The politicisation of NZ's covid response

To post in this sub-forum you must have made 100 posts or have Trust status or have completed our ID Verification

Forums › Politics › The politicisation of NZ's covid response

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | ... | 53

13704 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#2793069 11-Oct-2021 11:38

Technofreak: Without raising taxes the the government has found a billion dollars a week to fight Covid. The money needed to increase ICU bed numbers is a small fraction of that.

I get the feeling govt is more likely to increase funding to support existing health board covid initiatives to avoid the situation described here than increase ICU beds specifically by much.

In fact the ICU bed situation is worse now than when Covid started. In the current environment that is a shocking statistic.

Any references for that one? You're making a large number of assertions and providing very little to go on.

Sharesies kids

Affiliate link

Affiliate link: Free kids accounts - trade shares and funds (NZ, US) with Sharesies.

Rikkitic

Awrrr
15589 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#2793072 11-Oct-2021 11:44

Technofreak: Ardern's Leadership

Agree no leader is perfect. We will have to agree to disagree. She is to wishy washy for me. Someone compared her to Winston Churchill. For someone to do that they haven't studied Winston Churchill. IMO they aren't in the same league.

I made that comparison. Jacinda Ardern hasn't been tested in the way Churchill was, but I very much doubt she would have voted for appeasement in a comparable situation. However, the similarity I was pointing out is the exceptional ability of both of them to connect with, inspire, and offer encouragement to the general public. As others here have also observed, Jacinda Ardern is a fantastic communicator. So was Churchill.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

Fred99

13684 posts

Uber Geek

#2793084 11-Oct-2021 12:03

Technofreak:

Cast your mind back to when our borders were closed and see what events were being planned, one of which was the Christchurch massacre anniversary. The lock down was delayed as long as possible in the hope they could have been held.

Do you think you can sink any lower than posting that dirty filthy opportunistic lie / conspiracy theory?

Stu

Hammered
6623 posts

Uber Geek

Moderator

ID Verified

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2793297 11-Oct-2021 15:55

freitasm:

I like how a previous National leader is involved in a project by the Mongrel Mob.

Former National Party leader Don Brash has come out in defence of the gang community, saying the Government appears to be making them the "fall guys" for the spread of Covid-19.

Brash, who works as the treasurer of an initiative started by the Mongrel Mob, said he was worried about the ongoing situation relating to people affiliated with gangs were to blame for spreading Covid.

"I am worried that gangs are being made the fall guys for something that they have had no control over.

"We are told that gangs are responsible for spreading this virus. If that's true, the Government should confirm it," he said.

"If there is evidence, let's see it. Otherwise, it's scaremongering and not helpful at all."

Brash's words were released in a press statement sent out by the Mongrel Mob ahead of a Covid information workshop and vaccination event being set up on Saturday targeting those affiliated with the gang.

To me this shows how National can complain about the government but didn't put the whole thing in perspective...

Isn't it the media suggesting/telling us it's the gangs? Is there a link to someone in government actually blaming the gangs? I keep hearing media asking the government if it is gang members when positive cases pop up, but has any member of the government ever actually confirmed it is? Serious question. I haven't seen every moment of every press stand-up.

It’s not that I’m agoraphobic, it’s just not safe to go out anymore.

Keep calm, and carry on posting.

Referral Links: Sharesies Backblaze

Technofreak

5546 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#2793421 11-Oct-2021 20:28

gzt:

In fact the ICU bed situation is worse now than when Covid started. In the current environment that is a shocking statistic.

Any references for that one? You're making a large number of assertions and providing very little to go on.

Yep, right here. https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-coronavirus-delta-outbreak-have-we-boosted-hospital-icu-capacity-enough/BYKEKZQYWNBFKWQ5ZEE5Q5PWNE/

According to the Ministry of Health in May 2020 we had 358 ICU beds across New Zealand. According to that article this has dropped to 284 in August 2021.

Sony Xperia XA2 running Sailfish OS. https://sailfishos.org The true independent open source mobile OS
Samsung Galaxy Tab S6
Dell Inspiron 14z i5

Fred99

13684 posts

Uber Geek

#2793486 11-Oct-2021 21:21

Not sure if the ~~Auckland~~ NZ Herald is a great source.

This from a reply to a recent OIA request to MoH:

Note that in NSW (pop >8 million), Covid patients in ICU peaked at about 200 ~ so if we stuff things up as badly as they had until a few weeks ago, that's equivalent to about 125 ICU beds here.

But they had exponential growth in cases with vaccination rates below what NZ's are now. We should be able to do better.

Fred99

13684 posts

Uber Geek

#2794476 13-Oct-2021 14:15

Technofreak

5546 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#2794605 13-Oct-2021 16:09

Fred99:

Not sure if the Auckland NZ Herald is a great source.

