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13 posts

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  # 450551 21-Mar-2011 22:50
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sbiddle:
boost3d:
Which is my point, why migrate users when the DSL service is not active in the Roadside Cabinet.
Since the Roadside Cabinet doesn’t connect to the Exchange via Fibre, they don’t have to wait until all customers have been migrated first. The added copper length is because the Roadside Cabinet can’t run DSL yet so it uses the Copper back to the local Exchange.





There is a migration process for every cabinet.  In the case of *EVERY* cabinet cutover *ALL* customers will experience a period of possibly degraded service. MPF's have to often be cut to join them into the new MDF's for exchange and customer wiring in the cabinet. You obviously have no appreciation for the time and skill required to do this. The cabinet connects to the exchange via both fibre and copper. The copper is maintained only for legacy voice services, and in some cabinets is not retained at all and voice is run over fibre using VMUX's at both ends.

It's obvious you're in the situation you're in because of a fault that has lead Chorus to move forward work since the cabinet was already planned.
  
Every whisper cabinet has fibre going to it, I'm not sure what part of this you don't understand as you've repeatedly made the claim that they don't. There are older passive and first generation active roadside cabinets (typically with Conklin DSLAM's) that don't have fibre as these are fed via E1's.

You also mentioned splitters - if you're running plug in ADSL filters in your house you are probably receiving sub optimal ADSL performance. A master ADSL filter/splitter is the only way to guarantee you're receiving the maximum speed your line allows as poor internal house wiring is one of the biggest factors of ADSL performance. 

While your speeds may be lower I fail to see any of the points you are making. Once your cabinet is upgraded you'll probably experience the joys of 16Mbps + sync speeds.
  



There is a migration process for every cabinet.  In the case of *EVERY* cabinet cutover *ALL* customers will experience a period of possibly degraded service.

I realise that when the MPF is cutover there is downtime.

MPF's have to often be cut to join them into the new MDF's for exchange and customer wiring in the cabinet. You obviously have no appreciation for the time and skill required to do this.

I took about 1.5 hours from when the Tech called to say he is about to cutover and my service was restored. I’m not a Telecom field Tech so I wouldn’t have an appreciation of the skill required to re-terminate a copper wire or 2.

The cabinet connects to the exchange via both fibre and copper. The copper is maintained only for legacy voice services, and in some cabinets is not retained at all and voice is run over fibre using VMUX's at both ends.

I checked and yes you are correct, the Roadside cabinets do connect back to the local exchange via Fibre when it has been installed. According to Telecom not all Roadside Cabinets have Fibre yet, just going on what was in the email.

It's obvious you're in the situation you're in because of a fault that has lead Chorus to move forward work since the cabinet was already planned.

Obvious?  Telecom said in their email ‘The area you are in is currently going through the cabinetisation process’ From that I don’t think they moved forward the work. I don’t know what Chorus was doing outside my house that caused my fault. My neighbour got the Telecom Techs outside our homes to reconnect her straight away after she noticed her phone was not working. Telecom Xtra / CTS and Chorus couldn’t agree on how I was connected. It took from the start / middle of February until the 15th March until I had confirmation.

Every whisper cabinet has fibre going to it, I'm not sure what part of this you don't understand as you've repeatedly made the claim that they don't. There are older passive and first generation active roadside cabinets (typically with Conklin DSLAM's) that don't have fibre as these are fed via E1's.

My claim, I quoted Telecom who said not all Roadside Cabinets have Fibre connected YET. I suppose Jason Burns could have been misinformed as well.
Quote from telecom email ‘As the cabinet is not currently ready to act as a mini exchange, this resulted in additional cable distance between your home and the exchange which in turn has affected your connect rates.’

You also mentioned splitters - if you're running plug in ADSL filters in your house you are probably receiving sub optimal ADSL performance. A master ADSL filter/splitter is the only way to guarantee you're receiving the maximum speed your line allows as poor internal house wiring is one of the biggest factors of ADSL performance. 

Not sure why you brought that up as I stated in my email that the tech said the line was split with another house at the exchange or roadside Cabinet. I haven’t had written confirmation on this.

While your speeds may be lower I fail to see any of the points you are making. Once your cabinet is upgraded you'll probably experience the joys of 16Mbps + sync speeds.

That’s because my replies were meant to get info from Telecom not to jump the queue and get my broadband sorted before anyone else. I was interested in compensation for my time due to the missed appointments / Inconvenience.
I should have just posted the Telecom email about Fibre at the cabinets instead of the whole email as you asked me for confirmation.
I know that when Telecom can spare resources to liven the Roadside Cabinet I should have better speeds.

