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  # 2013972 11-May-2018 12:01
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networkn:

 

If you don't laugh you cry. Today Twyford announces that the cost of his Kiwibuild 1 Bedroom homes, are going to be $50,000 more than promised during the election! 

 

Justification from Twyford was that the numbers were done 2 years ago! Collins eviscerated him over it. As she should. 

 

This is just hopeless. I am back to being massively angry.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is from Newshub

 

 

 

"Mr Twyford promised the $2 billion earmarked for KiwiBuild would be spent many times over, on Friday saying it would be around 20 times, as it recouped costs from buyers. Homes will be sold for exactly what the Government paid for them, with no margin."

 

 

 

I'd like Mr Twyford to explain why the taxpayers and homeowners of NZ should receive no compensation for the interest free loan of their capital to build houses. Should we not at least be entitled to OCR interest on our funds? 

 

 






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  # 2013974 11-May-2018 12:04
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Geektastic:

 

 

 

This is from Newshub

 

 

 

"Mr Twyford promised the $2 billion earmarked for KiwiBuild would be spent many times over, on Friday saying it would be around 20 times, as it recouped costs from buyers. Homes will be sold for exactly what the Government paid for them, with no margin."

 

 

 

I'd like Mr Twyford to explain why the taxpayers and homeowners of NZ should receive no compensation for the interest free loan of their capital to build houses. Should we not at least be entitled to OCR interest on our funds? 

 

 

 

 

Well, this is the "taxpayers contribution" to the Kiwibuild program. I forsee it costing more and achieving less and I suspect years from now will be one of the biggest failures of central Government in recent times. 

 

Don't forget that the 18 houses already "built" by Kiwibuild, was in fact built and paid for under National and bought and paid for again under Labour and rebranded. I am told by a source, at a loss to the NZ Taxpayer.

 

 


 
 
 
 


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  # 2014042 11-May-2018 13:44
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networkn:

 

Geektastic:

 

 

 

This is from Newshub

 

 

 

"Mr Twyford promised the $2 billion earmarked for KiwiBuild would be spent many times over, on Friday saying it would be around 20 times, as it recouped costs from buyers. Homes will be sold for exactly what the Government paid for them, with no margin."

 

 

 

I'd like Mr Twyford to explain why the taxpayers and homeowners of NZ should receive no compensation for the interest free loan of their capital to build houses. Should we not at least be entitled to OCR interest on our funds? 

 

 

 

 

Well, this is the "taxpayers contribution" to the Kiwibuild program. I forsee it costing more and achieving less and I suspect years from now will be one of the biggest failures of central Government in recent times. 

 

Don't forget that the 18 houses already "built" by Kiwibuild, was in fact built and paid for under National and bought and paid for again under Labour and rebranded. I am told by a source, at a loss to the NZ Taxpayer.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I do not see why the taxpayers should not get any return for their contribution. These houses are not being retained as ongoing stock for Housing NZ - they are being sold into the private market at cost, subsidised by many people who will never own one. Expecting at least a minimum return for that subsidy hardly seems unreasonable.






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  # 2014051 11-May-2018 13:50
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Geektastic:

 

I do not see why the taxpayers should not get any return for their contribution. These houses are not being retained as ongoing stock for Housing NZ - they are being sold into the private market at cost, subsidised by many people who will never own one. Expecting at least a minimum return for that subsidy hardly seems unreasonable.

 

 

Hi. 

 

Yes, I can see where you are going with that. Considering everything else, I think you'd have better hope of pushing jelly up hill with a pitchfork though.


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  # 2014103 11-May-2018 14:48
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networkn:

 

Geektastic:

 

I do not see why the taxpayers should not get any return for their contribution. These houses are not being retained as ongoing stock for Housing NZ - they are being sold into the private market at cost, subsidised by many people who will never own one. Expecting at least a minimum return for that subsidy hardly seems unreasonable.

 

 

Hi. 

 

Yes, I can see where you are going with that. Considering everything else, I think you'd have better hope of pushing jelly up hill with a pitchfork though.

 

 

 

 

I'd be selling them with a 10% clawback on profit for the first sale.

 

 

 

Imagine they buy one at $500k then sell it in 10 years for $1 million...all courtesy of free money from the taxpayer. Talk about wealth transfer.






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  # 2014114 11-May-2018 14:54
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Geektastic:

 

Talk about wealth transfer.

 

 

Isn't it the entire manifesto of the Labour Government going back since it's inception?

 

Despite all the talking up of enabling people, they spend the majority of their time disabling peoples ability to help themselves IME.

 

There have been some exceptions I'll admit.

 

 


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  # 2014117 11-May-2018 14:56
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Now talking to someone about the student loans the other day, he was adamant that you only get funding for this IF you pass your exams with at least 80%. I have not heard of this, and this is a fundamental reason for my concern around the program they introduced. 

 

I can't see anything about that in the documentation or policy announcements I saw, does anyone else have information regarding this?

 

 


 
 
 
 


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  # 2014130 11-May-2018 15:09
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Geektastic:

 

networkn:

 

Geektastic:

 

I do not see why the taxpayers should not get any return for their contribution. These houses are not being retained as ongoing stock for Housing NZ - they are being sold into the private market at cost, subsidised by many people who will never own one. Expecting at least a minimum return for that subsidy hardly seems unreasonable.

 

 

Hi. 

 

Yes, I can see where you are going with that. Considering everything else, I think you'd have better hope of pushing jelly up hill with a pitchfork though.

 

 

 

 

I'd be selling them with a 10% clawback on profit for the first sale.

 

 

 

Imagine they buy one at $500k then sell it in 10 years for $1 million...all courtesy of free money from the taxpayer. Talk about wealth transfer.

