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4176 posts

Uber Geek

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  # 300857 21-Feb-2010 22:53
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nitrotech: I have heard these comments from multiple people but surely there needs to be some minimum standard of performance from a 'broadband' plan.

If telecom want to sell it as broadband for local traffic and dialup for international then that would more accurately describe the plan.

Yep your correct you can go to another plan but remember the cost of the 40gb plan on telecom is +20 over big time, doesn't quite seem fair when people are downloading terrabytes of data per month on big time for the cheaper price and therefore creating slower speeds for all on the plan.

Lots of people who only use small amounts of data are on the plan because they know that even when the family comes to visit they are not going to be stung with overage fees, these people deserve better from this plan.

Telecom is obviously happy with the performance of the plan, likely none of their staff have actually used it, the only way I can see this being sorted is for CC to provide a minimum performance level for a plan to be called 'broadband.

I believe robust discussion in forums such as these is a catalyst for change, just my 2c.


I enjoy reasonable debate :-)

First of all, there are lots of Telecom staff on the plan - and no, before anyone asks, they get exactly the same experience as any other Telecom Retail customer. There is no special treatment given to staff members on Bigtime. I'm sure most people here know it, but in the interests of full disclosure I am a Telecom staff member and I am on Bigtime. While I am personally happy with the performance, I also have a second ADSL line (on a non-shaped plan) because I like to download heaps, and I also like to have the fastest possible connection at any time of the day or night. Currently I don't believe there's a single plan (from any NZ ISP) that satisfies both requirements until you start talking many $$$

Telecom do fairly advertise the plan. We got bitten with Go Large, and the marketing material has always been very up front on Bigtime about the traffic shaping.

For the case where someone who "only use small amounts of data are on the plan because they know that even when the family comes to visit they are not going to be stung with overage fees", there are other plans available form many ISPs... In fact, The Telecom Adventure plan has 20GB monthly allowance, and if you hit the cap, then the speeds drops to dialup speed but there is no overage to be stung with. Other ISPs have plans with lower overage options as well.

Absolutely no-one has a gun to their head and are being MADE to get Bigtime. If the CC came in and dropped some requirements for a plan to be called Broadband, and those requirements weren't being met by Bigtime, then Telecoms alternatives would be to either raise the price of the plan to fund improvements, or to stop calling it Broadband. (Note I am nothing to do with Product Management - this is just personal opinion)

People need to remember that Telecom isn't a charity - we have shareholders to answer to, as do most other ISPs. Plans need to be profitable or else they won't get offered, or won't last long in the market.

Bigtime really suits some people very very well, and others, not so much. The only real problem seems to be where some customers seem to want to have an unlimited all you can eat plan, and also have all (or most) of the benefits of a non-shaped plan - but don't want to pay any extra. (And those that say "Well, I'd pay $10/month extra to have shaping disabled" etc are just dreaming... If an unshaped, unlimited broadband plan made economic sense in New Zealand , don't you think all ISPs would offer it?)

How many ISPs off unlimited use plans? How many of those don't have shaping?

Unfortunately, No ISP can afford to run Broadband plans at huge losses. Telecom is no exception - sorry.

Cheers - N




--

 

Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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  # 300862 21-Feb-2010 23:04
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I agree, a robust discussion is needed, but I fear that the facts are being diluted in this long thread.

Nitrotech has said international is dialup speed. Therefore all international traffic for him, and others who have quoted similarly can only achieve 7KB/sec in aggregate. I can tell you that Go Large was at times heavily P2P shaped, but much better then dialup. Big Tme, when shaped is far, far higher than that. You will find in these threads that users saw when shaping kicked in, their Rapidshare and P2P slowed to 180 KB/sec.

I have had users complaining that they only get 5 KB/sec, but I check theur usage stats for diagnosis only to see anywhere between 500Mb and 2Gb per day.............And yes, the 2Gb per day was one I recall well.

We have many users on Big Time and the issues from them are low. I see that from the contacts we get. I know our shaping is generous, and unless the user has an issue with their connection, their speed issue is not Big Time. Certainly if one of your internet activities IS performing poorly, tell us.

Yes, there were and are gaming issues for some titles, but Doozy has worked on this, and that has improved.

