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3889 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 163


  Reply # 871060 3-Aug-2013 01:06
Send private message

KiwiNZ:
DonGould:
What do we actually do about this spying without over sight?

How, as a community to we actually fix this problem?




Actually very little, the Government has the numbers to pass the legislation. in 2014 you can vote for say NZ Green, NZ Maori or Labour, the later has said they will repeal it however history has shown that it is seldom the case.


Ok so this law will come to pass and won't get rolled back.

So again, how do we, as a community, ensure over sight?






Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

Check out mine - i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz - don@i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz


509 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 155
Inactive user


  Reply # 871066 3-Aug-2013 01:42
Send private message

Open data could have a field day with this.
Let the public run it.

119 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 22
Inactive user


  Reply # 871169 3-Aug-2013 12:24
Send private message

You can email the members of the club.

Below is an example

Keep it concise (not like my posts) and be polite.

Please don't post from your work email.

Once you've crafted your little gift pass it on to others to spread the love.

Request a Read and Delivery Receipt.

Subject: I do not consent to the GCSB bill 109-2

Message Body:

Dear Member of Parliament,

I do not consent to the GCSB bill 109-2.

I do no consent to any spying from any agency.

Sincerely,

Joe Bloggs.

The email addresses are from the link below ~175
http://www.parliament.nz/en-nz/mpp/mps/contact/00HOOOCMPPMPsContact1/contact-list

I'd suggest copying and pasting the addresses below into the BCC "Blind Carbon Copy" field.

a.adams@ministers.govt.nz; selwynoffice@parliament.govt.nz; jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz; shane.ardern@parliament.govt.nz; chris.auchinvole@parliament.govt.nz; kanwaljit.singh.bakshi@parliament.govt.nz; j.banks@ministers.govt.nz; johnbanks.epsom@parliament.govt.nz; Maggie.barry@parliament.govt.nz; carol.beaumont@parliament.govt.nz; david.bennett@parliament.govt.nz; felicity.cuzens@parliament.govt.nz; c.borrows@ministers.govt.nz; chester.wanganui@xtra.co.nz; chester.hawera@xtra.co.nz; s.bridges@ministers.govt.nz; steffan.browning@parliament.govt.nz; g.brownlee@parliament.govt.nz; ainslie.newell@parliament.govt.nz; cam.calderMP@parliament.govt.nz; speakersoffice3@parliament.govt.nz; cartermp@parliament.govt.nz; david.clark@parliament.govt.nz; david.clendon@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.auckland@greens.org.nz; j.coleman@ministers.govt.nz; j.collins@ministers.govt.nz; office@judithcollins.co.nz; clayton.cosgrove@parliament.govt.nz; clayton.cosgrove.mp@parliament.govt.nz; david.cunliffe@parliament.govt.nz; newlynnmp@parliament.govt.nz; clare.curran@parliament.govt.nz; lianne.dalziel@parliament.govt.nz; Jacqui.dean@parliament.govt.nz; Catherine.delahunty@parliament.govt.nz; p.dunne@ministers.govt.nz; electjville@xtra.co.nz; ruth.dyson@parliament.govt.nz; porthills.mp@parliament.govt.nz; b.english@ministers.govt.nz; elecgor@esi.co.nz; matthew.swann@parliament.govt.nz; mana.electorate@parliament.govt.nz; darien.fenton@parliament.govt.nz; office@labournorth.org.nz; c.finlayson@ministers.govt.nz; teururoa.flavell@parliament.govt.nz; c.foss@ministers.govt.nz; craigfoss@backingthebay.co.nz; Paul.Foster-Bell@parliament.govt.nz; Julie.genter@parliament.govt.nz; phil.goff@parliament.govt.nz; phil@goff.org.nz; paul.goldsmith@parliament.govt.nz; j.goodhew@ministers.govt.nz; Kennedy.graham@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.christchurch@greens.org.nz; t.groser@ministers.govt.nz; nathan.guy@ministers.govt.nz; national.horowhenua@xtra.co.nz; national.kapiti@xtra.co.nz; kevin.hague@parliament.govt.nz; Hone.harawira@parliament.govt.nz; john.hayes@parliament.govt.nz; phil.heatley@parliament.govt.nz; tau.henare@parliament.govt.nz; tau.henaremp@parliament.govt.nz; chris.hipkins@parliament.govt.nz; josephine.collins@parliament.govt.nz; janette.granville@parliament.govt.nz; Brendan.horan@parliament.govt.nz; gareth.hughes@parliament.govt.nz; raymond.huo@parliament.govt.nz; paul.hutchison@parliament.govt.nz; hunua.electorate@xtra.co.nz; shane.jones@parliament.govt.nz; shanejonesmp@xtra.co.nz; s.joyce@ministers.govt.nz; n.kaye@ministers.govt.nz; j.key@ministers.govt.nz; genelle@johnkey.mp.net.nz; A.King@parliament.govt.nz; kilbirnieeo@xtra.co.nz; colin.king@parliament.govt.nz; colin.kingmp@xtra.co.nz; melissa.lee@parliament.govt.nz; Iain.lees-galloway@parliament.govt.nz; graham@iainleesgallowaymp.org; joyce@iainleesgallowaymp.org; Andrew.little@parliament.govt.nz; Jan.logie@parliament.govt.nz; Asenati.Lole-Taylor@parliament.govt.nz; NZFirst.aucklandsouth@parliament.govt.nz; peseta.sam.lotu-iiga@parliament.govt.nz; sam4maungakiekie@parliament.govt.nz; tim.macindoe@parliament.govt.nz; moana.mackey@labour.org.nz; nanaia.mahuta@parliament.govt.nz; tainuielectorate@xtra.co.nz; trevor.mallard@parliament.govt.nz; WOAoffice@xtra.co.nz; petone.eo@clear.net.nz; Tracey.martin@parliament.govt.nz; mojo.mathers@parliament.govt.nz; todd.mcclay@parliament.govt.nz; m.mccully@ministers.govt.nz; murray.mccully@xtra.co.nz; Ian.mckelvie@parliament.govt.nz; mark.mitchell@parliament.govt.nz; sue.moroney@parliament.govt.nz; waikatohub.mps@xtra.co.nz; Alfred.ngaro@parliament.govt.nz; russel.norman@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.wellington@parliament.govt.nz; Damien.oconnor@parliament.govt.nz; Simon.OConnor@parliament.govt.nz; Denis.ORourke@parliament.govt.nz; h.parata@ministers.govt.nz; david.parker@parliament.govt.nz; NZFirst@parliament.govt.nz; rajen.prasad@parliament.govt.nz; Richard.prosser@parliament.govt.nz; jen.toogood@parliament.govt.nz; office@grantrobertson.co.nz; ross.robertson@parliament.govt.nz; rae.waterhouse@parliament.govt.nz; michael.clatworthy@parliament.govt.nz; denise.roche@parliament.govt.nz; jam <-lee.rossmp@parliament.govt.nz>; BotanyMP@parliament.govt.nz; eric.roy@parliament.govt.nz; t.ryall@ministers.govt.nz; mike.sabin@parliament.govt.nz; Eugenie.sage@parliament.govt.nz; heather.henderson@parliament.govt.nz; pita.sharples@ministers.govt.nz; david.shearer@parliament.govt.nz; scott.simpson@parliament.govt.nz; sua.william.sio@parliament.govt.nz; n.smith@ministers.govt.nz; nick@nick4nelson.co.nz; barbara.stewart@parliament.govt.nz; maryan.street@parliament.govt.nz; rino.tirikatene@parliament.govt.nz; lindsay.tisch@parliament.govt.nz; Tisch.tekauwhata@xtra.co.nz; anne.tolley@ministers.govt.nz; tolleywhk@xtra.co.nz; tolleygis@parliament.govt.nz; c.tremain@ministers.govt.nz; napier.electorate@airnet.net.nz; metiria.turei@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.dunedin@greens.org.nz; t.turia@ministers.govt.nz; Tari.Turia@xtra.co.nz; phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz; libby.obrien@parliament.govt.nz; Upston.taupo@parliament.govt.nz; Upston.sthwaikato@parliament.govt.nz; Upston.cambridge@parliament.govt.nz; nicky.wagner@parliament.govt.nz; Chch.office@parliament.govt.nz; holly.walker@parliament.govt.nz; Mereana.Ruri@parliament.govt.nz; kate.wilkinson@parliament.govt.nz; waimakariri@xtra.co.nz; Andrew.williams@parliament.govt.nz; andrew.williamsMP@parliament.govt.nz; m.williamson@ministers.govt.nz; m.woodhouse@ministers.govt.nz; blueandgold@parliament.govt.nz; jian.yang@parliament.govt.nz; jonathan.young@parliament.govt.nz



