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Lock him up!
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  # 2318901 17-Sep-2019 08:32
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I think you are using flawed logic here. When the consequence of a vote is a major, fundamental, life-changing decision that will seriously affect every aspect of society, then you need a convincing majority to make it acceptable to most of the population. A majority of one on a 50-50 split is not good form. 

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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  # 2318928 17-Sep-2019 09:11
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Rikkitic:

 

I think you are using flawed logic here. When the consequence of a vote is a major, fundamental, life-changing decision that will seriously affect every aspect of society, then you need a convincing majority to make it acceptable to most of the population. A majority of one on a 50-50 split is not good form. 

 

 

Yet it's how you select a government, and again, parliament is supreme. Look at the Scottish independence vote: a 50/50 majority was fine there, yet suddenly the Brexit threshold should have been higher? 


 
 
 
 


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  # 2318929 17-Sep-2019 09:11
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Rikkitic:

 

I think you are using flawed logic here.

 

When the consequence of a vote is a major, fundamental, life-changing decision that will seriously affect every aspect of society, then you need a convincing majority to make it acceptable to most of the population.

 

A majority of one on a 50-50 split is not good form. 

 



 

As above. 

 

Some choices are reversible, and some are not.  😐

 

EDIT

 

Here is the result of the 2016 Referendum:

 

 

 

 

The United Kingdom was NOT united here.

 

Notably, Scotland and Northern Ireland voted strongly to remain.

 

London also voted to remain, in contrast to the rest of England.

 

Should the English vote outrank the Scottish or Irish vote?





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  # 2319082 17-Sep-2019 11:35
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This is starting to sound like a cracked record.

 

We have covered the topic of the fairness or otherwise of referendum results endlessly.




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  # 2319266 17-Sep-2019 15:50
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UK Supreme Court hears cases that PM Johnson's parliament suspension was illegal

Reuters by Michael Holden

Prime Minister Boris Johnson’s government will seek to persuade Britain’s top court this week that his decision to suspend parliament until shortly before the date for Brexit was not illegal as Scottish judges concluded last week.

...In a damning judgement, Scotland’s highest court ruled last Wednesday that the suspension was unlawful and was an “egregious” attempt to stymie parliament.

However, a week earlier the High Court of England and Wales rejected a similar case, saying the matter was political and not one for judicial interference.

Both cases are now going before the Supreme Court, the highest judicial body in the United Kingdom, and its 11 judges will give a final ruling on whether Johnson’s advice to the queen was illegal.

Supporters of the legal challenges, a mixture of anti-Brexit campaigners and opposition lawmakers, want parliament to be immediately recalled if the court backs them. Critics also say that if judges decide Johnson misled the monarch, then he must resign.
...

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-court/uk-supreme-court-hears-cases-that-pm-johnsons-parliament-suspension-was-illegal-idUSKBN1W12VR





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  # 2319303 17-Sep-2019 16:45
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The Times - Brexit: Supreme Court ruling could spoil Boris Johnson’s debut at UN

 

September 17 2019, 12:01am

 


The prime minister is preparing for a potentially embarrassing ruling on the legality of his parliamentary shutdown just as he takes to the world stage at the United Nations.

 

Today the Supreme Court begins hearing appeals on the five-week prorogation of parliament, which Scotland’s highest court ruled last week was unlawful because it was a ruse to dodge scrutiny by MPs.

 

The former prime minister Sir John Major will urge the court to rule that Boris Johnson acted outside the law. 

 

A judgment is expected early next week, potentially complicating Mr Johnson’s first trip to the UN general assembly in New York where he is aiming to win other world leaders round to his approach to Brexit. ...

 





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  # 2319694 18-Sep-2019 12:02
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A high-stakes Brexit court case could force the Queen to pick a side

CNN by Max Foster, CNN

...Historians are yet to find an example of any Prime Minister being found guilty of misleading a monarch.

"The government must obey the law," said Vernon Bogdanor, research professor at King's College London and the author of "Beyond Brexit: Towards a British Constitution."

"If the law is that Parliament cannot be prorogued, then it must be recalled, and the advice to the Queen rescinded. If the PM breaks the law, then he will be prosecuted and brought before the courts just like any other citizen," Bogdanor explained.

Boris Johnson says he didn't lie to the Queen over suspension of Parliament

A ruling against the government would leave Johnson with the unpalatable choice of being hauled up before a judge or going back to the Queen and asking her to overturn his previous advice.

Embarrassing for the Prime Minister, it would be uncomfortable for the Queen too. The monarch does everything she can to avoid the political process beyond her ceremonial duties.

Unlike her counterparts in other constitutional monarchies like Denmark and Belgium, she doesn't even see a role for herself in mediating between political parties when they reach an impasse....
...
https://edition.cnn.com/2019/09/17/uk/queen-elizabeth-brexit-intl-gbr/index.html

UK 'keeping hold of Brexit proposals to avoid EU leaks'

Sky By Alan McGuinness

A government source says the UK is "showing them [the EU] the papers", but "the difference is we are not leaving them with them".

The UK has put forward ideas to end the Brexit impasse, but is stopping Brussels from keeping hold of written details due to fears the proposals will be leaked, it is understood.

As the clock ticks down to exit day on 31 October, the EU has so far said that no "concrete" proposals to replace the Irish backstop have been forthcoming.

However, British sources cited by the Press Association have insisted that papers setting out Prime Minister Boris Johnson's position have been shown to the European Union, even though they were taken back at the end of meetings.
...
https://news.sky.com/story/uk-keeping-hold-of-brexit-proposals-to-avoid-eu-leaks-11812396

 
 
 
 


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  # 2320977 20-Sep-2019 09:42
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BBC News - Supreme Court: Ex-PM's lawyer argues against prorogation

 

today

 


Boris Johnson suspended Parliament to stop MPs "interfering" in Brexit, said the lawyer of former PM Sir John Major.

