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GV27
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  #2786757 30-Sep-2021 08:12
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gzt:

 


The Labour team seems to be entirely unaware of the Streisand effect. It really surprises me they spent much time at all responding to this. Key said bugger all and half of what he said was kind of silly off the cuff and not based on any assessment of evidence. Key made a couple of other suggestions that more or less match what the government is doing anyway, and that's about all.

 

Hipkins saying the Nats want 'Covid home for Christmas' during the 1pm press conference yesterday was a huge abuse of that 1pm platform tbh. I have seen others express annoyance at politicking from the podium, usually before important announcements that affect a huge number of people's lives. Just tell us what we need to know. Even Drunk Muldoon managed to get directly to the point. 

 

Robertson was even more churlish in Parliament. 

 

I fail to see how this kind of carry-on, on a day where they announced 45 cases, and with the biggest city still in an ongoing lockdown, is any better than the kind of crap people accuse National of doing for the last 18 months. 

 

All I see is a bunch of people whose incomes and livelihoods are not contingent on life getting back to normal as quickly as possible bickering like school children and only one side ever really being pulled up on it.


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FineWine
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  #2786772 30-Sep-2021 08:43
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quickymart:

 

A lot of the reactions I saw today on social media re National's plan weren't exactly what I would describe as positive.

 

What I could see it came down to was: "National = cares about money and business, Labour = cares about lives and health".
Doesn't really seem to be much middle ground between them, from what I could tell.

 

National = cares about money and business = big end of town = anti-socialist

 

Labour = cares about lives and health = they did introduce the welfare state to NZ = for the common man





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tdgeek
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  #2786777 30-Sep-2021 08:50
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GV27:

 

gzt:

 


The Labour team seems to be entirely unaware of the Streisand effect. It really surprises me they spent much time at all responding to this. Key said bugger all and half of what he said was kind of silly off the cuff and not based on any assessment of evidence. Key made a couple of other suggestions that more or less match what the government is doing anyway, and that's about all.

 

Hipkins saying the Nats want 'Covid home for Christmas' during the 1pm press conference yesterday was a huge abuse of that 1pm platform tbh. I have seen others express annoyance at politicking from the podium, usually before important announcements that affect a huge number of people's lives. Just tell us what we need to know. Even Drunk Muldoon managed to get directly to the point. 

 

Robertson was even more churlish in Parliament. 

 

I fail to see how this kind of carry-on, on a day where they announced 45 cases, and with the biggest city still in an ongoing lockdown, is any better than the kind of crap people accuse National of doing for the last 18 months. 

 

All I see is a bunch of people whose incomes and livelihoods are not contingent on life getting back to normal as quickly as possible bickering like school children and only one side ever really being pulled up on it.

 

 

Fair enough they shouldn't use the platform in that way. You'd probably need to ensure the media doesnt raise them either though. I didn't watch the presser, I just assume the media raised it




GV27
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  #2786781 30-Sep-2021 09:01
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tdgeek:

 

Fair enough they shouldn't use the platform in that way. You'd probably need to ensure the media doesnt raise them either though. I didn't watch the presser, I just assume the media raised it

 

 

They did. He could have also just said he was their to talk about their response, but he didn't.


tdgeek
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  #2786790 30-Sep-2021 09:18
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GV27:

 

They did. He could have also just said he was their to talk about their response, but he didn't.

 

 

A bit slippery if they won't respond to alternative options. Yes, they could respond elsewhere, but it would come across as avoidance at the presser. 


GV27
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  #2786808 30-Sep-2021 09:55
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tdgeek:

 

A bit slippery if they won't respond to alternative options. Yes, they could respond elsewhere, but it would come across as avoidance at the presser. 

 

 

It's more than a bit slippery if they're using a broadcast window no other party gets to use to make political statements that have little bearing on the actual information they've been given the 1pm press broadcast slots to disseminate. 

 

Either National is bad for politicising the response AND what Hipkins did yesterday was out of line, or neither was. It can't be both at the same time depending on who is speaking. 


wellygary
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  #2786812 30-Sep-2021 10:00
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tdgeek:

 

GV27:

 

They did. He could have also just said he was their to talk about their response, but he didn't.

 

 

A bit slippery if they won't respond to alternative options. Yes, they could respond elsewhere, but it would come across as avoidance at the presser. 

