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1220 posts

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  #1960639 19-Feb-2018 22:50
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Pumpedd:

 

networkn:

 

 

Our old white female wasn't exactly the answer for NZ. So maybe it's the age not the gender.

 

Eww Clark, agreed, terrible. Well, we had a couple of younger white ones too.

 

 

 

My personal opinion is that Nationals Keys to winning the next election: 

 

1) Become more friendly to the environment, show they can balance a focus on financial responsibility and eco responsibility.

 

 

Even better, say you are going to do something about the environment, but don't actually do anything.

 

This way you won't alienate your base - farmers.

 

 

2) Show the same financial knowledge and competency as before

 

 

Dear god no.

 

We now know the rock star economy was actually a local covers band economy.

 

It was funded by flooding the country with migrants and neglecting to spend on the infrastructure needed by a growing population.

 

This is typical of people schooled in the mba style - always thinking of the next quarter's results instead of having a long term view.

 

 

3) Strong constructively attack JA and Labour on their failure to deliver on election promises, and watering down of the promises they made.

 

4) Point out areas where Labour policies have not delivered. 

 

 

 

I think this will get some of the Greens vote, and Labour Vote. All things being aligned Winston may be gone, and National can appeal to NZF and potentially Maori Party.

 

 

 

 

There was also some social responsibility they got wrong and English actually admitted to it several times. There does need to be some trickle down when things have been as good as they were/are.

 

 

We await the crumbs from master's table.

 

Sorry my attempt to intersperse comments failed - apols for misattributed quotes.


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  #1960642 19-Feb-2018 23:02
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networkn:

 

Labours undoing were their own actions. The Anti Smacking repeal was probably the last straw but they became impossibly arrogant. I know people felt controlled. Many people felt that Clark thought she knew better than them how to raise a family. 

 

 

It was a Green party bill, and passed with support (113 to 8 against) from most of the National Party, including future PM Key - and hasn't been revisited by anyone since, except extremists who would have preferred to continue to legally allow sadistic scum to beat children with rubber hoses and riding whips, under the guise of that being "reasonable force".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


 
 
 
 


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  #1960678 19-Feb-2018 23:59
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Fred99:

 

networkn:

 

Labours undoing were their own actions. The Anti Smacking repeal was probably the last straw but they became impossibly arrogant. I know people felt controlled. Many people felt that Clark thought she knew better than them how to raise a family. 

 

 

It was a Green party bill, and passed with support (113 to 8 against) from most of the National Party, including future PM Key - and hasn't been revisited by anyone since, except extremists who would have preferred to continue to legally allow sadistic scum to beat children with rubber hoses and riding whips, under the guise of that being "reasonable force".

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh, give me a break! Not everyone (in fact the tiniest percentage) of people who discipline thier kids, does so out of sadistic enjoyment using those items or anything like it. 

 

The issue is that the people who actually do that, don't give a sh!t about the consequences, they do so under rage, out of control and no legal ramifications will resolve it. They don't consider going to prison before they beat thier kids to death, it happens regardless of those consequences. The regret, usually of the consequences comes long after. 


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  #1960693 20-Feb-2018 06:20
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Fred99:

rjt123:
Rikkitic:


Experience and qualifications, yes, but I don't think the revolt against older white males is just frizzy doo-dah. Older white males have had it their way for years, for centuries, for ever since Hera got pushed aside for Zeus. They have had their run. They haven't exactly fixed the world's problems. Maybe people just want to try something else to see if it might be better. 




Our old white female wasn't exactly the answer for NZ. So maybe it's the age not the gender.


Nice attempt to rewrite history.


She had similar public popularity to John Key at their peaks.  A frequent criticism of Clark was that she was for "Nanny State" and from "Helengrad", believers in which myths should perhaps list the great undoing of Clark's legacy by the subsequent Key government.


Don't think I'm being partisan, I'd actually defend even Muldoon from many accusations made with hindsight, for most of his time he was implementing policy that was popular and usually quite orthodox - from a global POV.


Not sure what haters would have wished Clark to do - follow on / expand from Roger Douglas, or send our young people to invade Iraq perhaps.


 



It's well known, even if not well accepted that Helen held some extreme socialist (I'm not sure if that's the perfect descriptor) views, particularly around family and moral values.

Her social legacy, depending on individual values and beliefs, was either outrageous or courageous (I'd pick the first). But the rest of her reigime was dreadful, and resulted in her being ignonimously booted out of Parliament.

