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1387 posts

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  # 771520 28-Feb-2013 10:01
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NonprayingMantis:
mercutio:
NonprayingMantis:
freitasm: You have to pay an extra $10 to use 4G. Not available on prepay.



Interesting. 

Ggiven that if you don't pay the $10 you still get DC speeds which as we have seen are pretty damn fast, and certianly fast enough to do almost anything you could possibly want to do with a data plan smaller than 5GB (and in most cases smaller than 2GB),  why would anyone pay for 4G?


it's kind of like asking why would people pay for vdsl when they can get adsl2 much cheaper.  if you don't want to / don't need it, then don't pay for it  :)  but just like if you can get vdsl you're more likely to get fast adsl2 the same thing applies.  if you're in 4g area you're likely to get faster 3g speeds because newer gear / decent backhaul etc are needed.


and that is why for most people,  upgrading to VDSL is pointless (and hence most ISPs haven't launched it), and, for that matter, same goes for Fibre.  130k houses passed,  3k uptake.

The benefits of VDSL for some people are clear though. e.g. ADSL upload is tortuous for doing large files or multi-user households

But there really is no material difference (for the customer) between 3GDC and 4G ESPECIALLY with data plans typically 500MB-1GB


yeah, but if you're in a vdsl capable area, then you're likely to get adsl speeds of at least 12 megabit, rather than less than 8 megabit.  if you're a 4g area you're probably likely to get at least 4 megabit on 3g.. 

3g upload is pretty bad for me on vodafone with 100ish kbit on 3g.  but i'm not in a 3gdc or 4g area, so i expect that if my area gets upgraded to 4g i'll magically get better 3g speeds.

my phone is 7.2 megabit i think.  something like that, so i'm not eligible for 3gdc or 4g, but i would prefer slightly faster speeds.  currently 2degrees is about 3 or 4 times faster on the same phone.

and overall i am pleased with having 4g rollout starting to happen, even though i don't have 4g phone.  and maybe if i buy a new phone i'll make sure i get 3gdc or 4g.

and if you see johnr's latency number, he's got 22 msec on speedtest.net, which 3g never does.  and with tethering the difference between 20 and 80 msec latency is going to be noticable.  enough so that if i tethered often and had 4g in the region i was, and 4g device i would definitely pay $10/month just for that.

862 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 771522 28-Feb-2013 10:07
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4G is included in the plans, $120 and up
https://www.vodafone.co.nz/phones-plans/plans/smart-data/

 
 
 
 


BDFL - Memuneh
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  # 771523 28-Feb-2013 10:08
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mercutio: yeah, but if you're in a vdsl capable area, then you're likely to get adsl speeds of at least 12 megabit, rather than less than 8 megabit.  if you're a 4g area you're probably likely to get at least 4 megabit on 3g.. 


That would be something as 4G and 3G are completely different technologies using different radio spectrum and all. Very different from fixed line.

mercutio: my phone is 7.2 megabit i think.  something like that, so i'm not eligible for 3gdc or 4g, but i would prefer slightly faster speeds.  currently 2degrees is about 3 or 4 times faster on the same phone.


That tells me that possibly 2degrees has a cell site closer to you with less users. 

mercutio: and if you see johnr's latency number, he's got 22 msec on speedtest.net, which 3g never does.


Sure. And then you have to hit the servers in LAX which aren't going to be less than 100ms away anyway and everything comes back to very similar latency...






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Master Geek

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  # 771524 28-Feb-2013 10:10
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Well, I'm on a plan with 4G, in a 4G area, with a 4G device and I've got no 4G.

Called customer service and they say it should be working for me, maybe I should reboot my phone and/or wait a day. So... points to Vodafone for the stealth launch, points off for it not working as announced!


862 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 771526 28-Feb-2013 10:11
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gmanp: Well, I'm on a plan with 4G, in a 4G area, with a 4G device and I've got no 4G.

Called customer service and they say it should be working for me, maybe I should reboot my phone and/or wait a day. So... points to Vodafone for the stealth launch, points off for it not working as announced!



Me too....however check that you have LTE enabled in the cell section of your phone. My Note 2 wasn't by default.

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Master Geek

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  # 771528 28-Feb-2013 10:13
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I have checked :-) "Enable LTE" is set to "On".

EDIT: For the record, I have now rebooted, and turned the LTE setting off and back on. Still no 4G.