 

  

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  # 450556 21-Mar-2011 23:09
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Oblivian: What he said ^^

No point laying extra cables to a whole different cabinet and cutting them over 2-3 times when it can be done in 2 movements.

The Krones are all installed first, wired (when you lose connectivity) in pass-thru mode until the fibre is terminated, and the second half of the cabinet is populated with cards. At which time, the ISAM takes over the signalling.

Be thankfull you have a phone. My cable is broken in 5 places between the cabinet and the exchange. As a result, me and 8 other cabinets are on a pilot VoIP system

They have replaced blanking plates with VoIP cards, that generate a POTs signal to the house and use the fibre back to the NEAX in wellington :)

I couldn't make outgoing calls the past 2 days.

Pre cabinet 4-5mbps
Cabinet copper cutover 3-3.7mbps

2 weeks later, ISAM enabled. 14mbps (this was Nov 2009)


Thanks for the info. If the Fibre is not connected yet or the ISAM is not active, does that mean the DSL service is provided by the exchange?

 
 
 
 


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  # 450558 21-Mar-2011 23:14
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Most likely

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  # 450560 21-Mar-2011 23:17
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Yes, They seem to liven them up from the furthersest first based on what I have seen of the install process along the road from the exchange to me here.




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  # 450564 21-Mar-2011 23:49
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boost3d: [snipped everything]
  


You're arguing with someone that knows a lot more about this than you, and so far hasn't put a foot wrong in his descriptions of what happens.

I think you've mis-interpreted some info you've been given ,and some may not have been as clear as needed for someone not intimately familiar with the environment.

In any case, it really sounds like your connection is in an interim state and you should get much better speeds once cut across.

Bear in mind (and I haven't read your numerous and in depth replies in full) that depending on timing, you may have gotten unlucky with techs being pulled off to assist not only with Chch, but with taking up the slack around the country with so much resource in Chch right now.

A little patience and understanding is appreciated by all companies who are working to rebuild infrastructure in Christchurch.

A little perspective should show that your connection dropping from 10 to 5 mbps probably isn't (and shouldn't be) the top priority right now.

As Oblivian has pointed out, there were whole suburbs where massive amounts of work was required to even get voice services up and running again - At one stage the Navy literally filled up a frigate with Chorus vans and staff and brought them down.

Cheers - N





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Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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  # 450565 21-Mar-2011 23:53
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boost3d: Thanks for the info. If the Fibre is not connected yet or the ISAM is not active, does that mean the DSL service is provided by the exchange?


Yes. In this interim state the pairs go from your property to the cabinet (which may have no active ADSL equipment installed or powered up) and then each pair is connected back to the DSLAM in the exchange. This often results in degraded performance as there is usually a longer distance involved and more connections.

When the cabinet is fully configured, the ISAM in the cabinet acts as the DSLAM and there's only DSL between the cabinet and your house, with magic elves carrying packets further back in the network.

Cheers - N





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Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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  # 450602 22-Mar-2011 08:06
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Talkiet:
boost3d: [snipped everything]
  


You're arguing with someone that knows a lot more about this than you, and so far hasn't put a foot wrong in his descriptions of what happens.

I think you've mis-interpreted some info you've been given ,and some may not have been as clear as needed for someone not intimately familiar with the environment.

In any case, it really sounds like your connection is in an interim state and you should get much better speeds once cut across.

Bear in mind (and I haven't read your numerous and in depth replies in full) that depending on timing, you may have gotten unlucky with techs being pulled off to assist not only with Chch, but with taking up the slack around the country with so much resource in Chch right now.

A little patience and understanding is appreciated by all companies who are working to rebuild infrastructure in Christchurch.

A little perspective should show that your connection dropping from 10 to 5 mbps probably isn't (and shouldn't be) the top priority right now.

As Oblivian has pointed out, there were whole suburbs where massive amounts of work was required to even get voice services up and running again - At one stage the Navy literally filled up a frigate with Chorus vans and staff and brought them down.

Cheers - N




I’m not trying to argue with anyone about this issue. I provided an email from Telecom which stated ‘While Chorus is undergoing a nationwide upgrade to connect cabinets and exchanges by cable, not all cabinets have been upgraded to the fibre optic connections at this stage’ In hind sight I shouldn’t have copied my reply.
You say I may have misinterpreted some info, then my reply to Telecoms email is justified in that I wanted them to supply more info.
It’s obvious you haven’t read my posts or you wouldn’t have made those comments. My complaint was that It took 5 weeks to identify the problem, missed appointments, misinformation from Telecom and why customers are being migrated to roadside Cabinet’s before they are ‘live’ – I feel like I’m just repeating myself here. I asked for an email detailing my situation which I feel I’m justified in doing. I replied to the email as I felt it didn’t have enough detail and asked about their backout plan if any.
Patience ? Where have I said I expect Telecom to fix this issue now or given priority over other faults. I had accepted there will be delays before I asked for the email. 

