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252 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1413308 24-Oct-2015 20:58
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If you are considering the Vodafone Homephone wireless unit. You might want to check if this is a possibility. Purchasing the Home phone wireless unit outright and putting a topup  sim in it. Speaking from Memory a Homephone Wireless units worked perfectly with a mobile sim in them. What you could not do is put a Homephone wireless sim in a mobile phone as that wouldn't work. Of course you would also need to verify the supported frequencies

Its a couple of years since I did the experimenting so setup may have changed bit somebody some Vodafone may be able to confirm if this is viable

252 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1413310 24-Oct-2015 21:05
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The Other issue I would mention that would need checking with a home phone wireless is the range of the base station as there would only be one serving two phones. I would have thought iy would do 20M but having the signal punch through 2 walls may be problematic

 
 
 
 


1300 posts

Uber Geek
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  Reply # 1413320 24-Oct-2015 22:11
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A couple of these with prepaid sim cards in would do?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Desktop-Phone-Wireless-Mobile-Home/dp/B006W74TIE

http://www.amazon.in/Visiontek-21G-Corded-Phone-Black/dp/B00E9UPJFI 

This product looks interesting as it has two rj11 ports:

Alibaba link

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  Reply # 1413321 24-Oct-2015 22:34
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Keep in mind that the whole management of the ballance on the card is done by SMS normally, so unless you have someone else that can add the connection to their vodafone app on their phone to keep an eye on, you will have no easy way to keep an eye on the ballance on the phone till people cant make calls on it.




Richard rich.ms



154 posts

Master Geek
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  Reply # 1413325 24-Oct-2015 23:11
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Wow! You guys are awesome!

I've been out today looking at the feasibility of putting in a Wireless Bridge. It is pretty close, but I suspect not quite possible. I found a railway footbridge directly between the two buildings and could see both from there, but only just. They were about the same height as the footbridge itself, so unless there is some scatter and bending of the signal, then might not be possible without putting the units on poles... which makes getting permission much harder, and therefore unlikely to be a viable solution.

A similar alternative would be to look through the church address-book to see if someone lives within line of sight of the location who might be amiable to running the wireless bridge from their house instead. Certainly a Wireless Bridge solution has attraction because of being able to run the phones on the same server and setup, and no Sim cards and topups to worry about. It also would enable other potential perks, whether offsite NAS backup, or other facilities gained by having the 2nd site online.

I think my current order of preference has changed slightly to:

 

     

  1. Wireless Bridge to Main Church centre (but unfortunately unlikely to work)
  2. Wireless Bridge to any local internet connection (depends on finding a suitable person/place)
  3. Running a GSM landline box.
  4. Vodafone Wireless Phone type system with 2 handsets
  5. GSM deskphone if it has no output.

 



@coffeebaron I'll flick you a pm tomorrow night, Thanks. If your box works, it'd be well worth giving it a go as it'd allow them to start saving immediately and dip a toe in the water for minimal cost. And since it is a loan we could use it immediately, even if it ended up just being a stopgap measure until/if a wireless bridge could be approved, and installed.

Mike

404 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1413398 25-Oct-2015 10:06
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Mike,


have you checked out https://airlink.ubnt.com/#/

 

once the antenna are on the roof it gives you at a guess 6m of height so the footbridge may not be a issue




 The views expressed by me are not necessarily those of my employer




154 posts

Master Geek
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  Reply # 1413773 26-Oct-2015 00:09
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hyperman: Mike,


have you checked out https://airlink.ubnt.com/#/
once the antenna are on the roof it gives you at a guess 6m of height so the footbridge may not be a issue


Great site! No, I hadn't seen that before. Thanks.

Quick survey using that tool says it is 1.68km distance, and suggests things like:  NBE-M5-19, nanostation M5
Probable no blockage inside the 1st Fresnel Zone, but trees and this railway bridge are both likely blockers that don't feature on that map, but there might be enough signal gets round them?

Is there any license/cost required to operate a wireless bridge over that distance? Do you need any regulatory permission to run such a setup?

Issue is likely to be if we wanted church permission (from various church committees!) to put a pole up above the roof, I could see that taking ages to get approval (and a good chance of it never getting approval!).... whereas if I could discretely put it nestled at the apex of the roof, it could probably get quick approval and less likely to have aesthetic complaints..... but that is pretty fringe whether it would work without a pole for extra height (and not easy to get up there to do a line of sight assessment myself!).

Talking with another guy at church, and his preference is to run Mobile data on a 3G router and terminate the phones as VOIP through an ATA (or get them some IP phones at the far end similar to the main church setup). His thinking being you can get a 1year data sim from 2Degrees for $99 and never get close to burning through it for the service. Would be more per year than either a bridge or GSM sim as voice, but still a good saving over a copper line rental! Also would allow smarter termination with the existing astrerix server.


So we really do have lots of options, and so one of them is bound to come up as working for us... just need to figure out which is the most stable, easiest to setup, cost effective, most future proofed solution.

Wireless Bridge = $400 up front, minimal ongoing?
GSM data to VOIP = $200 up front, $100 per year ongoing
GSM voice calls = $100 up front, $50 per year ongoing (although could easily get more expensive than data option if more calls were made!)
Existing copper service = $0 up front, $500 per year.

