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Mad Scientist
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  Reply # 879321 16-Aug-2013 10:04
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oldtechie: Thank you for all the suggestions so far, keep 'em coming!

Dunnersfella, I totally understand where you are coming from, BUT ... I know there is no way I will be able to justify a $3,000 amp (are you thinking of the Audiant 80i?), PLUS $1,000 plus for the front speakers, PLUS $600 plus for a new TV to She Who Must Be Obeyed. I know I haven't set a firm budget so it's a bit difficult for everyone to advise me without that crucial information, and I apologise for that. I'm still at the information gathering stage at the moment, and I don't want to set an arbitrary upper limit without some idea of what will suit me and the family.

Having said that, I do appreciate your honest appraisal that I may be doomed to a life of poor quality audio. :( Sadly, budgetry constraints (as imposed by She Who Must Be Obeyed) will mean a compromise. My aim is to find that sweet spot between the $269 LG HTIB, and the $50,000 system that I'm sure I would really enjoy ... by myself, because the wife would pack her bags and leave. Hopefully there is something that fits between crap quality and superb quality in my price range.


put it this way - if you have super sensitive $10,000 speakers, even the paint on your wall, the coating of your ceiling, the open door on the left, the glass window on your right, and the type of couch you sit on have a bearing on the room acoustics and therefore sound you will hear. (if your hearing still works that is). if you had that much money to spend, you'd want to not only get the best amp and best golden wires, you'd want to treat your room for acoustics and start looking at that $25,000 speakers.

if you want to spend $2,000 and you spend $1,000 on a 2 ch amp and $600 for a tv and leave $400 for speakers, what are you going to get out of it? you won't hear the amp, but the speakers in this instance




Swype on iOS is detrimental to accurate typing. Apologies in advance.


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  Reply # 879325 16-Aug-2013 10:06
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oldtechie: Thank you for all the suggestions so far, keep 'em coming!

Dunnersfella, I totally understand where you are coming from, BUT ... I know there is no way I will be able to justify a $3,000 amp (are you thinking of the Audiant 80i?), PLUS $1,000 plus for the front speakers, PLUS $600 plus for a new TV to She Who Must Be Obeyed. I know I haven't set a firm budget so it's a bit difficult for everyone to advise me without that crucial information, and I apologise for that. I'm still at the information gathering stage at the moment, and I don't want to set an arbitrary upper limit without some idea of what will suit me and the family.

Having said that, I do appreciate your honest appraisal that I may be doomed to a life of poor quality audio. :( Sadly, budgetry constraints (as imposed by She Who Must Be Obeyed) will mean a compromise. My aim is to find that sweet spot between the $269 LG HTIB, and the $50,000 system that I'm sure I would really enjoy ... by myself, because the wife would pack her bags and leave. Hopefully there is something that fits between crap quality and superb quality in my price range.


I guess your upper limit is def no more than $4,600 ha! I think you really should start to decide what you want to spend and from above sounds like you would be happy to have everything for <$3000? I think there is enough info on here and other threads to guide you with budget and what you want. Then people can start offering specific hardware.

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  Reply # 879348 16-Aug-2013 10:33
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The rule is to spend 3x on speakers compared to amp




Swype on iOS is detrimental to accurate typing. Apologies in advance.




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  Reply # 879435 16-Aug-2013 11:57
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joker97: I will have to check the model number of the speakers when I get home tonight, but picking from some of the comments here I suspect they may well become my rear - surround??? - speakers fed from the AVR. They're bookshelf speakers, and around 20 years old.

sdav: Agreed, I do need to start looking at specific equipment and deciding on a budget. I originally started this post to try and get some general ideas about which route to take - dedicated audio gear or home theatre - and I think with my budget I will have to be realistic about what I can and cannot do. Your figure of <$3000 is probably about right - there's no way I'll get any more than that approved by She Who Must Be Obeyed.

I know that I also need to measure the room, so I can give people some more information. I *think* it's around 4m by 7m, but I'll measure it tonight.

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  Reply # 879448 16-Aug-2013 12:14
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go with avr with room equalization (audyssey MultEX) and quality left right speakers (you can choose to add a sub or a centre speaker later) - this will give you pretty good 2 ch audio.

to those who suggest you get a dedicated 2ch audio set up i suggest they do their room acoustic treatment before they start to throw the word 'crap' around, coz unless you built your room for 2ch audio ...

of course beauty lies in the eye of the beholder (and the wallet of the payer!)




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  Reply # 879452 16-Aug-2013 12:26
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oldtechie:
sdav: Agreed, I do need to start looking at specific equipment and deciding on a budget. I originally started this post to try and get some general ideas about which route to take - dedicated audio gear or home theatre - and I think with my budget I will have to be realistic about what I can and cannot do. Your figure of <$3000 is probably about right - there's no way I'll get any more than that approved by She Who Must Be Obeyed.


I don't think you even need to quite decide on equipment but at least with a firmer idea of budget the good people hear can throw speicifics your way. Like you said, you're a little way away from pulling the trigger (which is always good) so the more info you get hopefully the happier you will be!

