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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 328928 11-May-2010 14:24
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Just saw in the NZ Herald yesterday - Samsung, along with Acer and DSE came out worst in reliability in TV's. Panasonic, Sony & Toshiba the best. Sourced from Consumer magazine.

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  Reply # 328942 11-May-2010 14:57
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clevedon: Just saw in the NZ Herald yesterday - Samsung, along with Acer and DSE came out worst in reliability in TV's. Panasonic, Sony & Toshiba the best. Sourced from Consumer magazine.


There are different kinds of TVs. For LCDs Samsung and Sony shares the same production plant that produces the LCD panels.  So the reliability rate for Samsung and Sony LCDs should be similar.

 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 328949 11-May-2010 15:10
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Kiwipixter: There are different kinds of TVs. For LCDs Samsung and Sony shares the same production plant that produces the LCD panels.  So the reliability rate for Samsung and Sony LCDs should be similar.


Based on 18,715 respondents on items bought new after 1 January 2005 - those are Consumer Magazines numbers, so I'm sure they are not lying.
Aslo, there is more manufacturing to a flat screen TV than just panel production.

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Ultimate Geek

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  Reply # 328968 11-May-2010 15:42
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I got to check out the Panasonic 50" 3DTV yesterday - they were doing a product launch next to the conference I was attending in rotorua.

Looked absolutely stunning, they had a demo disk of volleyball playing, and sport looked awesome on it!




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  Reply # 328983 11-May-2010 15:59
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I've subscribed to Revision 3's HDNation some time ago and recently they had a few episodes where they discuss in-depth 3D TVs and content.

In short:

Panasonic has the best 3D implementation. Sony is catching up.

The US already has a few broadcasters confirming availability of 3D content in some areas/for some programs. Only a few Blu-rays are available in 3D so far. Avatar is NOT one of them.

The TV needs to be AT LEAST 240Hz to properly present 3D content in 24fps (standard Blu-ray framerate).

IMHO, without any 3D content in NZ nor signs of it being available anytime soon, 3DTV is just a buzzword to sell TV sets.

As other people said before me: if Sky can't even stream all channels in HD yet, what makes you think they'll put in 3D? Same for Freeview/TelstraClear.




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  Reply # 329058 11-May-2010 18:45
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magu: 

As other people said before me: if Sky can't even stream all channels in HD yet, what makes you think they'll put in 3D? Same for Freeview/TelstraClear.


Guess that sums up NZ 3D nicely..




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  Reply # 329081 11-May-2010 19:29
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langi27: check out

https://wic042u.server-secure.com/VS382808_secure/samsung/3dtv/Default.aspx

its says you get a 3D Blueray player plus 2 pairs of glassses.


Confusing as this link says...

http://www.samsung.com/au/consumer/tv-audio-video/3d-products/3d-plasma-tv/PS58C7000YFXXY/index.idx?pagetype=prd_detail&returnurl=

The downside to both offers appears to be a 'up to 70 day waiting period'.
Meaning people may wait over two months to get their 3D glasses...

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  Reply # 329088 11-May-2010 19:44
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magu: I've subscribed to Revision 3's HDNation some time ago and recently they had a few episodes where they discuss in-depth 3D TVs and content.

In short:

Panasonic has the best 3D implementation. Sony is catching up.

The US already has a few broadcasters confirming availability of 3D content in some areas/for some programs. Only a few Blu-rays are available in 3D so far. Avatar is NOT one of them.

The TV needs to be AT LEAST 240Hz to properly present 3D content in 24fps (standard Blu-ray framerate).

IMHO, without any 3D content in NZ nor signs of it being available anytime soon, 3DTV is just a buzzword to sell TV sets.

As other people said before me: if Sky can't even stream all channels in HD yet, what makes you think they'll put in 3D? Same for Freeview/TelstraClear.


As a side note, NZ TV's don't do 240Hz, or 120Hz for that matter.
American TV's do - NZ TV's run at 50, 100 or 200Hz.
Watching HD Nation will confuse you a bit in this regards, but remember, confusing 240 vs 200Hz won't make a jot of difference to your viewing experience, its just a bit of confusing techno-babble.

Oh and while true 3D content isn't around yet, a TV that converts 2D to 3D is going to go part way to getting people on board.
I think Plasma will be best for 3D, so Pana should lead the way with 'true 3D' content, but the Samsung plasmas will be big sellers due to their 2D to 3D conversion. Sony still haven't got it dialled, with them only demo'ing 100Hz TV's in Sony Style stores. It's totally watchable though, and in the real world most people will never notice the difference unless they're told to look for it (and so manufacturers can sell 'the next model up').
It's all hit the market much quicker than many people expected (I hadn't heard anything about Samsung's tech until I saw one in a store) - so the 20 year turn adoption rate seems a little out for me - I'd expect uptake to be a bit quicker... say 10 years. Especially as the pricing seems to be pretty sharp - all things considering.