 

The three-day Supreme Court hearing on whether the decision to prorogue was unlawful has finished its final day.

 

The President of the Supreme Court, Lady Hale, said the justices would announce a decision early next week.

 

The government argues prorogation is not a matter for the courts, but critics say the PM is trying to stop MPs scrutinising Brexit policy. ...

 



 

Through the looking glass

 

BBC Legal affairs correspondent

 


We have a prime minister who stands accused of misleading the monarch and undermining Parliament.

 

Coming to assist the case against the current prime minister, the former Conservative Prime Minister Sir John Major.

 

In very bald and strong terms he is accusing Boris Johnson of having misled the Queen and suggesting his true purpose was entirely political, in the sense that he wished to shut down debate in Parliament.

 

There was much criticism that there hasn't been a witness statement from the government setting out the true reasons for prorogation.

 

Sir John's lawyer Lord Garnier said the ex-prime minister did not "believe the documents given to the court provide the true reason for prorogation" and that "it would be justifiable for the court to infer his true intentions".

 

He is basically saying: "Look at the evidence. It is extraordinarily sketchy. Draw your own conclusion." ...

 





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  # 2323154 23-Sep-2019 08:51
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BBC News - Boris Johnson 'must address conflict of interest claims'

 

today

 


Labour has urged Boris Johnson to address claims he failed to declare a potential conflict of interest in how money was given to a US businesswoman while he was London mayor.

 

The Sunday Times said Jennifer Arcuri, an entrepreneur associated with Mr Johnson, joined trade missions he led and was given £126,000 in public money.

 

She told the paper this was part of her role as a legitimate businesswoman.

 

No 10 declined to comment. A government department says it is investigating. ...

 

Call for disclosure

 

Jon Trickett, [Labour] shadow minister for the Cabinet Office, said Mr Johnson should provide full disclosure on the allegations.

 

"The public has a right to know how and why these funds were used for the benefit of a close* personal friend without on the face of it legitimate reason.

 

"This cannot be swept under the carpet. It is a matter of the integrity of the man now leading our country, who appears to believe he can get away with anything." ...

 

 

* very close

 

[Donald Trump is obviously not the only politician "who appears to believe he can get away with anything."]

 

 

 

EDIT

 

 

Jennifer Arcuri modelling

 

 

Arcuri demonstrates the dancing pole in her London flat, where Johnson visited her  (The Times)





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  # 2324216 24-Sep-2019 21:51
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BREAKING

 

The Supreme Court gives a unanimous verdict: the Court rules that prorogation of Parliament was unlawful.

 

The court's president, Lady Hale, said: "The effect [of prorogation] on the fundamentals of our democracy was extreme."

 

She said the unanimous decision of the 11 justices was that Parliament had not been prorogued - the decision was null and of no effect - and it was for the Speakers of the Commons and Lords to decide what to do next.

 

A major defeat for Boris.

 

 





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  # 2324229 24-Sep-2019 22:20
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BBC NEWS 

 

The damage is done

 

Analysis by Clive Coleman, Legal affairs correspondent

 


Wow! This is legal, constitutional and political dynamite.

 

It is worth just taking a breath and considering that a prime minister of the United Kingdom has been found by the highest court in the land to have acted unlawfully in shutting down the sovereign body in our constitution, Parliament, at a time of national crisis.

 

The court may have fallen short of saying Boris Johnson had an improper motive of stymieing or frustrating parliamentary scrutiny, but the damage is done, he has been found to have acted unlawfully and stopped Parliament from doing its job without any legal justification.

 

And the court has quashed both his advice to the Queen and the Order in Council which officially suspended parliament.

 

That means Parliament was never prorogued and so we assume that MPs are free to re-enter the Commons.

 

This is the most dramatic example yet of independent judges through the mechanism of judicial review stopping the government in its tracks because what it has done, is unlawful.

 

Be you ever so mighty, the law is above you - even if you are the prime minister.

 

Unprecedented, extraordinary, ground breaking - it is difficult to overestimate the constitutional and political significance of today's ruling.

 





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BDFL - Memuneh
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  # 2324296 25-Sep-2019 07:46
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Right... BoJo committed an illegal act, while PM, according to the supreme court. Let's see how long does it take to kick him out - because like Trump he has no shame and won't resign.





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  # 2324338 25-Sep-2019 08:47
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freitasm:  Right ... BoJo committed an illegal act, while PM, according to the supreme court. Let's see how long does it take to kick him out - because like Trump he has no shame and won't resign.

 





Mr Johnson was backed by US President Donald Trump at a joint press conference at the United Nations in New York.

 

"I'll tell you, I know him well, he's not going anywhere," said Mr Trump, after a US reporter quizzed the prime minister on whether he was going to resign. 

 

EDIT: Trump has now been impeached.   🙂





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  # 2324365 25-Sep-2019 09:28
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Maybe Boris could appeal the Supreme Court decision by taking it to the European Court of Justi...

 

Oh wait...

 

 


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  # 2324396 25-Sep-2019 10:22
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BBC News - Jennifer Arcuri: Boris Johnson given 14 days to explain businesswoman links

 

BREAKING

 


Boris Johnson has been given 14 days to give details of his relationship with a US businesswoman, following claims he failed to declare a potential conflict of interest when he was London mayor.

 

A committee that scrutinises the mayor's spending has asked for details "of all contact" with Jennifer Arcuri. ...

 

 

Another bad day at the office ...





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