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#2144596 13-Dec-2018 07:38

GV27:

6FIEND:

No changes to the RMA
No changes to free up land for urban development

They are preparing to give the Housing authority the power to overrule councils, grant their own consents and deviate from urban planning restrictions. It is kind of happening, but it should have been on day one, and not day 365 + whatever.

I agree. RMA has been a huge problem for a long time. The last Govt could have, but didnt. In 3265 days they made small changes to what was already known to be a large problem. As per my above it, UF locked them out later, but they did make some changes, but nothing significant. It appears they were reluctant to go further. Again. here we are. Long standing problem not dealt with.

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Rikkitic

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#2144603 13-Dec-2018 07:56

networkn:

This is one of the first real tests of her abilities as PM. I will be watching this with interest, but anything less than diverting this would be a massive fail to my mind.

I would like to interject a note, since no-one else here probably will, that after JA urged the parties to come together, they did, and the strike has been averted. How much - if any - credit she deserves for this I do not know but the facts are she did speak and the strike didn't happen.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

tdgeek

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#2144608 13-Dec-2018 08:09

Rikkitic:

networkn:

This is one of the first real tests of her abilities as PM. I will be watching this with interest, but anything less than diverting this would be a massive fail to my mind.

I would like to interject a note, since no-one else here probably will, that after JA urged the parties to come together, they did, and the strike has been averted. How much - if any - credit she deserves for this I do not know but the facts are she did speak and the strike didn't happen.

No they won't.

"When asked if a prime minister should be involved in the issue, Ms Ardern said she had done what she could do "for now" and "conveyed my strong desire that they find a resolution in mediation."

Seems to imply that she possibly did have a legal or other enforceable option. Or maybe would apply more pressure later. In any case, she has prodded both parties, and its sorted.

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#2144615 13-Dec-2018 08:32

It is excellent that common sense has prevailed and the threat of strike is currently lifted but I wonder how much if any real influence the Government had on the decision. I suspect very little.

tdgeek

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#2144619 13-Dec-2018 08:42

MikeB4:

It is excellent that common sense has prevailed and the threat of strike is currently lifted but I wonder how much if any real influence the Government had on the decision. I suspect very little.

Suspect, or being a National supporter, hope?

I dont know, but she spoke publically that she wants both parties to work together to solve this, that will be her involvement "for now" She is close to Unions and Luxon.

networkn

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#2144634 13-Dec-2018 09:07

Rikkitic:

networkn:

This is one of the first real tests of her abilities as PM. I will be watching this with interest, but anything less than diverting this would be a massive fail to my mind.

I would like to interject a note, since no-one else here probably will, that after JA urged the parties to come together, they did, and the strike has been averted. How much - if any - credit she deserves for this I do not know but the facts are she did speak and the strike didn't happen.

If she played a part then she has done her job. Well done.

I guess we will never know how much she was involved, but for my money she had to come out strongly against it publically.

Reds will be inclined to believe she was the sole reason it was resolved, and Blues will be inclined to believe her input was minimal and both parties originally involved agreed that striking over xmas was a stupid thing to do and worked to a solution.

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#2144664 13-Dec-2018 09:56

tdgeek:

I dont know, but she spoke publically that she wants both parties to work together to solve this, that will be her involvement "for now" She is close to Unions and Luxon.

The law requires the parties to do that and her thoughts echoed what travellers would be thinking "just sort it out" etc. Chances are she knew from union sources and/or AirNZ CEO, that a deal was close and pounced on the opportunity to be seen as empathetic and influential.

Mike

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#2144667 13-Dec-2018 10:05

MikeAqua:

tdgeek:

I dont know, but she spoke publically that she wants both parties to work together to solve this, that will be her involvement "for now" She is close to Unions and Luxon.

The law requires the parties to do that and her thoughts echoed what travellers would be thinking "just sort it out" etc. Chances are she knew from union sources and/or AirNZ CEO, that a deal was close and pounced on the opportunity to be seen as empathetic and influential.

LOL yeah ok....

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#2144670 13-Dec-2018 10:11

MikeAqua:

The law requires the parties to do that and her thoughts echoed what travellers would be thinking "just sort it out" etc. Chances are she knew from union sources and/or AirNZ CEO, that a deal was close and pounced on the opportunity to be seen as empathetic and influential.

Aw c'mon Mike, give her some credit. This is just mean-spirited, and right before Christmas, too.

On a more serious note, what the PM says carries a lot more weight, or 'moral influence', if you prefer, than the average citizen. What she says matters. Even if it is just the same thing that everyone else is saying. The fact that she says it makes a difference.

A sign of good political judgement is starting out with a softly softly approach, not going in with all guns blazing that is just going to get backs up. I'm sure if her 'wish' had been ignored, there would have been a more forceful follow-up. I think she did well, not that I expect many on this thread to credit her with that.