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Master Geek
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  Reply # 329108 11-May-2010 20:13
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magu: I've subscribed to Revision 3's HDNation some time ago and recently they had a few episodes where they discuss in-depth 3D TVs and content.

In short:

Panasonic has the best 3D implementation. Sony is catching up.

The US already has a few broadcasters confirming availability of 3D content in some areas/for some programs. Only a few Blu-rays are available in 3D so far. Avatar is NOT one of them.

The TV needs to be AT LEAST 240Hz to properly present 3D content in 24fps (standard Blu-ray framerate).

IMHO, without any 3D content in NZ nor signs of it being available anytime soon, 3DTV is just a buzzword to sell TV sets.

As other people said before me: if Sky can't even stream all channels in HD yet, what makes you think they'll put in 3D? Same for Freeview/TelstraClear.


Good points.  But if you compare 3D with HD contents and hardware availability 3D has come along way in a very short time.  3D display standard was rectified pretty quickly, as was 3D bluray for playback of stored contents.  So for movie contents the path for 3D was paved pretty quickly, and with 3D movies currently riding on a wave of popularity we'll see equivalent bluray releases a common place.

HD on the other hand took nearly 10 years to become mainstream.  I first heard of HD back around 1998, not long after DVD was released, yet HD availability only happened in the last couple of years.

So for numerous reasons HD path was paved much slower, but its paved and we are seeing HD becoming a standard feature.  Like HD the 3D path is also paved and will be a common feature, albeit as a complimentary to HD, but never the less a common feature with hardware and contents readily available, IMHO.

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  Reply # 329123 11-May-2010 20:33
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Dunnersfella: As a side note, NZ TV's don't do 240Hz, or 120Hz for that matter.
American TV's do - NZ TV's run at 50, 100 or 200Hz.
Watching HD Nation will confuse you a bit in this regards, but remember, confusing 240 vs 200Hz won't make a jot of difference to your viewing experience, its just a bit of confusing techno-babble.

Oh and while true 3D content isn't around yet, a TV that converts 2D to 3D is going to go part way to getting people on board.
I think Plasma will be best for 3D, so Pana should lead the way with 'true 3D' content, but the Samsung plasmas will be big sellers due to their 2D to 3D conversion. Sony still haven't got it dialled, with them only demo'ing 100Hz TV's in Sony Style stores. It's totally watchable though, and in the real world most people will never notice the difference unless they're told to look for it (and so manufacturers can sell 'the next model up').
It's all hit the market much quicker than many people expected (I hadn't heard anything about Samsung's tech until I saw one in a store) - so the 20 year turn adoption rate seems a little out for me - I'd expect uptake to be a bit quicker... say 10 years. Especially as the pricing seems to be pretty sharp - all things considering.


Blu-ray content is 24fps (mostly), so TVs that can handle 120Hz or 240Hz may do a better job at displaying the content. This, of course, is to the keen eye only. Most consumers shouldn't (and won't) ever pay attention to it.

If I'm not mistaken, TV broadcasts are 29.97fps. If that's correct, wouldn't 120Hz TVs do a better job at that as well?

This one I'm not certain, though.


Kiwipixter: Good points.  But if you compare 3D with HD contents and hardware availability 3D has come along way in a very short time.  3D display standard was rectified pretty quickly, as was 3D bluray for playback of stored contents.  So for movie contents the path for 3D was paved pretty quickly, and with 3D movies currently riding on a wave of popularity we'll see equivalent bluray releases a common place.

HD on the other hand took nearly 10 years to become mainstream.  I first heard of HD back around 1998, not long after DVD was released, yet HD availability only happened in the last couple of years.

So for numerous reasons HD path was paved much slower, but its paved and we are seeing HD becoming a standard feature.  Like HD the 3D path is also paved and will be a common feature, albeit as a complimentary to HD, but never the less a common feature with hardware and contents readily available, IMHO.


Bear in mind I'm not debating whether 3D will catch on or not. It definitely will. I'm only pointing out that we barely have HD content available from broadcasters right now, and buying a 3DTV just to wait for the content to arrive seems a bit of wasted money. By the time the content is available, better (and possibly cheaper) models will be around.




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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 329128 11-May-2010 20:44
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If manufactures can process a good quality 3D image out of a regular 2D broadcast, (like the Samsung's) then its not going to matter if 3D specific broadcasts are a couple years away.

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Master Geek
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  Reply # 329130 11-May-2010 20:45
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Dunnersfella: 

....

As a side note, NZ TV's don't do 240Hz, or 120Hz for that matter.
American TV's do - NZ TV's run at 50, 100 or 200Hz.
Watching HD Nation will confuse you a bit in this regards, but remember, confusing 240 vs 200Hz won't make a jot of difference to your viewing experience, its just a bit of confusing techno-babble.


