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  Reply # 78144 15-Jul-2007 09:58
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willnz: Yes, but 026 numbers are still charged, even at a slightly lower rate. The general assumption is, or should be, that if you're calling a non-geographical number it will be a chargeable call. 083210 is a difficult one, as it's a "value-added service" number. Generally, if a telco provides a service on 08X (other than free phone), they won't charge for calls to it, but other carriers might.

The general rule of thumb is, if a number isn't local, isn't toll free, and you haven't been explicitly told that calls to that number are free, then you should either expect to be charged for the call, or you should confirm whether it is a chargeable call or not with your telco.


Maybe if you have read the NAD (I have since, but hadn't at the time). I do not believe it is unreasonable for an average user to assume that they are NOT going to pay land to mobile rates for checking their voicemail. I wouldnt have cared if it was say the price of a national toll call but the point is it wasn't disclosed. 028 is not a well known prefix, and users shouldn't have to make assumptions about the cost of such calls, especially when they know its not a mobile.

I would have assumed that if they didnt want to provide a free to call number then they would have just given a local number in each of the regions they have numbers in but it seems they actually want to make money off people checking their voicemail from another phone provider (Which i don't have a problem with, just be upfront about the fact it is gonna cost me mobile rates - which we all know in New Zealand are very high)




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  Reply # 78145 15-Jul-2007 10:04
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I see where you're coming from obviously, but 02X is known to be a mobile/pager range. Doesn't matter if it's a mobile you're calling or not - it's still a non-geographical (aka, mobile) number. EDIT: Take 021 700 700 for example. That's a mobile call, and it's used for checking voicemail outside the vodafone network. Maybe, if anywhere, Vodafone has this hidden in some deep dark corner of their website that calls to this number are chargeable, but you still generally assume that it's a mobile call because it starts with 02X. Are we going to hear similar arguments when Orcon come out with 020?

You don't (generally) call this number to check your voicemail from inside CallPlus' network, you use it for checking voicemail from other carriers - and Call Plus has no say over what carriers decide to charge their customers for calls to 028, so Call Plus has no obligation to say that this call is chargeable, however I agree a little warning may have been nice.

We all know CallPlus are slack in all regards. I've got a bit of respect left for them, but it's slowly fading as they become more and more like the New Old Telecom....

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  Reply # 78149 15-Jul-2007 10:30
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willnz: We all know CallPlus are slack in all regards. I've got a bit of respect left for them, but it's slowly fading as they become more and more like the New Old Telecom....


It's such a shame. I used to think Martin Wylie was a very smart man. It's obvious now that a leopard never changes his spots and that he didn't learn a lot from his time at Telecom.


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  Reply # 78150 15-Jul-2007 10:34
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At the end of the day however where do you define a point where somebody (whether it be a carrier or company) takes responsibility for advertising the cost of calling an advertised number? The simple fact is you can't. We're lucky in NZ that we don't have any instances of premium rate local numbers of whierd premium rate area codes where people get caught out.

Most people in NZ would assume that the 02x number range would incur mobile costs.


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  Reply # 78152 15-Jul-2007 10:57
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sbiddle: Most people in NZ would assume that the 02x number range would incur mobile costs.


I disagree with that. I think most people would associate mobile rates with known mobile prefixs (021,[Formerly]025,027,029)

willnz: I see where you're coming from obviously, but 02X is known to be a mobile/pager range.


Again. 021,025,026 and 029 are known to be mobile/pager ranges but anyone not familiar with the NAD could quite easily assume that anything else starting with 02 is a different type of call, ESPECIALLY if they know the number they are calling is NOT a mobile.




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  Reply # 78153 15-Jul-2007 11:03
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So when Orcon comes out with 0201, Compass with 0280, Woosh with 0245, NZ Communications with 0241/0242, TelstraClear with 023, WxC with 0270, Telecom with 0240, and Vodafone with 02885/02886, you're saying people aren't going to expect to pay mobile rates, simply because they "hadn't seen it before" ?

