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  # 457420 11-Apr-2011 11:43
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sbiddle:

It might not seem relevant to you but it's very relevant for a carrier.

There is significantly more to this issue than many people realise and the finer details of Telecom's actual deal with their roaming hub is something most of us don't have access to.


Like most people I don't much care. I pay to send a text message via a reputable carrier I expect it to arrive. Telecom should make reasonable effort to deliver genuine text messages, not block everything because they're too lazy to do it properly.

The newspapers today report there are 3000 people on $100K plus, and 32 over $500K. Surely with that kind of manpower (and presumably intelligence) they can work this out.

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  # 457421 11-Apr-2011 11:44
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timmmay:
sbiddle:

It might not seem relevant to you but it's very relevant for a carrier.

There is significantly more to this issue than many people realise and the finer details of Telecom's actual deal with their roaming hub is something most of us don't have access to.


Like most people I don't much care. I pay to send a text message via a reputable carrier I expect it to arrive. Telecom should make reasonable effort to deliver genuine text messages, not block everything because they're too lazy to do it properly.

The newspapers today report there are 3000 people on $100K plus, and 32 over $500K. Surely with that kind of manpower (and presumably intelligence) they can work this out.


It's not related to been lazy!

Your issue is not with Telecom NZ

 
 
 
 


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  # 457423 11-Apr-2011 11:46
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Lazy, incapable, whatever. A huge company with profits in the hundreds of millions of dollars should be able to work this out.

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  # 457424 11-Apr-2011 11:46
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johnr:
freitasm: I would consider that person to person.


I don't



And the other SMS are what then? "Mobile to person"? It is the intention and action, not the means.




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  # 457425 11-Apr-2011 11:46
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Something that comes to mind is people that have automated systems connecting to clickatel such as notifications about temprature alarms, or network down alarms, or any form of automated system could/would just break.

What about the operators including clickatel that do verification that you own the number in question before sending from that number, seems like a killer for all the work those people did to ensure this spam doesnt happen.

It's like saying, Ok we're not allowing anyone from Nigeria to call NZ because it could be 419 scammer, that's how extreme I see this approach!




Barry Murphy
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Vibe Communications LTD - Business ISP and Wholesale Carrier



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  # 457429 11-Apr-2011 11:56
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timmmay:
sbiddle:

It might not seem relevant to you but it's very relevant for a carrier.

There is significantly more to this issue than many people realise and the finer details of Telecom's actual deal with their roaming hub is something most of us don't have access to.


Like most people I don't much care. I pay to send a text message via a reputable carrier I expect it to arrive. Telecom should make reasonable effort to deliver genuine text messages, not block everything because they're too lazy to do it properly.



Have you raised the issue with the provider you're paying money to? What was their response?



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  # 457431 11-Apr-2011 12:02
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Offshore spam is annoying, impersonal and alarming. Telecom have made a gutsy stand.

Would you like your kids to be receiving adult txt messages from offshore? Thats whats been happening. Not only that, but you can't opt out because offshore providers don't have to abide by any rules. 

Its the case of isolated abuse ruining it for everyone. Thats the bitter pill to swallow.

Replying to the earlier post regarding ripoff fees - I work for one of the named SMS providers listed earlier (the oldest one) and we do offer a free prepay API access for the SME market - with fees only for usage. 

Fees are optional to cover support/SLA. If you want it cheap and cheerful you can have it that way.

 
 
 
 


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  # 457432 11-Apr-2011 12:02
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freitasm:
johnr:
freitasm: I would consider that person to person.


I don't



And the other SMS are what then? "Mobile to person"? It is the intention and action, not the means.


I agree with John here.

If it was "person to person" or "mobile to mobile" then it would be you plugging a SMS into your mobile phone, and sending it to another person's mobile phone using your carriers SMSC, and sending to the Telecom SMSC.

Whereas John is correct this is "Web to Person" / "Web to Mobile".  Since this is you typing into X service providers Web Form, then getting routed via their SMSC which is also commonly used for spamming customers, and then delivered and rejected by Telecom's SMSC (or another intermediate SMSC) because Service Provider X is known to be a spammer.

I see a business opportinity myself to build a E-Mail -> SMS Gateway for customers to own as a embedded device they plug in which just has a Sim Card & Datacard and sends the SMS that way.

I think SPF for SMS is probably the best analogy as to what has happened.  People complained the same when SPF first came out and was being used by ISPs.

