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76 posts

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  Reply # 156904 14-Aug-2008 14:33
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cyril7: Hi, yes outside of Sky you can do media serving, this has each AV device with its own mpeg decoder. Within the Sky system multiroom. Oneday Sky I am sure will offer media server funtionality, be a while I suspect. Other than that there is HDMI or Component distribution, but not really satisfactory.

Cyril

76 posts

Master Geek
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Reply # 156905 14-Aug-2008 14:33
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cyril7: Hi, yes outside of Sky you can do media serving, this has each AV device with its own mpeg decoder. Within the Sky system multiroom. Oneday Sky I am sure will offer media server funtionality, be a while I suspect. Other than that there is HDMI or Component distribution, but not really satisfactory.

Cyril


[Try again on PC instead of the phone]

Well that's hardly distributing video .... and if you got to the trouble of putting a network, using a sky box at every screen feels wrong to me ... I hoped you were going to say you knew of a DVB-C solution for the home ....

Today, for Sky (SD especially), which is my primary source of channels in NZ, you might as well put a wet peice of string in the wall and distribute the video over that i.e the bit rate is so low that the compression artifacts far outweigh the lose distributing svideo or composite over twisted pair.

Secondly, if you've got 'media serving', feed your sky boxes into that server (today using svideo as well - or component at a pinch)  and distribute from there (I had this for a while ... it's why my sky boxes are in the attic server room). But, you then haven't anywhere to insert a DVD, plug in a camera or insert a USB stick. And somewhere around that screen you might have an amplifier/receiver, DVD player, heaven forbid a VHS deck, and that Mpeg decoder .... that a lot of stuff at each screen when what you were trying to do was centralise it all.

So then I think you end up with what I have now - central Sky boxes and distrubted HTPCs & MediaMVPs (MPEG decoder) &  Amp. Yes, the downside is svideo over twisted pair (and IR too) but because of those bit rates that's not an issue. It's bearable on a 5meter screen in my cinema ... After every recording the HTPCs transcode MPEG2 back to MPEG4 on a central server. Any other PC can stream from that. If you are in a rush to see something, an HTPC can stream MPEG2 directly to a PC. If you throw a DVB card in the HTPC you get lossless DVB-T HD which is nice ... hence the distributed coax ... Then the other thing you can do, of somewhat dubious legality, is decrypt the Sky signal in the HTPC ...

It's all good fun, not for the faint hearted, and even mostly works Wink

79 posts

Master Geek


  Reply # 157007 14-Aug-2008 18:36
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CYRIL - I am just about to commercialise the phone patch panel that I demonstrated some months ago, it fits inside most inwall cabinets (ST2000/hills) or just over a normal flush box beside a wall mounting rack cabinet. It integrates all features including central ADSL filter, security loop, allowance for home gateway/voip options etc.

Let me know when you got this going I may be keen to utilize it in my installations, do you have any pics.

I do like flush mounted enclosures more than the surface mounted racks.



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  Reply # 157017 14-Aug-2008 19:04
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richms:
A forward looking company would have some power over ethernet support for remote accesspoints, a built in adsl filter, and probably several other things that I have yet to think of, but certainly the clipsal and hills sytems are underwhelmingly craptastic for what you get for the money. Im thinking most of their sales are to suckers building a new house who are told they are buying smart wiring so they are set for the future etc...


I can't agree more. The concept of these units is great - it's just that they're not capable of "future proofing" your house in many respects. Running RF modulated video around the house is an outdated concept and the recommendations for many installers when it comes to the number of jackpoints are on the low side. Having said this however many people don't know any better and simply don't care - for every person out there like us who would get so frustrated by wavey lines through a TV picture there are probably 10 people who couldn't care less.

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  Reply # 157022 14-Aug-2008 19:20
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sbiddle:
richms:
A forward looking company would have some power over ethernet support for remote accesspoints, a built in adsl filter, and probably several other things that I have yet to think of, but certainly the clipsal and hills sytems are underwhelmingly craptastic for what you get for the money. Im thinking most of their sales are to suckers building a new house who are told they are buying smart wiring so they are set for the future etc...


I can't agree more. The concept of these units is great - it's just that they're not capable of "future proofing" your house in many respects. Running RF modulated video around the house is an outdated concept and the recommendations for many installers when it comes to the number of jackpoints are on the low side. Having said this however many people don't know any better and simply don't care - for every person out there like us who would get so frustrated by wavey lines through a TV picture there are probably 10 people who couldn't care less.