My crude analysis:
Most Stable:   is probably the either of GSM options (and easiest to fix if they have a problem)
Easiest to setup:  either of the GSM solutions
Cost effective:   GSM voice, followed by Wireless Bridge. BUT GSM data whilst being more money, is still a massive saving over copper.
Future Proofed:   Wireless Bridge followed by GSM data. GSM voice is most restrictive so less future potential.

Do those prices and analysis sound about right?

Any info on Wireless Bridge regulatory permission?

Thanks

Mike

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  Reply # 1413787 26-Oct-2015 07:40
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If you have any chance of a wireless bridge then go for that IMHO.

Since then you can run VoIP plus any other Internet services you want such as local wifi or ip cameras, alarms and you know it won't be wasted investment.

If you are unsure see if you could hire a pair or just suck it up and buy them and if it doesn't work sell them on as near new.

While the gsm options do seem appealing they don't give you any options should things change in the future.







154 posts

Master Geek
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  Reply # 1413796 26-Oct-2015 08:47
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Yeah. My thoughts exactly!

Wireless Bridge is hardest to achieve, but best outcome!

2nd best outcome is Wireless Bridge to an alternate location (anywhere with internet connection we can piggyback on).

Anything GSM/3G based is 3rd or 4th on my list of preferences (but easy to achieve). The rest of the ideas are below these and are none-runners since one of those four will work, so no point considering other options now.

If Wireless Bridge will take a while, then we can do GSM voice temporarily to start saving until we can get logistics sorted and get approval for wireless solution.

Mike

423 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1413821 26-Oct-2015 10:08
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The 2degrees $99 data pack only lasts for 6 months, not 12. Also doesn't work outside their own coverage areas, although I don't know where your site is based.

Skinny has something similar at $60 for 5GB for 6 months though. Or if you have a cellphone plan with VF/2D, or internet with Slingshot you can get a decent deal on an additional data SIM:
http://www.vodafone.co.nz/mobile-broadband/open-term-data/ - $10 for 500MB
https://www.2degreesmobile.co.nz/help-and-support/personal/mobile/products-and-services/shared-data/ - Free data sharing
https://www.slingshot.co.nz/mobile/slingshot-mobile - $10 per month for 1GB data

Or if you have someone that can swap them out once a month, you can buy Spark SIM cards with the $19 prepaid pack preloaded in bulk for about $5 each on trademe.

404 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1413867 26-Oct-2015 10:52
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miked:
hyperman: Mike,


have you checked out https://airlink.ubnt.com/#/
once the antenna are on the roof it gives you at a guess 6m of height so the footbridge may not be a issue


Great site! No, I hadn't seen that before. Thanks.

Quick survey using that tool says it is 1.68km distance, and suggests things like:  NBE-M5-19, nanostation M5
Probable no blockage inside the 1st Fresnel Zone, but trees and this railway bridge are both likely blockers that don't feature on that map, but there might be enough signal gets round them?

Is there any license/cost required to operate a wireless bridge over that distance? Do you need any regulatory permission to run such a setup?

Issue is likely to be if we wanted church permission (from various church committees!) to put a pole up above the roof, I could see that taking ages to get approval (and a good chance of it never getting approval!).... whereas if I could discretely put it nestled at the apex of the roof, it could probably get quick approval and less likely to have aesthetic complaints..... but that is pretty fringe whether it would work without a pole for extra height (and not easy to get up there to do a line of sight assessment myself!).

snip...

Thanks

Mike


no worry about licensing it's just the 2.4Ghz ISM band. I know people who have links of 20+ km! 
trees are genrally no too much of a worry unless they are close to either end, as for the bridge only real way to know is to try;
depending on your location Fraser maybe able to help with a site test

Alan




 The views expressed by me are not necessarily those of my employer


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  Reply # 1413890 26-Oct-2015 11:24
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Don't bother with 2.4. The 5ghz nanostations are only a few bucks more and the band seems clear enough still.




Richard rich.ms



154 posts

Master Geek
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  Reply # 1414146 26-Oct-2015 21:35
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Did some more scouting around the town today. Even less convinced the signal will get there between two churches. I managed to get on a hill behind the remote church building and look up the line over that building to the main church centre. I can see several buildings which will probably block it close by at this end, then a heavy row of trees. It actually just misses to the side of the railway bridge, but then you can only see the top of the spire at the far end anyway, and wireless unit would need to be mounted at base of spire so probably again blocked by trees and buildings at the far end close to the main church centre.

I'll try to return there in next few days with a camera to upload a picture of that view point for opinions, but it is looking likely that if we want a wireless bridge, we'll have to point it to a church member's house instead. Will do some nosing around to see who can see the church from their house and might be amiable to hosting the bridge and lending some bandwidth. I have one person in mind but that could take a while to negotiate, so I'd likely do one of the GSM/3G/4G data or Voice options as a stand-in.

I also realised I should ask to see the actual bills of that landline too for call volumes, because it is only hearsay so far that call volumes are minimal.... and their idea of minimal might be very different from mine! A few bills will confirm the reality and help shape the way ahead and refine the ongoing costs of each option.

More in a few days when I have some more info....

Mike

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