If people didn't use NZ Mobile Numbers as the "from" number then I doubt a lot of these issues would be occurring.




and 


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  # 457434 11-Apr-2011 12:07
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tarasutherland:

it's pretty apparent to me that it would not matter which way telecom handled this - or email - you would not be happy and would complain about it.

its a global setting on the platform.  its been done this way to protect the majority of customers.
if you want to personally fund a programme to investigate the possibility of applying this on an individual level, then we might consider looking at it.


From the HLR level, add a new variable to which if the customer is being spammed from over seas and they wish to stop international txt's being delivered, then you put a 1 next to their name, each time a txt from abroad comes in and an HLR lookup is done to find the clients VLR, return a "Blocked" for only the people wishing to have this "SPAM" blocked.

Not that hard really and the variables are already there in SS7, just like you have toll barring, intl barring, GTP (data) baring, etc.




Barry Murphy
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  # 457435 11-Apr-2011 12:10
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sbiddle:
LennonNZ: Why doesn't Telecom Block all email from overseas as well. This will stop spam in New Zealand.


If the email was sent from your email address but wasn't from you would you be taking the same view?



No, use SPF and the likes. It would be like me using gmail or me.com and changing the from address to be my xtra address (just an example) are they going to block me emailing anyone else on xtra?






Barry Murphy
ISPMap - New Zealand ISP map
Vibe Communications LTD - Business ISP and Wholesale Carrier



Any comments made by myself don't reflect the views of my employer, they are mine and mine alone

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  # 457437 11-Apr-2011 12:12
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Regs: SMSGlobal is losing messages too. http://www.smsglobal.com/nz/en

one of my clients contacted them and they said they were aware of issue, and were looking into it.

as a sms services provider they have some pretty big clients - according to their homepage: microsoft, nortel are among the list. They also show an 'australian endorsed government supplier' badge..


The Aggregator I use and connect to via SMPP deliver TXT's for KPMG globally plus a lot of other large corporations.

 




Barry Murphy
ISPMap - New Zealand ISP map
Vibe Communications LTD - Business ISP and Wholesale Carrier



Any comments made by myself don't reflect the views of my employer, they are mine and mine alone

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  # 457442 11-Apr-2011 12:17
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freitasm:
Regs:
1eStar: Dear Mr Telecom. Can you please authorise Skype as an Approved Service Provider so I can receive legitimate person to person texts from that source.


"hang on a sec.... isnt skype that internet phone thingy that lets you make cheaper calls than what you get through us?"


Now you get the idea. It sounds like a market/economy decision... "Let's us make sure there's a lively market for our loved business partners. The ones who are losing business deals to those cheap overseas providers"*

;)




* Fictional dialog for illustration purposes. It does not correspond to any heard or overheard comment. Intended as a satire. This is not defamation, but opinion.




It comes down to their customers such as bulletin wireless and the others probably having a lower spend so a method for them to force people to use NZ operators that have to pay more that have to charge more.

At the end of the day, why would you block spam from people that use 642 in their from address, I would think blocking everything else would be just as good, just stop all international TXT's?

Innovation has just gone out the window, its no longer affordable for 14yr old geeks to play with sms services using their pocket money to create new and exciting opportunities or products that could take the world by storm.




Barry Murphy
ISPMap - New Zealand ISP map
Vibe Communications LTD - Business ISP and Wholesale Carrier



Any comments made by myself don't reflect the views of my employer, they are mine and mine alone

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  # 457450 11-Apr-2011 12:28
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sbiddle:
Have you raised the issue with the provider you're paying money to? What was their response?


No, but I will. I figure there's not much point though, a global operator probably doesn't much care if one telecom in one little country blocks texts. I doubt they'd want to have to sign a contract with every telecoms operator in the world, I have no idea how international txt delivery works though.

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# 457462 11-Apr-2011 12:45
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timmmay:
sbiddle:
Have you raised the issue with the provider you're paying money to? What was their response?


No, but I will. I figure there's not much point though, a global operator probably doesn't much care if one telecom in one little country blocks texts. I doubt they'd want to have to sign a contract with every telecoms operator in the world, I have no idea how international txt delivery works though.


Well your beef is not with Telecom NZ then is it??

So what if they make a good profit, I don't see Telecom NZ Charity above the door

John

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  # 457465 11-Apr-2011 12:50
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Well your beef is not with Telecom NZ then is it??

So what if they make a good profit, I don't see Telecom NZ Charity

John


Since Telecom used a blanket block for something that used to work fine I think blame and responsibility to fix it both go to them.

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