 

 

I would at least hope there is some caveat about on-sale. But to demonstrate any inclination of 'business sense' would be rather uncharacteristic of this government. Unfortunately.

 

 


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  # 2014131 11-May-2018 15:13
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networkn:

 

Now talking to someone about the student loans the other day, he was adamant that you only get funding for this IF you pass your exams with at least 80%. I have not heard of this, and this is a fundamental reason for my concern around the program they introduced. 

 

I can't see anything about that in the documentation or policy announcements I saw, does anyone else have information regarding this?

 

 

 

 

https://www.studylink.govt.nz/return-to-study/pass-course/did-not-pass.html#null

 

I don't know where the "80%" comes from, for some assessments then 50% is a pass, others you might need 100%.  The rationale for the latter is self-evident - if you were teaching someone to tighten jesus nuts on helicopters etc.


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  # 2014134 11-May-2018 15:16
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networkn:

 

Now talking to someone about the student loans the other day, he was adamant that you only get funding for this IF you pass your exams with at least 80%. I have not heard of this, and this is a fundamental reason for my concern around the program they introduced. 

 

I can't see anything about that in the documentation or policy announcements I saw, does anyone else have information regarding this?

 

 

 

 

As I understand it, you don't even pay your fees, the government pays them outright to the provider, so if you failed your course they would have to claw back that money, which would be a logistical and administrative nightmare.

 

 


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  # 2014139 11-May-2018 15:22
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rjt123:

 

I would at least hope there is some caveat about on-sale. But to demonstrate any inclination of 'business sense' would be rather uncharacteristic of this government. Unfortunately.

 

 

There was some talk of ensuring each Kiwibuild property was kept for a specific time, but I cannot find any hard documentation on the kiwibuild or mbie sites. I see some commentary about it. 

 

The commentary also said there was nothing in the fact sheet (I can't find it) around preventing these from being rented out, or limiting someone who buys a kiwibuild from buying another home! I am sure they must have provisions to cover it. 

 

 

 

 


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  # 2014140 11-May-2018 15:24
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Fred99:

 

https://www.studylink.govt.nz/return-to-study/pass-course/did-not-pass.html#null

 

I don't know where the "80%" comes from, for some assessments then 50% is a pass, others you might need 100%.  The rationale for the latter is self-evident - if you were teaching someone to tighten jesus nuts on helicopters etc.

 

 

Studylink is student loans - not fees-free study. More info can be founds on the feesfree.govt.nz site.

 

But you're right about the 80%, not every course has % grading, and if they do 80% is a pretty high threshold. I think a pass would be sufficient, as this policy is aimed at the less academically minded.


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  # 2014142 11-May-2018 15:25
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I wasn't going to post in this thread again but I have decided to post this given that some have claimed that I don't expand upon my views. There will be mistakes as it takes a long time to type one handed.

 

 

 

This is my feelings regarding the housing “crisis” this is not meant to provide a solution but some of my own thoughts. When looking at this I provide a number of key factors.

 

1. The Government should not own or build houses.
2. Everyone deserves an opportunity to own their own home.
3. Not everyone will own their own home.
4. Housing should be provided by private enterprise be it for ownership or rental.
5. The Government role is facilitation and enabling.

 

So on that my thoughts are the Government while it sounds warm and fuzzy to do, should not build and own housing especially for social housing. This ends up, as it has in the past, creating social disaster zones like Canons Creek, Flaxmere to list two. This may ease housing issues in the short term but creates a nightmare down the track that other Government agencies and private agencies have to try and fix.

 

Everyone deserves the opportunity to own their own home the reality is not everyone can or should. It is probably something no Government will ever admit to but for some it is out of their means financially and or abilities. That said I believe it is a basic human right to have warm, dry suitably sized housing. This either by purchase or rental and this housing should be well built and comply with WHO standards. This housing should be provided by private enterprise as Government is not and should not be in the business of housing.

 

New housing developments should include a mix of self owned and rental homes that are not discernible by outward appearance. I believe this will go along way to stopping the development of social disasters like Canons Creek and Flaxmere.

 

The Governments role in this should be as facilitator and enabler by making sure we have good legislation that not only protects all parties it provides an effective catalyst to developing good homes and good living environments for all New Zealanders.
Just like the Government is not a business private enterprises are not social support agencies. Therefore a further role of Government is the provision of financial housing assistance by way of rental or mortgage subsidy to those who meet and continue to meet the qualifying criteria.
The Government could by way of underwriting marginal mortgages to first home buyers or provision of term loans to developers to enable the building and purchase of homes for New Zealanders.

 

As a final thought I feel even the long term implications of the current housing problem the political parties need to drop the divide of party policy and take a bipartisan approach and also engage private enterprise and social agencies to work towards a sustainable housing environment for all New Zealanders.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

There is no planet B

 

 


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  # 2014143 11-May-2018 15:26
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networkn:

 

... I am sure they must have provisions to cover it. 

 

 

 

 

Don't be too sure, it's not you're average government you're dealing with!!! Be prepared to be surprised, alarmed and enraged!


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  # 2014146 11-May-2018 15:29
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rjt123:

 

Fred99:

 

https://www.studylink.govt.nz/return-to-study/pass-course/did-not-pass.html#null

 

I don't know where the "80%" comes from, for some assessments then 50% is a pass, others you might need 100%.  The rationale for the latter is self-evident - if you were teaching someone to tighten jesus nuts on helicopters etc.

 

 

Studylink is student loans - not fees-free study. More info can be founds on the feesfree.govt.nz site.

 

But you're right about the 80%, not every course has % grading, and if they do 80% is a pretty high threshold. I think a pass would be sufficient, as this policy is aimed at the less academically minded.

 

 

Yes I know that's about student loans - that was actually what the OP asked about. :-)


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