The headphones thread! [Sorry about your wallet]

Forums › Home Theatre (including HTPC and EPG Collector) › The headphones thread! [Sorry about your wallet]

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Networkn
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#715579 11-Nov-2012 21:44

I'll see what tomorrow brings, if it's sitting waiting for me to pay I'll pay it, but I think that duty is only payable on the unit part and excludes the freight which was $43 AUD.

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NZtechfreak

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#715598 11-Nov-2012 22:23

networkn: I'll see what tomorrow brings, if it's sitting waiting for me to pay I'll pay it, but I think that duty is only payable on the unit part and excludes the freight which was $43 AUD.

Nope, shipping charges are included in the calculation.

"The goods may also be subject to Goods and Services Tax (GST) of 15%, based on the Customs value of the goods, and including the duty (if any) and postal/courier charges."

http://www.customs.govt.nz/inprivate/sendingitemstonz/Privateimportsbypost/Pages/default.aspx

Nothing to do but pay it though...

Depends on how the other guy declared its value too.

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timmmay

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#715635 12-Nov-2012 07:30

NZtechfreak:
timmmay: I don't understand soundstage... I'm taking it out of the review options for the new version of my website.

Really? I can understand you might remove it from the site, depending on who your intended audience is, but whats not to understand about soundstage?

It's the way different instruments sound separated around a virtual room or something, right? Headphones have to speakers, I think it's a load of s**t. I've listened to some great headphones/amps and I've never noticed anything like that.

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#715734 12-Nov-2012 11:40

it's whether the instruments are all in your head or (edit:) perceived as being 2 feet in front of you or 10 metres in front of you or somewhere in the distant or accurately scattered to around one is 2 feet away at 3 o clock the other instrument 2 metres away at 11 o clock and so on, that is soundstage

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#715735 12-Nov-2012 11:40

joker97: it's whether the instruments are all in your head or (edit:) perceived at 2 feet in front of you or 10 metres in front of you or somewhere in the distant or accurately scattered to around one is 2 feet away at 3 o clock the other instrument 2 metres away at 11 o clock and so on, that is soundstage

NZtechfreak

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#715806 12-Nov-2012 13:16

timmmay:
NZtechfreak:
timmmay: I don't understand soundstage... I'm taking it out of the review options for the new version of my website.

Really? I can understand you might remove it from the site, depending on who your intended audience is, but whats not to understand about soundstage?

It's the way different instruments sound separated around a virtual room or something, right? Headphones have to speakers, I think it's a load of s**t. I've listened to some great headphones/amps and I've never noticed anything like that.

No, that isn't quite right, and soundstage most certainly isn't excrement.

Joker has it closer, but still intermingling two slightly separate terms. The soundstage is the field where sound is perceived as coming from. In IEMs the sound is all "in your head" as it were, as the sound is being channelled directly into the eardrum, but headphones are able to produce a soundstage that can exist slightly outside of the head (particularly open headphones, since they leak sound outside the headphone which is also heard by the ear, and the reason that closed headphones in general have restricted soundstages compared to open ones).

This image is one persons take on how they perceive the soundstage of a few high-end headphones (certainly the LCD-2 one is correct, they don't really have much of a soundstage). Width=the extension of the soundstrage to either side of the head, depth=the soundstage of the front and back of the head, and then there is the vertical axis too (sometimes referred to as the Z-axis, the most difficult for headphones to reproduce). Anyways, the picture serves to illustrate the point as far as depth and width go, but isn't able to represent the z-axis.

The term Joker is slightly mixing in with soundstage is imaging, which is the placement of certain instruments and sounds within the soundstage. 46 and 2 by Tool is a great track for assessing imaging, as the intro features this very delicate work with splash cymbals that illustrates a headphones ability to reproduce z-axis really nicely, and then also at about the 4:30 mark there is a really nice drum roll that pans right to left and really lets you hear the width of the soundstage.

Source has a role to play also. Lots of modern pop/hip-hop and even rock has quite a poor soundstage, since it is directly mic'd or sampled (rather than recorded live in a room), and badly produced. The best songs to really give you an impression of soundstage will either be well recorded and mastered, like the Tool song I referenced (Danny Carey clearly has quite a number of microphones strewn around his kit), or well-recorded and mastered live recordings (soundstage is a very important characteristic to listeners of live-recorded classical music accordingly).

If you've never appreciated the soundstage in all the gear you've listened too then I'm baffled. I wonder if perhaps you've never appreciated it because you been taking a fairly poor analogy for the soundstage a bit literally? Your post reads that way a bit.

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timmmay

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#715816 12-Nov-2012 13:23

It's like amps, sometimes people hear what they want to hear. I've heard more headphones than most people, I have pretty good hearing, I've just never noticed it.

Do you need those special monster cables to hear it? ;-)

networkn

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#715819 12-Nov-2012 13:26

Well I am really happy, my new headphones will be with me today, no duty !! :)

NZtechfreak

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#715821 12-Nov-2012 13:27

networkn: Well I am really happy, my new headphones will be with me today, no duty !! :)

Niiiiceee!

Now we have to have a tiny headphones meet of two people!

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NZtechfreak

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#715830 12-Nov-2012 13:35

timmmay: It's like amps, sometimes people hear what they want to hear. I've heard more headphones than most people, I have pretty good hearing, I've just never noticed it.

Do you need those special monster cables to hear it? ;-)

So you've never perceived instruments or sounds as originating from, and occupying different spaces? Not even left and right channel? But somehow everyone else is deluded? Nice.

Perhaps we can just agree to disagree, and you can move your veiled insults to threads where they are welcome?

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timmmay

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#715866 12-Nov-2012 14:14

It wasn't meant to be an insult, I'm sorry if it came across that way. I have a bunch of headphone experience, and I've never really heard soundstage. Left and right, sure, headphones have two speakers. I just think sometimes people can hear what they want to hear, especially when they've spent a lot of money on something.

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#715869 12-Nov-2012 14:16

I hadn't even heard of soundstage when I first appreciated it, with the HE-400...

The qualities that I would later come to understand as imaging and soundstage stood out to me immediately. They were probably to two qualities besides the detail retrieval that got me hooked on this headphones game.

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timmmay

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#715872 12-Nov-2012 14:20

Maybe I just need better headphones?

NZtechfreak

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#715877 12-Nov-2012 14:24

timmmay: Maybe I just need better headphones?

You've experienced quite a lot though... Maybe you just appreciate music differently?

The headphones I'm aware of that are known to have big soundstages are the HD800, HiFiMan cans, and the GS1000/PS1000 Grado headphones. I've not heard the HD800, but the HE-400 certainly have a pretty decent soundstage, and my GS1000i has probably the largest I've heard. Neither my RS1 and LCD-2, despite being open, seem to have much of a soundstage - I would say the T5p and W3000ANV beat them in those stakes despite being closed. Most interested to hear how the HE-6 will sound (it arrived in NZ this morning, but customs status etc is presently unknown to me). If it sounds like a decent improvement over the HE-400 I think I'll probably be thrilled with it.

...all of this just goes to show that we really do need to have a large headphone meet in NZ sometime!

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timmmay

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#715878 12-Nov-2012 14:31

Yeah it'd be interesting to hear those HD-400s for sure, and whatever else you have around :)

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