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70 posts

Master Geek
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Topic # 145455 18-May-2014 19:36
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In July 2011 I took the plunge after years of dithering and bought myself a top of the line 27" iMac.  It cost me a fair whack, but I was pretty damn happy with it, and given the house here is a full Mac shop, it's made life pretty streamlined.

In all the years before switching, I never had a hardware issue with any of the Windows boxes I ran.  If only that was the same for my iMac.

First issue arose during the first year, and Apple's "warranty" period.  HDD failed, and was replaced by a local service centre.  I had a full back-up so apart from the hassle, and 5 days with no machine while Apple agreed to replace, it wasn't too painful.

Second issue arose in June 2012, just on two years from original purchase.  Half the backlight on my screen stopped working.  Apple said "sorry, out of warranty, that'll be $1,650 to replace the screen".  Three weeks of debate with them, finally threatening the Disputes Tribunal over their product not being fit for purpose, and they relented, agreeing to pay for the replacement screen.

Fast forward to yesterday.  Still 2 months off the iMac's 3rd birthday and another issue has arisen.  I appear to be suffering from the blank white and blank black screens that warrant a video card replacement under an Apple agreed recall (http://support.apple.com/kb/TS5167).  My serial number is one of the covered machines.

While I can probably get this replaced fairly quickly (maybe a week or so) my issue is now more that I've had a third significant hardware failure on a machine that cost me almost $4,000, in less than three years.  I'm concerned about what will be next, and whether I'll be able to get Apple to agree to any replacement on that.

I'm almost at the point now where after three failures I believe the machine was never fit for purpose, and Apple should be offering a full replacement, rather than just swapping out bits as they fail.

Before I begin that discussion with them, I'm keen to canvass opinion here.

Any thoughts on what tack I should take?

Cheers
Andy

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1937 posts

Uber Geek
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  Reply # 1047598 18-May-2014 19:40
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Hi how confident are you at self law and how far are you prepared to take this?

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Uber Geek
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  Reply # 1047650 18-May-2014 22:42
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These are my thoughts. They are all different faults, and you have to remember that a computer is made of of different parts, which all can potentially fail. You have had 3 years use out of a computer, where 3 years seems to be what is normally the economical life of computer, at least for business use. 5 years possibly for home use, although obviously some people keep them longer.  It sounds like they will repair it anyway due to it being a known problem, so you will still have a fully working computer. They however shouldn't have initially denied the repair when the monitor failed after just over a year, which has probably tainted your experience. You could always push them for a replacement due to the number of faults, so you aren't just getting the same old one back repaired..

 
 
 
 


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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1047722 19-May-2014 07:44
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Who declined the repair, Apple or the local shop ?
They are VERY different beasts.

Apple did not make the hard drive

Apple did not make the screen

The CGA says they have the right to Repair (which they have), Replace, or refund.

The experience of one person does not make a trend.
At work we have Mac Plus's still working (along with some 386 PCs)

Based on hundreds of both Macs and PCs, they are both reliable.

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  Reply # 1047742 19-May-2014 08:14
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wtf. $1650 to repair/replace the display?

You have had 3 major issues with your machine. Display + Recall issue on top of the HDD failing in the first year. I reckon you might have a strong case here under the CGA to have the entire machine replaced as every year since you have had this machine, you have had major problems with it. $4000 is a lot of money.




Do whatever you want to do man.

  

Onward
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Uber Geek
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  Reply # 1047762 19-May-2014 08:28
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If the fault is minor the CGA provides that the choice lays with the retailer/supplier as to to the remedy. If the fault is major the CGA provides that the choice of remedy lays with the purchaser.

It would be worth while to seek advice from the Commission as to what you should do. It would seem that the history is of major faults.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


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  Reply # 1047821 19-May-2014 09:35
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Contact AppleCare and ask to speak to Apple Customer Relations, then explain your case to them.  I've had a lot of success getting Customer Relations to fix a situation, rather than AppleCare themselves.  Especially when the original AppleCare has expired.



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  Reply # 1048238 19-May-2014 17:17
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sir1963: Who declined the repair, Apple or the local shop ?
They are VERY different beasts.

Apple did not make the hard drive

Apple did not make the screen
.


How would a consumer know what components inside a computer apple made, and what ones were contracted out to other companies. As far as the consumer is concerned, it is a apple computer in it's entirety, and apple have to take responsibility for the stuff they sell, whether they sub contracted that out to someone else or not. Under your argument, if a component on the harddrive failed, say a chip, then the harddrive manufacturer could say, well we didn't make that component, that was made by XYZ and you need to contact them. 
Apple still need to abide by the CGA, even if the computer was sold by a retailer. The retailer will often refer you to apple anyway when you need technical support for it.
I think the point about this case , is the value of the item, which is near the top end of the market for computers these days. Is it reasonable for a $4000 computer to need 3 reapirs in 3 years, 2 of which sound quite substantial. But it is subjective and comes down to people interpretations.