Days ago, on this thread, a user wondered why we offer an unlimited plan if we shape P2P and Rapidshare. My goodness. We brought in Go Large so that those individuals and familes who find the then 10Gb plan was not enough, the unlimited plan would allow then to enjoy the internet with no concerns of speed throttling, and they have price certainty. All the browsing, email, photo uploads, game demos, movie trailers, etc, etc that they want. Our unlimited plans were NOT devised for filesharing. In fact, if filesharing did not exist, there is no real need for shaping.

But, having said this, the shaping is generous, and many users use it well. It does NOT run at dialup for international.

I appreciate that some users have genuine issues, but given that Big Time shaping is generous, serious speed concers are another issue. By all means contact us if you are in that situation.

Talkiet and I work for Telecom, but we are up front and open, not biased as we work there, but if you want P2P unshaped or lowly shaped 24/7, then Big Time is not the plan for you, so please change to a better plan, where ever that may exist. Yes, my team has BT users, but they use the plan for what it is, they know its shaped, and unshaped or less shaped after hours.

Finally, if Nitrotech is only achieving dialup speed on all of his/her international downloading traffic, he/she can PM me and I can run some checks on the connection.

Cheers all




 
 
 
 


1273 posts

Uber Geek


  # 300870 21-Feb-2010 23:45
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We get speeds slightly faster than dialup (~80kbit/s) for single (and sometimes double) threaded international downloads.







rm *


4176 posts

Uber Geek

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  # 300871 21-Feb-2010 23:50
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Detruire: We get speeds slightly faster than dialup (~80kbit/s) for single (and sometimes double) threaded international downloads.





From what server and using what protocol? I barely ever see speeds that low, but I normally go out of my way to find NZ mirrors for content where possible.

Cheers - N




--

 

Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


1273 posts

Uber Geek


  # 300872 22-Feb-2010 00:02
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These are the two I remember having the biggest issues with.

http://www.thomsonbroadbandpartner.com/getfile.php?id=4864
ftp://ftp.saitek.com/pub/software/full/Saitek_P2600_Rumble_Pad_SD6_32.exe

Trying again a minute ago, the Thomson guide was going at ~20kBps and the driver at ~2kBps. (The last time I tried it was ~10PM last week)

My friend was trying to download this http://www.gamershell.com/download_33916.shtml about 20 minutes ago (and tried servers in USA, Germany, and Canada) and was getting speeds ~10kBps.




rm *


681 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 300875 22-Feb-2010 00:35
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Detruire: These are the two I remember having the biggest issues with.

http://www.thomsonbroadbandpartner.com/getfile.php?id=4864
ftp://ftp.saitek.com/pub/software/full/Saitek_P2600_Rumble_Pad_SD6_32.exe

Trying again a minute ago, the Thomson guide was going at ~20kBps and the driver at ~2kBps. (The last time I tried it was ~10PM last week)

My friend was trying to download this http://www.gamershell.com/download_33916.shtml about 20 minutes ago (and tried servers in USA, Germany, and Canada) and was getting speeds ~10kBps.


Some times its not at your broadband providers end.

There are quite a few servers out there that are overloaded.

I DLed the FTP at home (on big time) and via wget to my linux server in LA and both did not go over 70KB/s (i constantly get 40~mbps off my LA server).

Also realise Gamers Shell is a business, they are trying to sell you access to their speedier servers so you will be slowed down by them.

1273 posts

Uber Geek


  # 300877 22-Feb-2010 00:54
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ArcticSilver: I DLed the FTP at home (on big time) and via wget to my linux server in LA and both did not go over 70KB/s (i constantly get 40~mbps off my LA server).

I was getting ~840kBps to the server I downloaded it to before it finished.

ArcticSilver: Also realise Gamers Shell is a business, they are trying to sell you access to their speedier servers so you will be slowed down by them.

Slowed down to <200k? I don't think so; it'd give an awful impression of their service.




rm *


 
 
 
 


10 posts

Wannabe Geek


  # 300895 22-Feb-2010 07:50
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Talkjet and tdgeek: are you saying that I should have been able to stream basic audio podcasts from the BBC on BigTime without constant buffering? My experience was simple. Pre-BigTime on a BB Pro plan, I saw perfect streaming 99% of the time, and RS D/Ls ran @ 1.6Mbps. The instant I moved to BigTime, BBC (and any other streaming media provider you care to mention) audio streaming was unusable (and I'm not exaggerating). RS fell back to ~160Kbps, which I'd be quite happy to live with, but it was the streaming podcasts that were the final nail in the coffin for me and I returned to BB Pro after my 2-day experiment.

