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  # 455735 5-Apr-2011 23:39
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n4:
srackham: Over the last week ........ Telecom NZ charge around
250% more that Clickatell).


Just curious, what do Clickatell and the others say about the service they are charging you for, but not delivering? Why complain to Telecom when no-one is paying them for this service? Isn't that back to front?


i guess Clickatell sent the message, it was telecom that dropped it. 





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  # 455790 6-Apr-2011 08:44
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n4:
srackham: Over the last week my business has been severely impacted by
non-delivery of SMS messages by Telecom NZ -- messages from Clickatell and other
gateways are simply dropped by Telecom NZ and the carrier is passed an
incorrect postive delivery status.

Telcom's SPAM argument is disingenuous -- it's not the carrier that's
being targeted it's the sender's NZ country code. I've just
successfully sent messages via Clickatell to Telcom NZ numbers using a
non-NZ sender country code in the sender ID, if I send the same
message with a NZ country code in the sender ID it gets blocked.
It's also interesting that Vodafone NZ along with most of the rest of
the world don't need to resort to these blanket``anti-SPAM'' blocking
measures.

This discriminatory tactic is simply an attempt by Telecom NZ to stop
Zealanders from using much cheaper International SMS gateways (local
providers with direct agreements with Telecom NZ charge around
250% more that Clickatell).


Just curious, what do Clickatell and the others say about the service they are charging you for, but not delivering? Why complain to Telecom when no-one is paying them for this service? Isn't that back to front?




I hate to be the bearer of bad news but the person who sends SMS from the likes of Clickatel, ipipi or Skpe IS paying to send it..  On your reasoning then all intl SMS from SMS services and fones should be blocked  by Telecom..


I can see this blocking by Telecom  having quite an impact on business who use overseas SMS services to advice, service scheduling and the like.   One large motor company here in Auckland use an Australian SMS service  to advise their customers when cars are ready for pickup and confirming that a vehicle has been booked in..

 

The delivery of SMS cost Telecom basically nothing ..




Regards,

Old3eyes


 
 
 
 


n4

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  # 456077 6-Apr-2011 19:42
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old3eyes:
n4:
srackham: Over the last week my business has been severely impacted by
non-delivery of SMS messages by Telecom NZ -- messages from Clickatell and other
gateways are simply dropped by Telecom NZ and the carrier is passed an
incorrect postive delivery status.
<snip>


Just curious, what do Clickatell and the others say about the service they are charging you for, but not delivering? Why complain to Telecom when no-one is paying them for this service? Isn't that back to front?




I hate to be the bearer of bad news but the person who sends SMS from the likes of Clickatel, ipipi or Skpe IS paying to send it..  On your reasoning then all intl SMS from SMS services and fones should be blocked  by Telecom..
<snip>


This is my point. Clickatel et al are getting paid. They are not delivering the service. Maybe they don't have the agreements with Telecom to deliver the messages. If not, then what they are sending is essentially indistinguishable from spam because there is no accountability when a customer complains about messages he receives. If they do have the agreements, then complaining to Clickatel and getting them to take it up with Telecom is going to be the fastest way to resolve the issue - for all we know, the problem is with Clickatel, or someone between Clickatel and Telecom.

I'm not denying that the local supported channels are expensive, just saying that this cheaper alternative is the Wild West and people should be aiming their complaints at the people they are paying to provide a service.




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  # 456266 7-Apr-2011 10:16
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Here's an official response I got from their communications team:


Telecom has a list of approved service providers (ASP’s) to provide for premium or enhanced SMS and bulk SMS services.  We also have specific arrangements and contracts with organisations such as Twitter, Facebook and Bebo to terminate SMS messages on our network as well as competitors to exchange SMS traffic. 
 
All other traffic coming into the Telecom Network is by design and contractual agreement, for person to person traffic only.  One of the key criteria we have on these person to person routes is that we expect the SMS’s coming in to have the sender’s identity of the country they are coming from. 
 
Working with parameters and approved trusted sources ensures we can manage unsolicited SMS traffic reaching our customers.  Our product teams will review, assess and manage this on an ongoing basis to ensure genuine person to person traffic is not adversely impacted by the parameters set.






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  # 456308 7-Apr-2011 11:25
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It's not a quality of service issue, International providers are no better or worse than local providers, the issue is targeted targeted destruction of SMS messages by Telecom NZ based on the senders country code.