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  Reply # 879453 16-Aug-2013 12:28
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Trademe is your friend for speakers, have had some good deals in the past. You should be able to get a half decent 5.1 setup for $500. A new 40" TV can be had for $700 if you shop around but it will be entry level. Again some good deals on trademe but a bit more risk involved if second hand. A smart bluray player negates some of the downfalls of an entry level TV and will set you back about $240 for Samsung model (or $100 less if you forgo the smart functions). That leaves you $500 or so to spend on a receiver which is doable if you find a good sale/deal. Get speaker cable from somewhere cheap like Jaycar and maybe drop $60 on a Harmony 650 universal remote.

Be clever about all of that and you will have a 5.1 surround system with smart 1080p TV, blu ray and one remote to rule them all for 2k. You already have myksy HD (def time to can the CRT!), and with the smart BD player you can also get on to netflix, etc by using Unblock us or similar. It will be a different world from what you describe your current setup to be :)

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  Reply # 879454 16-Aug-2013 12:28
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i did a quick search and found this thread which might help the OP

also found a very basic explanation for room acoustics

http://www.realtraps.com/art_basics.htm




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  Reply # 879457 16-Aug-2013 12:30
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and post #5 here could help you




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  Reply # 879691 16-Aug-2013 17:59
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oldtechie: qwertee, are you talking about this system?

http://www.harveynorman.co.nz/yamaha-5.1-channel-home-theatre-pack.html

I see it has the RX-V475, how do you find the speakers?


I bought the full system with the speakeres
http://www.harveynorman.co.nz/yamaha-5.1-channel-home-theatre-pack.html



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  Reply # 879777 16-Aug-2013 20:28
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Well, the speakers that I currently have are Energy 2.1e bookshelf speakers. And the room is a slightly awkward "L" shape - 8 metres long by 3.5 metres at the thin end, 4.5 metres at the wider end. Would bookshelf speakers such as the Wharfedale 10.1 be sufficient for this room?

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  Reply # 879811 16-Aug-2013 21:37
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you'll be surprised what some bookshelves can do, but this one might not suit - it depends ...

firstly do you want bookshelves or floor standers?
secondly where will you sit?
thirdly how loud do you want to play?

in general the bigger the woofer the louder the bass, the higher the speaker sensitivity the louder the overall sound, and then the clarity of the loudspeaker system depends on how well it's built.

PS where do you live? some dudes here might be able to help suggest a hifi shop you can go to audition some speakers and hear them for yourselves ... as I said i'm not very knowledgeable with which speakers sound like what as I only know about one brand's low-mid end type ...




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  Reply # 879834 16-Aug-2013 22:19
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joker97:

to those who suggest you get a dedicated 2ch audio set up i suggest they do their room acoustic treatment before they start to throw the word 'crap' around, coz unless you built your room for 2ch audio ...

of course beauty lies in the eye of the beholder (and the wallet of the payer!)


That 'those' would be me then?

The fact is, $800 AVR's have to handle...
HDMI switching
Video upscaling
Radio
Analogue input switching
Network connectivity
Multizone control
A/B speaker switching
Room EQ
Oh yeah, amplification.

They're a bucket of compromise to hit the price point, it really is the cheapest parts to hit a level where they're competitive in the market place.
Compared to the OP's Rotel, a $800 AVR will be a piece of plastic fantastic.
The reason I suggest an Audiant (over the likes of a comparable Rotel etc) is it offers a home theatre loop, so that IF the OP wanted to, they could integrate it into a surround sound receiver later on...

Oh and in regards to room correction - it's something people are NEVER happy with.
But of course, we never had issues with rooms... UNTIL we began measuring them!

I still think Energy made brilliant speakers, especially compared to some you'll find on the market today.
Add a nice 2-channel amplifier and maybe loop in a subwoofer, and you could be stoked for years to come. If you feel the need to scratch the home theatre itch (and most research from amplifier manufacturers says that people do a majority of their listening in stereo anyway), you can simply tack on an AVR with pre-outs, add a centre + rears and you're sorted.

I play with lots of speakers within my hobby, but I still run a full range 2-channel rig at home. The imaging is superb for movies / TV, music is brilliant... and I know the gear will be in my life for yeaaars to come.


Here's another idea...

Get your Rotel services, pick up a Samsung smart LED TV (they have RCA audio outputs for 2013), a BluRay player and connect everything to your amplifier via the TV. Preferably, pick up a DAC (Rotel / AudioLab have USB + coax + optical (Rotel even has USB on the front)) to integrate with other digital inputs, and you're sorted for minimal outlay. There are MANY ways to skin the proverbial cat.*

*Note, I do not condone said cat skinning.



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  Reply # 879900 17-Aug-2013 00:18
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Dunnersfella, any particular reason for suggesting a Samsung smart LED TV? As you will be picking up by now, my last foray into buying anything half-way decent was 20 years ago, so technology has passed me by. Does a "smart" TV have some particular features that enable it to work well with an external amplifier? Or does the Samsung have the right connectors for input/output?



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  Reply # 879901 17-Aug-2013 00:20
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PS my two cats are glad to hear you do not condone cat-skinning ...

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