 

 
 
 
 


13 posts

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  # 450607 22-Mar-2011 08:29
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Talkiet:
boost3d: Thanks for the info. If the Fibre is not connected yet or the ISAM is not active, does that mean the DSL service is provided by the exchange?


Yes. In this interim state the pairs go from your property to the cabinet (which may have no active ADSL equipment installed or powered up) and then each pair is connected back to the DSLAM in the exchange. This often results in degraded performance as there is usually a longer distance involved and more connections.

When the cabinet is fully configured, the ISAM in the cabinet acts as the DSLAM and there's only DSL between the cabinet and your house, with magic elves carrying packets further back in the network.

Cheers - N



Thanks for the info.
Are you able to say why the ISAM is not active prior to the migration? Is it that the gear is not available or the IP range needs to be cut over when all customers have been migrated?
If it's just that the equipment is not available or the technician has not activated something (Fibre?) surely it's best to wait before migrating customers.

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  # 450609 22-Mar-2011 08:37
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boost3d:
I’m not trying to argue with anyone about this issue. I provided an email from Telecom which stated ‘While Chorus is undergoing a nationwide upgrade to connect cabinets and exchanges by cable, not all cabinets have been upgraded to the fibre optic connections at this stage’ In hind sight I shouldn’t have copied my reply.
You say I may have misinterpreted some info, then my reply to Telecoms email is justified in that I wanted them to supply more info.
It’s obvious you haven’t read my posts or you wouldn’t have made those comments. My complaint was that It took 5 weeks to identify the problem, missed appointments, misinformation from Telecom and why customers are being migrated to roadside Cabinet’s before they are ‘live’ – I feel like I’m just repeating myself here. I asked for an email detailing my situation which I feel I’m justified in doing. I replied to the email as I felt it didn’t have enough detail and asked about their backout plan if any.
Patience ? Where have I said I expect Telecom to fix this issue now or given priority over other faults. I had accepted there will be delays before I asked for the email. 

 


Every customer on every cabinet had to be migrated across to the cabinet before it's "live". The MPF's between the exchange and cabinet and the cabinet and premises have to be connected to the cabinet to maintain legacy services before the cabinet can be officially cut over. DSL customers have to be migrated to the ISAM in the cabinet from the ISAM/DLSAM in the exchange.

When Telecom say that "not all cabinets have been upgraded to fibre" they are no doubt referring to the hundreds of existing passive cross connect cabinets and early active cabinets, some of which contained their own DSLAMS's such as the Conklin's. Virtually all of these existing cabinets are being replaced by whisper cabinets as part of the FTTN rollout, and many whisper cabinets are located where these old cabinets were.

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  # 450612 22-Mar-2011 08:42
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boost3d:Thanks for the info.
Are you able to say why the ISAM is not active prior to the migration? Is it that the gear is not available or the IP range needs to be cut over when all customers have been migrated?
If it's just that the equipment is not available or the technician has not activated something (Fibre?) surely it's best to wait before migrating customers.


It comes down to the processes that are in place. Cutting over all the MPF's to the cabinet and then livening up the cabinet is the most logical way of doing things.

Running some DSL services from the ISAM in the cabinet as the cabinet is cut over is a massive no brainer as will also cause massive issues with midspan injection which can cause all customers who are still being supplied DSL services from the exchange to suffer from severly degraded DSL performance. This occurs because the signal from the cabinet is stronger than the signal from the exchange and can cause interference to other copper pairs within the cable bundles.

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  # 455712 5-Apr-2011 22:53
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any update to this issue napster?



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  # 455742 6-Apr-2011 00:10
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Ynet are doing a range test tomorrow so see how that goes. Telecom have no plans to upgrade capacity till October so really hope Ynet can get us internet.

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  # 455779 6-Apr-2011 08:18
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Napster: Ynet are doing a range test tomorrow so see how that goes. Telecom have no plans to upgrade capacity till October so really hope Ynet can get us internet.


Good luck with that, but I would give emailing your local MP a go (especially if there are others around you with the same problem) and complain that their constituant(s) are being left out in the cold by Telecom.

You'd be surprised what Telecom (Chorus) can do when they have to.




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