If you purchased lotto tickets from your local dairy and the Lotto Commission destroyed your entries you don't blame the dairy owner.

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  # 456340 7-Apr-2011 12:13
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Telecom with this person to person rules have created a good reason to shift to a different provider. It really stinks and is somewhat anti competitive to anyone who develops ideas that require person to persons communications.

Many people think Telecom acts in anti competitive ways, this is another example of them acting so.

Not only have they fixed a spam problem they have fixed Telecoms problem with SMS competition.

If the spam problem was so bad should there not be threads on this if there was a big problem?

The only solution to still get these SMS services is to have a phone with a different provider, 2degrees or Vodafone.

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  # 456346 7-Apr-2011 12:33
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Why doesn't Telecom Block all email from overseas as well. This will stop spam in New Zealand.

 
 
 
 


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  # 456380 7-Apr-2011 13:24
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hellonearthisman: The only solution to still get these SMS services is to have a phone with a different provider, 2degrees or Vodafone.


Not an option if you send SMS to clients.

I have a nutritionist who sends appointment reminders to her clients - she has no say over what network her clients use.

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  # 456488 7-Apr-2011 17:42
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nate:
hellonearthisman: The only solution to still get these SMS services is to have a phone with a different provider, 2degrees or Vodafone.


Not an option if you send SMS to clients.

I have a nutritionist who sends appointment reminders to her clients - she has no say over what network her clients use.


Does she use a service provider with local connectivity to Vodafone, 2degrees and Telecom, or a cheap off shore provider?

I've brought this up with my dentist. I don't want to get messages from a +44 number where I have no idea who is sending them. I want to have a number I can associate with the service.




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC a Technology Evangelist and Product Manager. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


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  # 456518 7-Apr-2011 19:26
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openmedia:
nate:
hellonearthisman: The only solution to still get these SMS services is to have a phone with a different provider, 2degrees or Vodafone.


Not an option if you send SMS to clients.

I have a nutritionist who sends appointment reminders to her clients - she has no say over what network her clients use.


Does she use a service provider with local connectivity to Vodafone, 2degrees and Telecom, or a cheap off shore provider?

I've brought this up with my dentist. I don't want to get messages from a +44 number where I have no idea who is sending them. I want to have a number I can associate with the service.



I have used ipipi, clickatel and skype and all of them allow for you to register a local mobile with them and it becomes  the originating  SMS CLID on SMS that you send. Any replies got back to that mobile number..




Regards,

Old3eyes


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  # 456530 7-Apr-2011 20:10
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LennonNZ: Why doesn't Telecom Block all email from overseas as well. This will stop spam in New Zealand.


If the email was sent from your email address but wasn't from you would you be taking the same view?


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  # 456544 7-Apr-2011 20:42
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SMSGlobal is losing messages too. http://www.smsglobal.com/nz/en

one of my clients contacted them and they said they were aware of issue, and were looking into it.

as a sms services provider they have some pretty big clients - according to their homepage: microsoft, nortel are among the list. They also show an 'australian endorsed government supplier' badge..




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  # 456549 7-Apr-2011 20:51
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sbiddle:
LennonNZ: Why doesn't Telecom Block all email from overseas as well. This will stop spam in New Zealand.


If the email was sent from your email address but wasn't from you would you be taking the same view?



Not an apples to apples comparison given with email you can send from an address and specify a different reply to address legitimately. 

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  # 456551 7-Apr-2011 20:55
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openmedia: Does she use a service provider with local connectivity to Vodafone, 2degrees and Telecom, or a cheap off shore provider?


She uses Clickatell with the caller id set as her mobile number - if people reply, she gets the reply to her mobile, which she then actions.  Works like a champ.

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  # 456579 7-Apr-2011 22:12
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nate:
openmedia: Does she use a service provider with local connectivity to Vodafone, 2degrees and Telecom, or a cheap off shore provider?


She uses Clickatell with the caller id set as her mobile number - if people reply, she gets the reply to her mobile, which she then actions.  Works like a champ.


sounds like an email open relay server.  the kind that everyone blocks.  is there some authorization process they go through before they start spoofing your mobile number?

could i send a bulk sms out tomorrow, speficying your mobile number as the sender?




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