastructural cost would be prohibitive.

I would love a good rail connection between New Plymouth and Wellington or Auckland, but they would have to be high speed, journey time of less than 2 hours. Which isn't going to happen, or be worthwhile until NZ has a population similar to UK.


I'd love them to run the existing Wellington to Auckland service as an overnight sleeper with proper sleepers.

Board at 7pm and dine in the restaurant car, retire and then wake up right in the CBD.

I'd take that every time over flying.





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