The great undoing of Clark's legacy happened in the challenging years of 08 onwards when we realized it was a legacy we'd rather forget - economically it's called a recession.

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  #1960699 20-Feb-2018 07:35
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networkn:

 

Oh, give me a break! Not everyone (in fact the tiniest percentage) of people who discipline thier kids, does so out of sadistic enjoyment using those items or anything like it. 

 

The issue is that the people who actually do that, don't give a sh!t about the consequences, they do so under rage, out of control and no legal ramifications will resolve it. They don't consider going to prison before they beat thier kids to death, it happens regardless of those consequences. The regret, usually of the consequences comes long after. 

 

 

Not "discipline". It's unnecessary to deliberately inflict physical pain in order to discipline your kids.  Your comment suggests that you believe otherwise.


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  #1960700 20-Feb-2018 07:36
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Steven Joyce announces he's a candidate.

Anyone know who were the mps standing behind Adams at her announcement?

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  #1960701 20-Feb-2018 07:40
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rjt123:

The great undoing of Clark's legacy happened in the challenging years of 08 onwards when we realized it was a legacy we'd rather forget - economically it's called a recession.

 

ROFL.  So HC caused the GFC?  How did she manage that? The government books actually looked pretty good - in fact better than they do now in terms of debt/preparedness for GFCII, if that was to happen (possible).


 
 
 
 


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  #1960704 20-Feb-2018 08:08
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Fred99:

 

networkn:

 

Oh, give me a break! Not everyone (in fact the tiniest percentage) of people who discipline thier kids, does so out of sadistic enjoyment using those items or anything like it. 

 

The issue is that the people who actually do that, don't give a sh!t about the consequences, they do so under rage, out of control and no legal ramifications will resolve it. They don't consider going to prison before they beat thier kids to death, it happens regardless of those consequences. The regret, usually of the consequences comes long after. 

 

 

Not "discipline". It's unnecessary to deliberately inflict physical pain in order to discipline your kids.  Your comment suggests that you believe otherwise.

 

 

That's correct. I do not believe it is necessary to beat your children under any circumstances. 

 

 


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  #1960731 20-Feb-2018 08:34
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networkn:

 

That's correct. I do not believe it is necessary to beat your children under any circumstances. 

 

 

But how else do I, a six foot two man who weighs nigh on 100kgs, show a toddler who the boss is? 


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  #1960746 20-Feb-2018 09:17
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GV27:

 

networkn:

 

That's correct. I do not believe it is necessary to beat your children under any circumstances. 

 

 

But how else do I, a six foot two man who weighs nigh on 100kgs, show a toddler who the boss is? 

 

 

Look frightened, point to the photo of the Mrs you keep in your wallet.


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  #1960750 20-Feb-2018 09:28
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Heh. Let's kind of stay in the region of on topic, if you want to discuss the pros and cons of parenting methods, start a new thread. 

 

 


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  #1960758 20-Feb-2018 09:35
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I am a little surprised that Joyce joined the race. 

 

I presume if he made PM, he would not hold the finance role, wonder who it then falls to.

 

 


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  #1960760 20-Feb-2018 09:43
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Fred99:

 

networkn:

 

Labours undoing were their own actions. The Anti Smacking repeal was probably the last straw but they became impossibly arrogant. I know people felt controlled. Many people felt that Clark thought she knew better than them how to raise a family. 

 

 

It was a Green party bill, and passed with support (113 to 8 against) from most of the National Party, including future PM Key - and hasn't been revisited by anyone since, except extremists who would have preferred to continue to legally allow sadistic scum to beat children with rubber hoses and riding whips, under the guise of that being "reasonable force".

 

 

JK actually saved that bill by working with Helen Clark to agree a compromise to the wording.  This allowed him in one stroke to look prime-ministerial and force Clark to publicly eat some humble pie with a side of Crow.

 

I note that brutal people continue to brutalise the children in their lives, despite the law.





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  #1960764 20-Feb-2018 09:51
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People often look at this kind of thing in a literal way only. Even if this law has little practical value, I think it has important moral value by declaring a clear line. It says that hitting children is wrong. That is a point worth making.

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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  #1960791 20-Feb-2018 10:46
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networkn:

 

I am a little surprised that Joyce joined the race. 

 

I presume if he made PM, he would not hold the finance role, wonder who it then falls to.

 

 

 

 

I am very surprised as he is doesnt come across as modern. Surprised Hoskings supports him....


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