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428 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 213081 7-May-2009 10:11
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"There is no such thing as bad publicity"




I was a geek before the word was invented!

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  # 213082 7-May-2009 10:16
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Old Grey Geek: By taking Telecom to court Vodafone was always going to win, it has the bigger legal budget, it could have dragged this out for months, all at Telecom's expence.



I disagree entirely. Some of the arguments, statements and comments made by Vodafone's legal team were nothing but laughable. On that basis Telecom could have easily won points by presenting solid facts.

I can see a huge irony in that while the expensive lawyers are in court trying to claim Telecom had no issue that the engineers were busy nutting out a technical solution - a solution that they already seemed to be aware of as they had already set targets of the end of May to install filters on affected sites.

Expensive lawyers FTW..

 
 
 
 


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  # 213083 7-May-2009 10:17
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kiwitrc:

Yeah Telecom are going to spend a huge amount of money to install filters and delay their network launch because they are in the right and are only doing it because they are nice guys.

Anyone for a Tui?


You've never been sued before, have you?  Divorced?  Obviously not.

Being "right" has nothing at all to do with it.  Deciding that it isn't worth (too expensive) arguing over does.

Every day in the launch date has an actual dollar value attached to it, so it becomes some pretty simple math.  If you consider that post-launch, TNZ would conceivably expect to end up with 50% of the market after 2 years.  So, going from 30%->50% means....

TNZ 2008 mobile revenue = NZ$201m/30*50 = 335m, or an additional 135m/yr.

Therefore, a days delay is ~NZ$360,000.

Even without knowing how much a filter costs, it's pretty easy to see that the benefits of just "getting it done" outweigh the cost of litigation.




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  # 213086 7-May-2009 10:21
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jpollock:
kiwitrc:

Yeah Telecom are going to spend a huge amount of money to install filters and delay their network launch because they are in the right and are only doing it because they are nice guys.

Anyone for a Tui?


You've never been sued before, have you?  Divorced?  Obviously not.

Being "right" has nothing at all to do with it.  Deciding that it isn't worth (too expensive) arguing over does.



Quoted For Truth. +1 insight for this man.

Cheers - N




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Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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  # 213087 7-May-2009 10:24
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It will be particularly interesting to see if the filters solve all the issues. I suspect they won't, at which point Vodafones equipment will be shown up for what it is... I wonder how they will stop the exodus from their network from continuing then? And who will be blamed next? Any way you look at it Telecom keeps on winning - again and again and again.

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Master Geek


  # 213088 7-May-2009 10:26
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I don't think either companies have fans, more a question of which one you despise the least.

.


Gold!!

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Uber Geek


  # 213089 7-May-2009 10:28
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Telecom admitted their network was causing interference (both in court and prior to the court case in the CEOs press release) so I'm not sure why anybody would say that they claimed otherwise. (the extent of the interference and who was responsible for fixing it was the matter in dispute)

The main contentious issue for Telecom was their claim that if Voda have been aware of the interference for so long, as they claimed, why wait until only 10 days before launch to bring it up? and why go straight to court when a mediation would have been more sensible? Going to court just makes them sound childish and petty (as if they knew that mentioning the extent of the interference sooner would give telecom time to implement fixes long before launch, whereas saving it up for a few days before launch forces Telecom to delay their network and look bad)

It does seem a little odd to me that voda rejected mediation just a couple of days before the case (from the herald) "Vodafone spokesman Paul Brislen said it was too late to keep the matter out of court with mediation",
and then proceeded to settle out of court in the end, that has basically the same result as the mediation would have done (i.e. the sensible result).


 
 
 
 


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Ultimate Geek

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  # 213092 7-May-2009 10:32
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Telecom caused interference but are within the limits allowed according to their spectrum licence (according to them - did MED ever say this?) so aren't liable from that perspective.

So the injuction is over-and-above the spectrum licence rules. Therefore even though they are ok by their licence, Telecom agrees that they are causing interference and agrees to install filters to avoid losing the injunction and being forced to pay damages and costs. (Can't have Vodafone's customers not being able to call 111 now can we?)

If this is the case then perhaps the licence conditions aren't sufficient for such close proximity (frequency wise) of PMP TXs and RXs.





 

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  # 213093 7-May-2009 10:34
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w2krules: "There is no such thing as bad publicity"


The directors of San Lu Milk Powder may disagree.

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  # 213094 7-May-2009 10:35
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NonprayingMantis: Telecom admitted their network was causing interference (both in court and prior to the court case in the CEOs press release) so I'm not sure why anybody would say that they claimed otherwise. (the extent of the interference and who was responsible for fixing it was the matter in dispute)

The main contentious issue for Telecom was their claim that if Voda have been aware of the interference for so long, as they claimed, why wait until only 10 days before launch to bring it up? and why go straight to court when a mediation would have been more sensible? Going to court just makes them sound childish and petty (as if they knew that mentioning the extent of the interference sooner would give telecom time to implement fixes long before launch, whereas saving it up for a few days before launch forces Telecom to delay their network and look bad)

It does seem a little odd to me that voda rejected mediation just a couple of days before the case (from the herald) "Vodafone spokesman Paul Brislen said it was too late to keep the matter out of court with mediation", and then proceeded to settle out of court in the end, that has basically the same result as the mediation would have done (i.e. the sensible result).


They have been working on this since the start of the year. Vodafone wanted to get it resolved before the launch. Telecom didn't. When Telecom brought the launch date forward Vodafone believed that the only way to get it resolved was to go to court to get more time.





 

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  # 213120 7-May-2009 11:30
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I have not noticed any degradation apart from usual outage stuff with Vodafones network either in good coverage or fringe rual coverage at either 900MHZ umts, or 2100 MHz and I have a few things reliant on the 3G system. Running a spec analyser OTA showed nothing unusual either though that is hardly scientific. I wonder if Vodafone have filters on their network?

I'm usually the first to open my mouth when it starts to fail.

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  # 213126 7-May-2009 11:55
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paradoxsm: I have not noticed any degradation apart from usual outage stuff with Vodafones network either in good coverage or fringe rual coverage at either 900MHZ umts, or 2100 MHz and I have a few things reliant on the 3G system. Running a spec analyser OTA showed nothing unusual either though that is hardly scientific. I wonder if Vodafone have filters on their network?



I'm usually the first to open my mouth when it starts to fail.

I believe the issue only affected Vodafone's 900GSM. Which would also have appeared to effect 3G as phone switch between the two.
I typically have my phone locked to 3G, and have not noticed the impact of this interference.





Chorus has spent $1.4 billion on making their xDSL broadband network faster and even more now as they are upgrading their rural Conklins. If your still stuck on ADSL or VDSL, why not spend $195 on a master filter install to make sure you are getting the most out of your connection?
I install - Naked DSL, DSL Master Splitters, VoIP, data cabling and general computer support for home and small business.
Rural Broadband RBI installer for Ultimate Broadband and Full Flavour

 

Need help in Auckland, Waikato or BoP? Click my email button, or email me direct: [my user name] at geekzonemail dot com


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Wannabe Geek


2 posts

Wannabe Geek


  # 213131 7-May-2009 12:26
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I was really looking forward to the XT launch, now Vodafones insecurities have got in the way! It really does show how worried they are.

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