This from a reply to a recent OIA request to MoH:

Note that in NSW (pop >8 million), Covid patients in ICU peaked at about 200 ~ so if we stuff things up as badly as they had until a few weeks ago, that's equivalent to about 125 ICU beds here.

But they had exponential growth in cases with vaccination rates below what NZ's are now. We should be able to do better.

I agree, relying on the likes of NZ Herald and Stuff for reliable information is risky. Which ever number you use for the August or Sept 21 ICU bed figures it's still less than the MOH were reporting in May 2020.

Using the NSW figures you've quoted we might scrape by. I doubt our ICU bed numbers have any fat in them now, what will happen to anyone else requiring ICU care? Our ICU bed ratio is 4.6/100,000 which compares to Australia at 8.9/100,000 or the UK at 6.4/100,000.

Sony Xperia XA2 running Sailfish OS. https://sailfishos.org The true independent open source mobile OS
Samsung Galaxy Tab S6
Dell Inspiron 14z i5

Varkk

598 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2795163 14-Oct-2021 13:37

I think it is important to note the effects of the media, especially the various opinion column writers who have been steadily chipping away at the public confidence in the response. Here is an article which takes a dive in to the various half-truths, unverified reckons etc which have been published by the media during this time.

https://badnewsletter.substack.com/p/the-fifth-columnists

Technofreak

5546 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

#2795632 14-Oct-2021 23:03

Varkk:

I think it is important to note the effects of the media, especially the various opinion column writers who have been steadily chipping away at the public confidence in the response. Here is an article which takes a dive in to the various half-truths, unverified reckons etc which have been published by the media during this time.

https://badnewsletter.substack.com/p/the-fifth-columnists

That is just another opinion article just like the ones he is picking apart. Not sure I agree with Josh Drummond entirely. He is coming from a different political direction to those people he makes an example of. Both sides have their points, trouble is he cannot see that, as is likely for some of the people he is taking to task.

It's a long article and I didn't read all of it. To give one example of why I know his perspective isn't entirely correct. He says Mike Hosking was creating unnecessary alarm by saying cancer diagnosis would be missed and then went on to say there was no evidence of this happening. I know from personal experience with a relative that due to Covid it has happened and with the consequence the cancer is now not operable and will probably be fatal. So far as I'm concerned Josh Drummond is just as bad as the people he has chosen to chastise in his opinion piece.

Sony Xperia XA2 running Sailfish OS. https://sailfishos.org The true independent open source mobile OS
Samsung Galaxy Tab S6
Dell Inspiron 14z i5

Varkk

598 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2795845 15-Oct-2021 11:27

There was a study published in the Lancet that showed the lockdowns had a minimal effect on cancer diagnosis and treatment. Unfortunately there are always cases outside the general trend. There was an initial delay but that was quickly caught up. I think the NZ Society for Oncology also found that there was minimal disruption to diagnosis and care. While there were some cases where this sadly did happen the overall numbers were much lower than if Covid had been allowed to run unfettered and our hospitals and medial staff were overrun.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanwpc/article/PIIS2666-6065(21)00036-5/fulltext

gzt

13704 posts

Uber Geek

Lifetime subscriber

#2795888 15-Oct-2021 13:06

Varkk: I think it is important to note the effects of the media, especially the various opinion column writers who have been steadily chipping away at the public confidence in the response. Here is an article which takes a dive in to the various half-truths, unverified reckons etc which have been published by the media during this time.

https://badnewsletter.substack.com/p/the-fifth-columnists

This is interesting and worth a read. I read only a short part because mobile. The initial part seemed to be columnists associated with radio ZB. Since not driving in the morning I don't hear this at all. I wonder if ZB ratings in that slot are suffering.

In print Hosking is paywalled. The others are not always paywalled but rarely of interest to me. I'm aware they have huge followings tho.

GV27

4281 posts

Uber Geek

#2795995 15-Oct-2021 17:28

The whole 'Covid for Christmas' thing looks like a massive own-goal atm.

arcon

406 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2801196 26-Oct-2021 10:46

"North Korean hermit kingdom indefinitely". "totalitarian socialism"... well Mr NZ Herald columnist and former National party staffer... go @#$% yourself 😁

sigh

Sideface

7567 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

Lifetime subscriber

#2801213 26-Oct-2021 11:02

arcon: "North Korean hermit kingdom indefinitely". "totalitarian socialism"...

Matthew Hooton was appointed Mongolia’s Honorary Consul to New Zealand in December 2017. see : Honorary Consulate of Mongolia NZ

So he should know a bit about hermit kingdoms. 😏

Sideface

1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 11 | ... | 53