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652 posts

Ultimate Geek
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Reply # 39011 19-Jun-2006 16:31
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I don't want to come across as being pro-Telecom or pro-'any other server provider' for that matter (and excuse my sig on this point!), but i really don't see how Telecom can get complete blame for the state of our broadband/telecommunications environment. As has been mentioned in other posts, there has been nothing stopping other providers implementing their own infrastructure in order to provide competition. You say that TNZ is money-hungry? personally, the view i have is that those that have been trying to get something for nothing (other ISPs piggybacking off TNZ's own infrastructure) is more a case of money hunger than TNZ's position. As a business owner, i too would be looking to maximising my return on investment, especially in a country the size of ours.

Why haven't other providers invested in their own setups? (let's leave resource consent aside....) the cost. In a country as geographically diverse as ours and as sparcely populated as ours is, it is a big risk to inject the many millions/billions (?) to create a competing network while at the same time assuring your investors that they will get a return on their investment. Telecom also need to provide this return to their investors. We are a small country and the cost per capita is going to be much larger than the likes of the UK etc. It's an unfortunate fact that we just have to live with.

I am fortunate enough to live in Wellington where we have the choice of 2 Telco's and as such there is competition in pricing with regards to phone lines etc. You want someone to blame for the lack of competition in Auckland? As pointed out by Mauricio and Juha, blame your local council

290 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 39019 19-Jun-2006 17:05
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Felix but your diatribe is misplaced imho...

Nice use of the word Laughing

6 posts

Wannabe Geek

Reply # 39029 19-Jun-2006 21:10
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Firstly I apologise for any discomfort I caused people by using capital (OMG) letters in previous posts. I would go back and edit them, except the dial up in my suburd is slower than an old boy pissing in the night.

I am still keen on anyone of knowledge explaining the difficulty and cost to TC to change/upgrade the local cabinet to allow for broadband?

Other companies have tried to install an infrastructrure separate of TC but when TC owns the cables and the monopoly - well yes they do fail adn the customer fails to have choice. It is well known that TC has many govt insiders and these have worked well for them for many many years - I have contacted my council who are in progress (meaning many years down the track if at all) of considering a wireless iniative in this area. Guess that aint scracthng TC's back.

Is someone able to answer the cabinet questions?

34 posts


Reply # 39031 19-Jun-2006 21:49

my 2c on this topic.
I frankly do not know of the actual cost of installing a DSLAM into one of those cabinets but I would not be surprised if it ran in the upper 40 to 60 thousand dollars.(i was once on such a mission to find out about it from the XBB helpdesk about it) and to be honest sometimes i dont blame telecom either.
Even if you signed up for their best plans, you would probably pay at the maximum about $100 to $150 a month. even with 10 to 20 customers in a region, the Return on Investement on such devices, let alone a profit would take years to come by. surely as a businessman you would know what a good investment is and what isnt. if it is a small suburb what are the odds of more that a large number of people would take up broadband in your region let alone sign up for premier plans.
also considering you are so keen on finding out regarding the cost of getting a DSLAM in your region, why not think about investing that money into getting an EV-DO connection (with all that loose money you have lying aroung ;) ). it covers just about every nook and corner of west auckland. i should know i live and work here. as freitasm and many other said TCNZ is always blamed for things but not others. if VFNZ or other big company was so caring about the public why do they not start their own alternative network. i am pretty sure TelstraClear or VFNZ has more than enough cash in their pockets to make every NZ'er happy.
ps: i give my vote to the whole bold initiative.

34 posts


  Reply # 39033 19-Jun-2006 22:04

Not to mention the cost of maintenance, upgrades, repairs & other associated costs that go with it.

264 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 39229 21-Jun-2006 20:07
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Bloody hell, did I miss the part where TNZ turned into a charity? Since when was any business morally obliged to service any customer? Mr Angry Man, you seem to *expect* Broadband in Laingholm - more fool you imo. In order for TNZ to extend their service to your area would require the installation of what is known as a conklin, or a mini-DSLAM, to the tune of tens of thousands of dollars. To service a few people paying $39.95 a month... How, praytell, is this a commercially viable business decision?

ADSL is a technology that depends on environmental factors to operate, just like Television, Sky, etc., and you never hear customers guilt-tripping them about their dodgy service to remote locations..

Get over it :/

Nate wants an iphone
3901 posts

Uber Geek
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Reply # 39231 21-Jun-2006 20:55
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At the risk of trolling or being accused of trolling I drop this:

Wasn't this 'But there aren't enough people to make it profitable so we won't provide service' argument used as a point against LLU? I can remember some people bringing this up in previous debates/threads, perhaps I should google back and find some specific examples.
So why when we currently don't have LLU, is it being used?