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tdgeek

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#2144683 13-Dec-2018 10:22

MikeAqua:

tdgeek:

I dont know, but she spoke publically that she wants both parties to work together to solve this, that will be her involvement "for now" She is close to Unions and Luxon.

The law requires the parties to do that and her thoughts echoed what travellers would be thinking "just sort it out" etc. Chances are she knew from union sources and/or AirNZ CEO, that a deal was close and pounced on the opportunity to be seen as empathetic and influential.

That is quite obvious. Now that its over, there were 3 days negotiations that has lead to a settlement. How long has this been going on for and how much time has Air NZ invested in negotiations? SFA. They have exceeded that just now, and turned up for once. Thats a far cry from The law requires the parties to do that. And finally, both parties to work together to solve this

GV27

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#2144698 13-Dec-2018 10:44

tdgeek:

MikeAqua:

tdgeek:

I dont know, but she spoke publically that she wants both parties to work together to solve this, that will be her involvement "for now" She is close to Unions and Luxon.

The law requires the parties to do that and her thoughts echoed what travellers would be thinking "just sort it out" etc. Chances are she knew from union sources and/or AirNZ CEO, that a deal was close and pounced on the opportunity to be seen as empathetic and influential.

That is quite obvious. Now that its over, there were 3 days negotiations that has lead to a settlement. How long has this been going on for and how much time has Air NZ invested in negotiations? SFA. They have exceeded that just now, and turned up for once. Thats a far cry from The law requires the parties to do that. And finally, both parties to work together to solve this

My understanding is that these negotiations had only been going for six week before strikes were announced. For that reason I am still unsympathetic to the union (that and there seems to be this perception that "working overtime doesn't count towards remuneration" when plenty of salaried workers end up working overtime and get nothing for it). However they did get a result so more power to them, and I was disappointed to hear RNZ trying to shoehorn details out of the rep before the members had even seen the deal.

networkn

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#2144700 13-Dec-2018 10:48

tdgeek:

That is quite obvious. Now that its over, there were 3 days negotiations that has lead to a settlement. How long has this been going on for and how much time has Air NZ invested in negotiations? SFA. They have exceeded that just now, and turned up for once. Thats a far cry from The law requires the parties to do that. And finally, both parties to work together to solve this

No way would you allow someone else to make these comments without an "assumptions posted as facts" accusation.

Where is your evidence that Air NZ did SFA? Or "they turned up for once".

They have a business to run. Just because staff WANT a payrise, doesn't mean the company is obliged to give them one. They are a commercial operation and should negotiate in good faith.

tdgeek

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#2144707 13-Dec-2018 11:24

networkn:

tdgeek:

That is quite obvious. Now that its over, there were 3 days negotiations that has lead to a settlement. How long has this been going on for and how much time has Air NZ invested in negotiations? SFA. They have exceeded that just now, and turned up for once. Thats a far cry from The law requires the parties to do that. And finally, both parties to work together to solve this

No way would you allow someone else to make these comments without an "assumptions posted as facts" accusation.

Where is your evidence that Air NZ did SFA? Or "they turned up for once".

They have a business to run. Just because staff WANT a payrise, doesn't mean the company is obliged to give them one. They are a commercial operation and should negotiate in good faith.

Its in the other thread, as well as the news, its no secret. If you wish to take the tact that its just we want more money, thats fine, the usual response. You are aware that AirNZ mislead as regards the average salary? And the volunteer days they are expected to work for free? And of the 6 weeks negotiations they turned up late or not at all? That is was a 1 day strike, then Air NZ talked and it ended up as 3? As with the other strikes its about resource as well. Being stripped of conditions to meet AirNZ cost targets, which are now about $40 million for next year. Its far from we JUST WANT more money. Increase workload, maintain same staff and so on

They should operate in good faith, but have not. More work same staff only goes so far. Same goes for teachers and healthcare where your response is similar. It gets reduced back to we want more money and ignore all the aspects form both sides. Believe it or not, while the unions are in general ratbags, sometimes the employees are actually in the right. But that gets in the way of a good bashing

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#2144709 13-Dec-2018 11:30

As usual its the same old political drama from those that are married for life to their party, no matter what. Defend defend defend, and choose not to look at everything in case it doesn't suit. Its a pity as some here from both sides can in fact discuss without getting angry. I'm out, let the 2 inch thick rose coloured glasses satisfy there needs here as usual

networkn

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#2144724 13-Dec-2018 11:41

tdgeek:

As usual its the same old political drama from those that are married for life to their party, no matter what. Defend defend defend, and choose not to look at everything in case it doesn't suit. Its a pity as some here from both sides can in fact discuss without getting angry. I'm out, let the 2 inch thick rose coloured glasses satisfy there needs here as usual

Pot, Kettle, Black. You'll do your usual "I'm a swing voter" thing, but the evidence overwhemingly shows you are just as married to your choices and "defend defend defend" as anyone else here.

The Air NZ thing isn't a National vs Labour thing in the first place.

Your viewpoint on most issues is just as set in concrete as you would accuse anyone else here of being.

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