I think the 3D standard specifies a minimum refresh rate but manufacturers can implement higher rates.  This is one of the reasons why you can't use different glasses on different 3D displays.


Sony still haven't got it dialled, with them only demo'ing 100Hz TV's in Sony Style stores. It's totally watchable though, and in the real world most people will never notice the difference unless they're told to look for it (and so manufacturers can sell 'the next model up').


Its not just about refresh rate, 3D displays also require HDMI 1.4 to accept 1080p 3D streams from bluray contents amongst other requirements.   There should be a 3D TV logo on official 3D displays. 

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  Reply # 329135 11-May-2010 20:59
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magu:
Dunnersfella: As a side note, NZ TV's don't do 240Hz, or 120Hz for that matter.
American TV's do - NZ TV's run at 50, 100 or 200Hz.
Watching HD Nation will confuse you a bit in this regards, but remember, confusing 240 vs 200Hz won't make a jot of difference to your viewing experience, its just a bit of confusing techno-babble.

Oh and while true 3D content isn't around yet, a TV that converts 2D to 3D is going to go part way to getting people on board.
I think Plasma will be best for 3D, so Pana should lead the way with 'true 3D' content, but the Samsung plasmas will be big sellers due to their 2D to 3D conversion. Sony still haven't got it dialled, with them only demo'ing 100Hz TV's in Sony Style stores. It's totally watchable though, and in the real world most people will never notice the difference unless they're told to look for it (and so manufacturers can sell 'the next model up').
It's all hit the market much quicker than many people expected (I hadn't heard anything about Samsung's tech until I saw one in a store) - so the 20 year turn adoption rate seems a little out for me - I'd expect uptake to be a bit quicker... say 10 years. Especially as the pricing seems to be pretty sharp - all things considering.


Blu-ray content is 24fps (mostly), so TVs that can handle 120Hz or 240Hz may do a better job at displaying the content. This, of course, is to the keen eye only. Most consumers shouldn't (and won't) ever pay attention to it.

If I'm not mistaken, TV broadcasts are 29.97fps. If that's correct, wouldn't 120Hz TVs do a better job at that as well?

This one I'm not certain, though.


Kiwipixter: Good points.  But if you compare 3D with HD contents and hardware availability 3D has come along way in a very short time.  3D display standard was rectified pretty quickly, as was 3D bluray for playback of stored contents.  So for movie contents the path for 3D was paved pretty quickly, and with 3D movies currently riding on a wave of popularity we'll see equivalent bluray releases a common place.

HD on the other hand took nearly 10 years to become mainstream.  I first heard of HD back around 1998, not long after DVD was released, yet HD availability only happened in the last couple of years.

So for numerous reasons HD path was paved much slower, but its paved and we are seeing HD becoming a standard feature.  Like HD the 3D path is also paved and will be a common feature, albeit as a complimentary to HD, but never the less a common feature with hardware and contents readily available, IMHO.


Bear in mind I'm not debating whether 3D will catch on or not. It definitely will. I'm only pointing out that we barely have HD content available from broadcasters right now, and buying a 3DTV just to wait for the content to arrive seems a bit of wasted money. By the time the content is available, better (and possibly cheaper) models will be around.


Understood.  I am too waiting for contents, and for the price to come down a bit.  That avatar and some of those pixar movies will do nicely.  Laughing  3D sports broadcast will be icing on the cake, but somehow i don't think Sky will do it without charging an arm and a leg for it.



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  Reply # 335790 28-May-2010 13:58
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Just been down to Smiths City in Christchurch (Colombo St Store). They now have a 3D Panasonic Plasma showing a 3D Sports Blu-ray.

Its HD and wow it looked impressive. They had to get it in from Japan and have it running through a transformer as its set for Japan's 100V electricity supply.

In the 10 minutes I was watching it, I would happily sit through a 1-3 hour sporting event wearing those glasses, It even looked better than Avatar as I remember.

I can't wait to have a go with some 3D shooting or racing games.

From the sound of it the Panasonic's are still a month away at the earliest, probably 2 months.

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  Reply # 335804 28-May-2010 14:46
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Natively 24 fps is not fast enough to show slow panning shots smoothly, hence the TV's that create an additional intermediate frame or two to try and smooth the transition between each real frame.

Bluray is 24 fps.
Surely if each eye is to see it's own image then the overall required framerate of the TV must be 48fps to be comparible.

Either way the throughput is going to be increased, hence the hdmi v1.4 standard.  As I understood it though the true 3D standard had not yet been finalised so I'm kind of curious to see TV's out this fast too.  I'd hate to buy one now only to find it's not compatible in a few years once they finally produced a definitive standard....

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