(There was a whisper on IRC just before about it too, something along the lines of "i thought that kiwishare entailed a subsidy for telecom's losses maintaining rural areas?")

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344 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 39247 22-Jun-2006 02:33
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cokemaster, yes, trolling... yes that's what your doing... anyway... 

Really seriously though... it's pretty basic... TheyShouldFall moved to a place without BB... and now expects BB to move along with him / her? Well, I'd feel silly if I moved into a cave too... but I wouldn't ring up a real estate agent to complain... 

edit> upon reflection, if I moved into a cave, I wouldn't be able to call a real estate agent (no phones in a cave)... but I'd certainly head down to the local internet cafe to post a diatribe in these forums about how the govt should force the evil Telco to provide BB to my cave... and though I wouldn't be able to see the ads cos I wouldn't be getting TV in my cave, I'd like to think that thing from Slingshot would make some ads to back me up!!! Oh yeah... I would only actually move into a cave if I had checked it had all the stalactites I wanted (and phone, BB, near by schools, transport etc... )

652 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 27


  Reply # 39264 22-Jun-2006 09:37
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Felix: Oh yeah... I would only actually move into a cave if I had checked it had all the stalactites I wanted (and phone, BB, near by schools, transport etc... )

especially if you were running an online business as well I would imagine... just common sense

BDFL - Memuneh
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Reply # 39273 22-Jun-2006 10:07
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I know the OP said the decision to move to that specific area was influenced by the family, but... I have been a TelstraClear customer since the Chello time, then Saturn, then Clear, then TelstraClear. I have their cable modem service for years now.

When we decided to buy a house because of the new baby (a family decision!) we took in consideration the fact that we both work from home, and my business is 100% Internet based. So we decided that any house outside the TelstraClear area would not be suitable.

We had a few houses in front of us, some very nice one, that were discarded simply because a call to TelstraClear confirmed that there was no service on that street or side of suburb.

We found a house that lucky enough already had a TelstraClear connection so it was just a matter of moving in, having the account transferred, and no loss of service.

It's all a balance. And these things are part of the points to consider.

Sorry, TheyShouldFall, if this sounds harsh, but yes everyone else agreed that this kind of thing should have been investigated prior to moving to that area.

Now, please this topic has been long enough so everyone knows everyone's opinions. Any constructive reply, such as "Hi, I work for Telecom and we will be servicing that area soon"?

No? Ok, back to normal programme then.

113 posts

Master Geek

Reply # 39417 23-Jun-2006 09:59
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I agree with the topic being nearly used up but I just gotta say this:

The government completly stuffed up when they gave the network to Telecom with the privatisation of telecom ( Same complete stuff up they made with the railways).
The network should have been publically owned and maintained and the use of it issued to any who wanted to lease a portion. I don't support Telecom (I've been I-4free which turned into slingshot and am now xnet).

But you cannot blame a commercial enterprise(for the government made them such) for trying to keep there market captive and make a profit.

*Blame the stupid people in that round nut house in Wellington*

344 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 39429 23-Jun-2006 10:59
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almost agree with you reckless... aprt from the fact that the network wasn't given to anyone... it was sold. As were the rail lines... personally I think a Labour and National govenrment made a big mistake in selling off NZ... but they were voted in, and they did it, so not much can be done about it... anyway, this is leading off topic so I'll leavit it there...

113 posts

Master Geek

  Reply # 39450 23-Jun-2006 14:55
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sold or given- whatever! we should still own them, then we would all have $20-00 a month fast broadband like our mates in Aussie.

And the rail lines what a joke we sold them for a million and bought them back for many millions and NOBODY is accountable. W'ed all have lower tax if it wasn't for the stuff ups. 

To bring us back on topic our thread author should be calling his local MP and abusing him or her. Might as well fart against thunder. But its not Telcoms fault for making cost effective corporate decisions after all the Government made them a corporate.

1420 posts

Uber Geek


Reply # 39454 23-Jun-2006 15:40
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Reckless: then we would all have $20-00 a month fast broadband like our mates in Aussie.

Your mates in Aussie don't have fast $20 broadband. The cheapest plan on iiNet is $39.95 (512K, 300Meg cap).

Reckless you should have voted for the communist party! Get your facts straight before making such outrageous comments. This is Geekzone not Stupidzone!

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113 posts

Master Geek

  Reply # 39498 24-Jun-2006 12:48
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Jeepers Jama

I was only expressing an opinion the communist thing is a bit over the top!!
After all thats what a democracy is all about isn't it???

And secondly I'm sure I've seen ads in the Aussy PC Authoruty for Broadband at $19-95 a month which you cannot get here, so the personal attack was totally uneccessary.

[Moderator edit (MF): some very personal remarks removed]

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