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753 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #524680 22-Sep-2011 16:38
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ilovemusic: Yes but a VT still outperforms a GT...


If both are used with out of the box settings, then I think that is highly debatable. Especially in a bright room where the darker VT will suffer with its reduced light output.

1305 posts

Uber Geek


  #524959 23-Sep-2011 11:25
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Anyone who buys a $4k TV and doesn't pay attention to operating conditions like ambient lighting is just wasting their money.

Under controlled conditions the performance differences between VT and GT in out-of-the-box THX mode are incontrovertible.

The only thing debatable is whether the differences matter to the individual user.

 
 
 
 


753 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #524977 23-Sep-2011 11:58
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ilovemusic: Anyone who buys a $4k TV and doesn't pay attention to operating conditions like ambient lighting is just wasting their money.


Most buyers would fit into that catagory. They are happy to buy with the assurance that it is the flagship model with the best performance, but beyond that, they have no real insight as to what that performance looks like.
They are generally more concerned with how the TV looks and can understand 'one sheet of glass', 'thinner profile', 'darker filter' etc because they can easily see and compare this with other models.

Under controlled conditions the performance differences between VT and GT in out-of-the-box THX mode are incontrovertible.


Please give examples. I find THX's low gamma to be a major letdown on both models. And the VT will suffer during the day. Thats not something a lot of people have much control over as most people don't have blackout conditions and wouldn't even desire using them during the middle of the day.

The only thing debatable is whether the differences matter to the individual user.


Thats a good excuse that allows one to justify their purchasing decisions.

1305 posts

Uber Geek


  #525329 24-Sep-2011 14:21
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Hi,

I sat in on a VT and GT comparison run by an experienced videophile looking for a one piece display device.

Out of the box THX mode was used as these were brand new panels.

The low gamma is only a problem if you can't control your viewing environment.

The VT produced better blacks and contrast, almost on par with my Pioneer Kuro.

Along with better colour, grayscale and better 24p playback.

The VT stayed and the GT went back to the store.

Next step is to run the Calman auto-calibration system.



33 posts

Geek


  #525334 24-Sep-2011 14:46
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ilovemusic: Hi,

I sat in on a VT and GT comparison run by an experienced videophile looking for a one piece display device.
Next step is to run the Calman auto-calibration system.


Isn't the VT the only one that is one piece glass?

What is a "Calman auto-calibration system"?

Remember the original quaestion wwas..would you pick between the 42" VT or go for the 46"GT...it was not asking to compare a 50'VT with a 50"GT

1305 posts

Uber Geek


  #525337 24-Sep-2011 14:59
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Yes.

The original Q was answered - VT over GT for the picky viewer.

CalMan calibration in action...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mwphqjqcsg

Pretty amazing, a full cal in about 10min compared with upwards of an hour for a manual cal.

Unfortunately it's professional only, the DIY version does not support auto-calibration.

50VT vs 50GT was in answer to fahrenheit's Q.

753 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #525339 24-Sep-2011 15:05
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ilovemusic:
Out of the box THX mode was used as these were brand new panels.


These panels settle in after 400-500 hours. Judging anything other than panel uniformity is best left till after that period. Even then, uniformity issues can clean themselves up over that period.

The low gamma is only a problem if you can't control your viewing environment.


No, a mode like THX which has no user adjustable gamma means you are stuck with a setting that rises too quickly out of black. No viewing environment is going to help the fact that you can see information in shadow areas which you shouldn't.

Next step is to run the Calman auto-calibration system.


Last I heard, auto cal doesn't function properly based on how these panels behave. You can hit all the data points and have perfect readings, but the end result is an unwatchable mess. This is what pro calibrators have been struggling with and they've had to come up with different workflows to get around it.
SpectraCal may have fixed it, but I've not seen any reports that they have.