518 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 300897 22-Feb-2010 08:00
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nitrotech:
Talkiet:
Really? You plan to stay on a service that you don't like, that you feel is performing so badly that you deserve service credits? A service which CLEARLY states that it's not suitable for all users and can be shaped at any time?

Although I am totally open to correction, it would seem that the best move is to move to a Broadband plan that more closely meets your needs. Telecom and many other ISPs offer plans that would probably suit your needs better.

Or you could keep complaining, and not vote with your wallet.

Cheers - N


I have heard these comments from multiple people but surely there needs to be some minimum standard of performance from a 'broadband' plan.

If telecom want to sell it as broadband for local traffic and dialup for international then that would more accurately describe the plan.

Yep your correct you can go to another plan but remember the cost of the 40gb plan on telecom is +20 over big time, doesn't quite seem fair when people are downloading terrabytes of data per month on big time for the cheaper price and therefore creating slower speeds for all on the plan.

Lots of people who only use small amounts of data are on the plan because they know that even when the family comes to visit they are not going to be stung with overage fees, these people deserve better from this plan.

Telecom is obviously happy with the performance of the plan, likely none of their staff have actually used it, the only way I can see this being sorted is for CC to provide a minimum performance level for a plan to be called 'broadband.

I believe robust discussion in forums such as these is a catalyst for change, just my 2c.


But some of the employees at Telecom do use Big Time





PC: 3.3ghz Core i5-2500, 8gb DDR3, ATI Radeon 5850, 27" QHD IPS Monitor

Mobile Phone: iPhone 5 32gb Graphite.


1054 posts

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# 301012 22-Feb-2010 14:45
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Just fix World of Warcraft and my household will be very happy.... being one of the most played games I'm very surprised that this is one game that is unplayable on Big Time. 







245 posts

Master Geek

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  # 301014 22-Feb-2010 14:50
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Lurch: Just fix World of Warcraft and my household will be very happy.... being one of the most played games I'm very surprised that this is one game that is a fail on Big Time. 








There's been a specific rule for WoW since late december, I would recommend Smoothping or WoWTunnels to anyone on any plan on any ISP playing WoW though, works wonders!




Tarawera Ultra 2015 done, bring on 2016

msn

43 posts

Geek


  # 301041 22-Feb-2010 16:04
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Hey doozy, Ive been getting ping spikes playing counterstrike source ever since I switched to big time, Would there be a program like Smoothping to fix this?

681 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 301042 22-Feb-2010 16:06
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msn: Hey doozy, Ive been getting ping spikes playing counterstrike source ever since I switched to big time, Would there be a program like Smoothping to fix this?


Ring up technical support, this is not a issue smoothping will fix.

Also realise that torrenting may cause this (if you are torrenting?)

msn

43 posts

Geek


  # 301044 22-Feb-2010 16:12
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Nah no one has been torrenting over the network. Might call them up later today then.

1054 posts

Uber Geek


  # 301045 22-Feb-2010 16:14
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doozy:
Lurch: Just fix World of Warcraft and my household will be very happy.... being one of the most played games I'm very surprised that this is one game that is a fail on Big Time. 



There's been a specific rule for WoW since late december, I would recommend Smoothping or WoWTunnels to anyone on any plan on any ISP playing WoW though, works wonders!


Thanks for that but as I mentioned in a previous post wowtunnels etc is not resolving the problem. Specific rule isn't working ??? Only change I've made is switching to Big Time from Adventure... straight away you notice the difference. Lag spikes, high latency.... unplayable.

Time to log another ticket I guess.  On a side note is FTP shaped also? Speeds seem okay after midnight, then around midday onwards start to drop down.

I notice that hotfile, megaupload, and rapidshare are shapped to un-useable. Web browsing from around 3pm onwards is a little hit and miss at times too :-)

Kind of reminds me of the old Slingshot message threads I use to read :-/ Ah well.



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