1387 posts

Uber Geek


  # 771531 28-Feb-2013 10:16
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freitasm:
mercutio: yeah, but if you're in a vdsl capable area, then you're likely to get adsl speeds of at least 12 megabit, rather than less than 8 megabit.  if you're a 4g area you're probably likely to get at least 4 megabit on 3g.. 


That would be something as 4G and 3G are completely different technologies using different radio spectrum and all. Very different from fixed line.


same backhaul issues etc.


mercutio: my phone is 7.2 megabit i think.  something like that, so i'm not eligible for 3gdc or 4g, but i would prefer slightly faster speeds.  currently 2degrees is about 3 or 4 times faster on the same phone.


That tells me that possibly 2degrees has a cell site closer to you with less users. 


same location.  likely to be backhaul issue.  


mercutio: and if you see johnr's latency number, he's got 22 msec on speedtest.net, which 3g never does.


Sure. And then you have to hit the servers in LAX which aren't going to be less than 100ms away anyway and everything comes back to very similar latency...


160 msec versus 220 msec is quite noticable, especially for interactive things.  but not everything is in los angeles.  going to nzherald, stuff, trademe, geekzone, google etc should be noticably faster.

i would be curious to know how slow things get when doing multiple simultaneous things at once, and how quickly speeds ramp up.  with 3g there's not just the tcp/ip ramp up but the 3g ramp up too, so you don't get peak bandwidth allocated to you straight away.

 
 
 
 


862 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 771532 28-Feb-2013 10:17
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gmanp: I have checked :-) "Enable LTE" is set to "On".

EDIT: For the record, I have now rebooted, and turned the LTE setting off and back on. Still no 4G.


Me Too :)

862 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 771533 28-Feb-2013 10:18
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They probably haven't enabled the plans that should have this feature yet...I am in touch with my account manager.

6434 posts

Uber Geek


  # 771534 28-Feb-2013 10:18
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mercutio:

160 msec versus 220 msec is quite noticable, especially for interactive things.  but not everything is in los angeles.  going to nzherald, stuff, trademe, geekzone, google etc should be noticably faster.




for online gaming  a difference of 50-60ms is noticable, biut for virtually anything else (NZherald, trademe, geekzone etc )most people would struggle to tell the difference (or care enough about the difference even if they notice it)

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  # 771535 28-Feb-2013 10:20
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myopinion: They probably haven't enabled the plans that should have this feature yet...I am in touch with my account manager.


Yes we have

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Ultimate Geek

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Kiwi Dev Studios

  # 771537 28-Feb-2013 10:22
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Interesting, so if you aren't on a $120 a month plan, with a 4G device, you won't be using 4G?

Sounds stupid. It should be available for anyone on the network, regardless. Its your cap, and speeding the network up for everyone on it, is a key thing for a Telco to do.




--
Stephen
twitter/ NZCoderGuy / KiwiDevStudios

Kiwi Dev Studios


862 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 771538 28-Feb-2013 10:23
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johnr:
myopinion: They probably haven't enabled the plans that should have this feature yet...I am in touch with my account manager.


Yes we have


The coverage map shows we should get 4G in the East Tamaki area. Been for a drive and still no go.

74 posts

Master Geek

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  # 771539 28-Feb-2013 10:24
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johnr:
myopinion: They probably haven't enabled the plans that should have this feature yet...I am in touch with my account manager.


Yes we have


Well, you've got three people here on the forum thinking it should be working for them and it isn't. Any thoughts/advice?


1387 posts

Uber Geek


  # 771540 28-Feb-2013 10:24
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NonprayingMantis:
mercutio:

160 msec versus 220 msec is quite noticable, especially for interactive things.  but not everything is in los angeles.  going to nzherald, stuff, trademe, geekzone, google etc should be noticably faster.




for online gaming  a difference of 50-60ms is noticable, biut for virtually anything else (NZherald, trademe, geekzone etc )most people would struggle to tell the difference (or care enough about the difference even if they notice it)


for nzherald herald etc it's 20 versus 80 msec.  so factor of 4.  it should bring up pages snappy rather then delaying.  you have to multiply a few times, for dns request, initial tcp connection creation etc.

and i dunno, i've found with weaker signal areas it very noticably effects internet usage.

everything has got more and more bloated these days.  have you ever tried using facebook on a dialup modem or woosh?  but facebook is a lot more complicated site than nzherald, and images usually come from overseas, and there are lot of them...  and often they use https now, which has even higher overheads for initial connection creation, which is more latency bound.. i think it's a couple of extra round trip times.

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