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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 1048266 19-May-2014 17:44
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mattwnz:
sir1963: Who declined the repair, Apple or the local shop ?
They are VERY different beasts.

Apple did not make the hard drive

Apple did not make the screen
.


How would a consumer know what components inside a computer apple made, and what ones were contracted out to other companies. As far as the consumer is concerned, it is a apple computer in it's entirety, and apple have to take responsibility for the stuff they sell, whether they sub contracted that out to someone else or not. Under your argument, if a component on the harddrive failed, say a chip, then the harddrive manufacturer could say, well we didn't make that component, that was made by XYZ and you need to contact them. 
Apple still need to abide by the CGA, even if the computer was sold by a retailer. The retailer will often refer you to apple anyway when you need technical support for it.
I think the point about this case , is the value of the item, which is near the top end of the market for computers these days. Is it reasonable for a $4000 computer to need 3 reapirs in 3 years, 2 of which sound quite substantial. But it is subjective and comes down to people interpretations.


I have the same machine, its has performed flawlessly apart from the HD, which Apple contacted ME about even though there has been no faults with my HD they still offered to replace it for FREE. So Apple has been very proactive.

I have found Apple every good to deal with, Retailers (Who are legally the first port of call under the CGA) are much less so, they have no interest in supplying support and if they can fob you off to someone else they will. The Sales Droids in most retail shops are clueless and will steer you to products where their commission is highest, rather than the product which would be best for you. I have had sales droids walk away from me when they realise that I get cost +10% prices as their commission drops to sod all, and I have seen them lie to customers about products so they could sell them one that has greater profits/commission.




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Uber Geek
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  Reply # 1048292 19-May-2014 18:13
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Why do companies just think that they can say Nope sorry out of warranty, $1.6k to fix it,  When its covered under the CGA. It should be illegal for them to say that

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Uber Geek
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  Reply # 1048304 19-May-2014 18:33
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Yabanize: Why do companies just think that they can say Nope sorry out of warranty, $1.6k to fix it,  When its covered under the CGA. It should be illegal for them to say that

 

They will possibly say it verbally, so no record. But I believe retailers can be fined for misleading consumers over their consumer rights regarding the CGA, but haven't heard of any that have been. The margin in the sale price should cover the costs of having to deal with possible CGA claims, as well as provide the retailer with a profit. 

 

This is an interesting story about Apple in Australia and the ACCC https://www.accc.gov.au/media-release/apple-australia-gives-undertaking-to-accc-to-improve-its-consumer-guarantees-policies-and-practices



70 posts

Master Geek
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  Reply # 1048388 19-May-2014 20:34
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Hi all

Thanks for all the thoughts.

ahmad: Hi how confident are you at self law and how far are you prepared to take this?

Pretty confident.  I have good legal advice behind me that I don't have to pay for.

sir1963: Who declined the repair, Apple or the local shop ?
They are VERY different beasts.

Apple declined it.  I purchased directly from Apple's NZ online store. And they argued the point for quite some time. I think because I was dealing with people initially in Australia, and then Singapore. But ultimately they (the retailer) are responsible and did agree to repair.

sir1963: I have the same machine, its has performed flawlessly apart from the HD, which Apple contacted ME about even though there has been no faults with my HD they still offered to replace it for FREE. So Apple has been very proactive.

My first issue was a HD failure, so not an Apple pro-active response.  Second one I'm aware there have been replacements done, but may just be "usual" failure rates.  Third one, they have a formal replacement offer in place. Its been offered since August 2013.  I only found out about it thanks to Google.  Not what I'd call proactive.

mattnz: I think the point about this case , is the value of the item, which is near the top end of the market for computers these days. Is it reasonable for a $4000 computer to need 3 reapirs in 3 years, 2 of which sound quite substantial. But it is subjective and comes down to people interpretations.

I agree it's subjective.  But I'm pretty unhappy about the quality of a high end product like this.

TBH, I don't care who made the components in the computer.  I bought an Apple computer directly from Apple.  I paid a fairly full price for what I expected to be (and have experienced with other Apple products) a high quality product, and in this particular case I don't feel like I've got that.

I have a call in to them, and am waiting for a call back.

Thanks for comments.



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Master Geek
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  Reply # 1058258 2-Jun-2014 21:40
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Just a quick update on this.

Apple have agreed to cover any hardware faults.  Didn't take much discussion with them, although the call centre guy in Sydney had to connect me with a more senior person in Singapore to deal with it.  They've been pretty good and efficient in general.

Unfortunately the Apple authorised repair place in Auckland has been apalling with their customer service and it's not yet even diagnosed fully.



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Master Geek
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  Reply # 1071668 21-Jun-2014 13:56
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Final update on this.

Yesterday I received a brand new iMac direct from Apple.  They agreed to replace my old one as it had failed so many times in 3 years.  The new one is a slightly higher spec too.

While it took a bit of time to get this resolved, I'm happy with the outcome and the way Apple responded. 

What I'm not so happy with is the shockingly bad customer service from an Apple Authorised Service Centre in Auckland.  They will not be getting any of my custom again.

A.

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