 

 

 

 

The Govt are getting in the ear from pretty every direction at the moment,  so its not unexpected that the separation of government/party politics starts to slip

 

 

 

The academics (Baker, Wilson, Plank etc) have pretty much all decried the move from 4 to 3 in Auckland as a Mistake, while National and ACT are running round saying we can manage 50 new cases a day by letting all the expat Kiwi home... (NZ is woefully short on ICU beds, and all that would happen would be a rerun of the Spanish flu- except those that it would kill would be mainly Maori under 50)

 

And in the meantime the government is trying to placate 1.5 million Aucklanders who have been in Lockdown coming on 6 weeks with no apparent path to lower restrictions.

 

The Govt really needs to outline a path for Auckland at least (the international border car wait) but Auckland is where elections are won and lost and if they don't pay attention and the opposition do find an idea that resonates.... the political landscape could change very quickly....




quickymart
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  #2786820 30-Sep-2021 10:12
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wellygary:

 

The Govt really needs to outline a path for Auckland at least (the international border car wait) but Auckland is where elections are won and lost and if they don't pay attention and the opposition do find an idea that resonates.... the political landscape could change very quickly....

 

 

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/09/coronavirus-possible-that-auckland-might-drop-to-level-2-but-border-stay-in-place.html

 

This would be almost like level 3, only you can't travel anywhere really. I'd rather have a proper level 2, to be honest.


GV27
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  #2786826 30-Sep-2021 10:22
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quickymart:

 

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2021/09/coronavirus-possible-that-auckland-might-drop-to-level-2-but-border-stay-in-place.html

 

This would be almost like level 3, only you can't travel anywhere really. I'd rather have a proper level 2, to be honest.

 

 

I've seen that floated too, it's basically Level 3 but with the same mingling that is causing us the headaches at the moment en masse, but then sending an extremely mixed message by telling Aucklanders they have to keep to the same regional restrictions as in L3/L4.

 

I.e. we can't let you down to a proper Level 2 in Auckland, but we're going to allow the drivers for spread in Auckland to ramp up a notch while the rest the country goes on with life BAU. 

 

Can see that going down like a cup of hot sick with hitherto compliant Aucklanders. 


GV27
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  #2787019 30-Sep-2021 13:27
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And confirmed today in the Stuff liveblog:

 

"Ardern says she wants to signal the high likelihood of the Auckland boundary remaining. Full consideration is being given to easing. Removing that regional boundary is not in consideration."

quickymart
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  #2787040 30-Sep-2021 13:56
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Ah well, at least the schools will open up again...just in time for the school holidays. Sigh.


freitasm
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  #2788637 3-Oct-2021 15:56
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Rikkitic:

 

Technofreak:

 

Focussing on the 'hermit kingdom" comment is to miss the point completely about what John Key said.

 

 

What point might that be? Key also said this:

 

"The only urgency we've seen for months is an enthusiasm to lock down our country, lock up our people and lock out our citizens who are overseas."

 

"Some people might like to continue the North Korean option." 

 

"Public health experts and politicians have done a good job of making the public fearful..."

 

"For those who say it's too hard, or too risky I ask this: one day, when the largest part of the Minister of Finance's Budget pays only the interest on the debt we are racking up now, and you can't have the latest cancer drugs, or more police, because New Zealand can't afford them, what will you think?"

 

Hyperbolic, much? If you have a valid argument, you don't need to rely on overwrought bombast to manipulate the masses. The first phrase quoted is just hysterical nonsense exaggeration that has no place in a serious discussion. The second is simply stupid. Nothing in government policy comes even close to the North Korean way of doing things, whatever that is. Key is wetting himself with this kind of idiot statement, which he then repeats. His accusation of the authorities manipulating people with fear tactics is rich when he immediately goes on to do precisely the same, as the last quote amply illustrates. Let's just scare the hell out of everyone by telling them they won't be able to afford cancer drugs or police. This kind of crap would be irresponsible coming from anyone with a public voice. Coming from a former Prime Minister, it is inexcusable.

 

 

On this note, found while browsing a book store today:

 





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quickymart
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  #2788779 3-Oct-2021 21:31
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Predictably, Judith and ACT come out swinging with the Government's response to the outbreak today...but I can't see them offering anything vastly better in terms of "this is how we would fix this" (IMO):

 

https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/10/judith-collins-david-seymour-say-jacinda-ardern-s-lost-control-after-covid-spreads-into-waikato.html

 

 


GV27
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  #2788885 4-Oct-2021 09:45
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Considering we are about to pivot into something called a 'transition away from elimination', it's going to be a very interesting day for the Labour bros on social media. 


Rikkitic
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  #2788894 4-Oct-2021 09:56
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GV27:

 

Considering we are about to pivot into something called a 'transition away from elimination', it's going to be a very interesting day for the Labour bros on social media. 

 

 

If so, is it really appropriate to be so gleeful about it? I thought we were all in this together.

 

 

 

 





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