I could not agree more.

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  Reply # 157030 14-Aug-2008 19:40
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Well  guys I think we are all on the same page, just frustrated that cost effective ways of utilising payTV on multiple AV sites is still a bit far away.

Not too far in the future I see TVs with integrated mpeg decoders, some with DVB-S,C or T tuners but all with ethernet ports for IPTV streaming from servers. These TVs have integrated CA modules to allow integration with NDS/Sky master STB's. If you think this sounds fairy tale stuff then I think you are very wrong, all major PayTV operators are looking at how they can optimise the delivery to multiple sites within the home with minimal cost impact but still collecting a $ on the way.

Distributing via any baseband method is a crock, localised decoders is the only way of maintaining optimum qualtiy and flexibilty.

Kev/Steve, the phone module is getting there, current talks are well underway, I have had some interesting conversations with the PTC guys at Telecom, expect to see some significant changes to PTC106 based on my input, also some interesting details regarding there current PTC106 and how it deals with FTTH installations, which has some major flaws. Thankfully they have taken my comments on board and rescripting as we type.

Cyril

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Master Geek


  Reply # 157039 14-Aug-2008 19:58
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bring on iptv. those tv's sure sound good. I cant wait for one that will let me push a button when there is a mcdonalds ad and hey presto there my bigmac combo in front of me. lol

I kind of like the idea of a spec apartment block having a shared network with the ability of everyone being able to access shared content that other people within the building have contributed to and saved on a building server. Im sure this would be breaking some kind of laws though. still would be quite cool

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  Reply # 157043 14-Aug-2008 20:20
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cyril7:
Not too far in the future I see TVs with integrated mpeg decoders, some with DVB-S,C or T tuners but all with ethernet ports for IPTV streaming from servers. These TVs have integrated CA modules to allow integration with NDS/Sky master STB's. If you think this sounds fairy tale stuff then I think you are very wrong, all major PayTV operators are looking at how they can optimise the delivery to multiple sites within the home with minimal cost impact but still collecting a $ on the way.

Distributing via any baseband method is a crock, localised decoders is the only way of maintaining optimum qualtiy and flexibilty.

Cyril


As I've said before Cyril, I'm not entirely convinced by this arguement. It seems to me that too many things have to fall into line. Every CE category & manufacturer will have to use the network model else it becomes just more of a mess . Consumers want all kinds of systems to be accessable to their displays now.

To keep things real in the medium term and to use my modest example, I have 3 displays fed by  an hdmi matrix 4x2 switch and a splitter. That gives me pristine pixel for pixel HD signals from Sky HDi, Freeview HD ,the PS3 and an HDMI DVD player into those displays. Any of those sources can be accessed by any display so you gain maximum efficiency for the CE appliances you have.

A 4x4 matrix which should fall into the moderate price category soon would likely be sufficient for an average house. It's not perfect (your inevitable minor Sky HDMI glitch) but having used this configuration for a while now I can say it is a huge advance on anything in the past.

I do feel that HDMI is a viable video distribution system.

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  Reply # 157045 14-Aug-2008 20:26
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I can assure you this model is very much on the cards, the americans have pretty much mandated such arrangements, and the EU is about to mandate. Its not speculation, its what is going to happen, just when.

By the way the EU is just stipulated that TV manufactures must make ready access to onboard DVB decoders for all DVB operators, FTA and Pay, so its not a whim, its soon to be law, and guess what, News Corp have been a big pusher of such systems, they realise that being in the box business is not where they want to be.

Cyril

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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 157054 14-Aug-2008 21:35
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cyril7: I can assure you this model is very much on the cards, the americans have pretty much mandated such arrangements, and the EU is about to mandate. Its not speculation, its what is going to happen, just when.

By the way the EU is just stipulated that TV manufactures must make ready access to onboard DVB decoders for all DVB operators, FTA and Pay, so its not a whim, its soon to be law, and guess what, News Corp have been a big pusher of such systems, they realise that being in the box business is not where they want to be.

Cyril


Sure TV will find it's way directly to the display but what about all the other devices, present and future that people will want to use? Are they going to fit the model so easily.

At least HDMI can be utilised here and now.

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