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  Reply # 78155 15-Jul-2007 11:11
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willnz: So when Orcon comes out with 0201, Compass with 0280, Woosh with 0245, NZ Communications with 0241/0242, TelstraClear with 023, WxC with 0270, Telecom with 0240, and Vodafone with 02885/02886, you're saying people aren't going to expect to pay mobile rates, simply because they "hadn't seen it before" ?


I would assume that I would be paying landline rates, unless explicitly pointed out.

Why should I have to read the NAD rules as a consumer, just to understand that 02x are ALL charged at mobile rates. Just because 021,5,7,9 have been charged at mobile rates, why would I assume that 028 will be as well. I know they are, as I have been told by Telecom/Vodafone/TelstraClear etc that I will have to pay a certain higher rate.

Why would any normal consumer think that checking your voicemail would be a "mobile" call? regardless of the number.

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  Reply # 78156 15-Jul-2007 11:13
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Yes, if the caller does not know the number is a mobile I believe this will be the case.

Also, what about prefixes like 0235 which the under the NAD is an International Toll Free, for example.




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  Reply # 78157 15-Jul-2007 11:14
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I'm sorry, but what? Where exactly have you been told by all these people that you'll be paying a higher rate? Please point me to this page on the TelstraClear website for example....?

Please, if you're calling a mobile number, it's at mobile rates (with the exception of pager, from the Telecom network). If you're unclear, don't call it without consulting your telco.

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  Reply # 78158 15-Jul-2007 11:17
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rscole86:
I would assume that I would be paying landline rates, unless explicitly pointed out.

Why should I have to read the NAD rules as a consumer, just to understand that 02x are ALL charged at mobile rates. Just because 021,5,7,9 have been charged at mobile rates, why would I assume that 028 will be as well. I know they are, as I have been told by Telecom/Vodafone/TelstraClear etc that I will have to pay a certain higher rate.

Why would any normal consumer think that checking your voicemail would be a "mobile" call? regardless of the number.


Thank You! My point exactly




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  Reply # 78159 15-Jul-2007 11:18
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willnz: I'm sorry, but what? Where exactly have you been told by all these people that you'll be paying a higher rate? Please point me to this page on the TelstraClear website for example....?

Please, if you're calling a mobile number, it's at mobile rates (with the exception of pager, from the Telecom network). If you're unclear, don't call it without consulting your telco.


I do not wish to start trolling this forum, or create a flame war. So will post this, and leave you guys to it.

Here are the rates according to the TCL plan I use.

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  Reply # 78160 15-Jul-2007 11:21
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adamj: Also, what about prefixes like 0235 which the under the NAD is an International Toll Free, for example.


That one's got me stumped - like I said before, I understand where you're coming from, but the GENERAL (with a few exceptions it seems) consensus is that most 02X numbers will be charged at higher rates. If you are unclear of a specific number range, you should always check before you call it.

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  Reply # 78161 15-Jul-2007 11:21
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rscole86: Here are the rates according to the TCL plan I use.


All that says is NZ Mobile. Doesn't define what NZ Mobile is, and has no other charge for pager calls, so I'm guessing pagers are charged under that plan at the same rate as mobile.

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  Reply # 78162 15-Jul-2007 11:22
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rscole86: Why would any normal consumer think that checking your voicemail would be a "mobile" call? regardless of the number.


Well 021700700 allows you to check your Voda voicemail from any landline and I'd expect to pay for that.

There are quite a few new number ranges in NZ that could cause confusion but I don't see how the 02x range could confuse people.

the 01 xxx and 015 xxx ranges are new(ish) and I could a reason to complain if people rang them and were charged.

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  Reply # 78166 15-Jul-2007 11:38
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021700700 I expect to pay mobile rates for as I know thats a Vodafone mobile number and I know I pay mobile rates to call 021 numbers. The fact is I am NOT calling a mobile and therefore any pricing plan that states a rate for calls to 'NZ Mobiles' should not include Non-Mobile numbers. It doesnt say calls to 'Non-Geographical Classified Numbers' now does it.




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