Lets not debate what might be. We both know which is the better panel. The VT. But there are conditions that need to be met before that potential can be tapped. There is more to consider than raw performance and potential. Lets not lose sight of that. A 42" VT30 is not bang for buck. Its terribly overpriced for what it is and it is still hampered by the same problems that all of this years series share.

 
 
 
 


1305 posts

Uber Geek


  #525536 25-Sep-2011 12:46
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No one said the VT was the best bang for the buck.

As stated earlier, if you can't be bothered making an effort at setup and environment then you're wasting your money.

If Calman results in an unwatchable mess then why is the system so popular amongst professionals and the home theatre press ?

They can't all be blind ?

753 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #525553 25-Sep-2011 13:49
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ilovemusic:
As stated earlier, if you can't be bothered making an effort at setup and environment then you're wasting your money.


Who is going to setup the OP's VT properly for them? Its very easy for you to say that, but I'm not hearing how this is to be accomplished? As I've said, these aren't amatuer friendly panels to dial in. They aren't even pro-friendly. I don't disagree with your sentiments at all, but I do have to point out that it is not as easy as it sounds.

If Calman results in an unwatchable mess then why is the system so popular amongst professionals and the home theatre press ?

They can't all be blind ?


Lets be clear, I was speaking specifically about the auto calibration system (which uses control between calman software over the TV's ethernet port). Calman Pro/Standard can still be used to do traditional (manual) calibration on these panels with excellent results, but it still needs a different approach to get acceptable results.




33 posts

Geek


  #525557 25-Sep-2011 14:17
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I was just going to set up the TV myself....no real experience re this

753 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #525558 25-Sep-2011 14:27
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chovik: I was just going to set up the TV myself....no real experience re this


Which is precisely why I suggested the larger GT over the smaller VT.
Just my opinion of course.

1 post

Wannabe Geek


  #558443 15-Dec-2011 20:10
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The VT30 is a great Plasma and I enjoy the performance of our 65 inch. Auto calibration has mean mentioned this tread, but regretfully the facility has not been turn on yet. I have purchase all the CalMAN gear from Spectracal to be able to do auto calibration, but it don't work. The VT30 is only set up for auto calibration in the UK and North America. Currently those are the only models set up by Panasonic UK & North America in conjunction with CalMAN to do it automatically. My contact in CalMAN advised that as yet Panasonic Asia have not joined the Party. I have been on to Panasonic New Zealand and I have been advised that they have set the wheels in motion. They need as much pressure as possible applied to them to get it to happen quickly. If there is no response by mid January I propose to lodge a Complaint with the Commerce Department for false advertising as Panasonic's Connect Magazine plainly implies that one can do auto calibration, while it doesn’t say it in writing the picture plainly implies it.

 This is my 2nd try to post this post. But after writing it the first time when I went to post I founf I had been logged out. So if it appears twice I'm sorry

305 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #558925 17-Dec-2011 10:15
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I was in the same situation last week, decided to get the GT based entirely on extra size for the same money.
It looks awesome and in the living room I can't compare it with the VT.



33 posts

Geek


  #558935 17-Dec-2011 11:14
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My GT has a problem where the background when goes from light and dark changes dramatically ..ie sceen overall lightens up if their is a dark background..very annoying..is this normal? almost as if there is some automatic setting that is doing this

753 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #558941 17-Dec-2011 11:51
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chovik: My GT has a problem where the background when goes from light and dark changes dramatically ..ie sceen overall lightens up if their is a dark background..very annoying..is this normal? almost as if there is some automatic setting that is doing this


It sadly is one of the major problems with the models this year. It is known as 'fluctuating brightness' within the enthusiast community but Panasonic have a few different internal names for it.
The first thing I would check would be to make sure your firmware is up to date as firmware fixes in Australia have been rolled out AFAIK which lessen the issue in many cases.

US owners have available to them a comprehensive fix in the form of A-board replacements, but the rest of the world (i.e. us) got screwed. Post-August builds were apparently addressed at the factory level, so if I were in your shoes, I'd be taking the TV back to the retailer and demand a unit that is made after August.

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