X

12872 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6079

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 871216 3-Aug-2013 14:15
Send private message

Woolly: You can email the members of the club.

Below is an example

Keep it concise (not like my posts) and be polite.

Please don't post from your work email.

Once you've crafted your little gift pass it on to others to spread the love.

Request a Read and Delivery Receipt.

Subject: I do not consent to the GCSB bill 109-2

Message Body:

Dear Member of Parliament,

I do not consent to the GCSB bill 109-2.

I do no consent to any spying from any agency.

Sincerely,

Joe Bloggs.

The email addresses are from the link below ~175
http://www.parliament.nz/en-nz/mpp/mps/contact/00HOOOCMPPMPsContact1/contact-list

I'd suggest copying and pasting the addresses below into the BCC "Blind Carbon Copy" field.

a.adams@ministers.govt.nz; selwynoffice@parliament.govt.nz; jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz; shane.ardern@parliament.govt.nz; chris.auchinvole@parliament.govt.nz; kanwaljit.singh.bakshi@parliament.govt.nz; j.banks@ministers.govt.nz; johnbanks.epsom@parliament.govt.nz; Maggie.barry@parliament.govt.nz; carol.beaumont@parliament.govt.nz; david.bennett@parliament.govt.nz; felicity.cuzens@parliament.govt.nz; c.borrows@ministers.govt.nz; chester.wanganui@xtra.co.nz; chester.hawera@xtra.co.nz; s.bridges@ministers.govt.nz; steffan.browning@parliament.govt.nz; g.brownlee@parliament.govt.nz; ainslie.newell@parliament.govt.nz; cam.calderMP@parliament.govt.nz; speakersoffice3@parliament.govt.nz; cartermp@parliament.govt.nz; david.clark@parliament.govt.nz; david.clendon@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.auckland@greens.org.nz; j.coleman@ministers.govt.nz; j.collins@ministers.govt.nz; office@judithcollins.co.nz; clayton.cosgrove@parliament.govt.nz; clayton.cosgrove.mp@parliament.govt.nz; david.cunliffe@parliament.govt.nz; newlynnmp@parliament.govt.nz; clare.curran@parliament.govt.nz; lianne.dalziel@parliament.govt.nz; Jacqui.dean@parliament.govt.nz; Catherine.delahunty@parliament.govt.nz; p.dunne@ministers.govt.nz; electjville@xtra.co.nz; ruth.dyson@parliament.govt.nz; porthills.mp@parliament.govt.nz; b.english@ministers.govt.nz; elecgor@esi.co.nz; matthew.swann@parliament.govt.nz; mana.electorate@parliament.govt.nz; darien.fenton@parliament.govt.nz; office@labournorth.org.nz; c.finlayson@ministers.govt.nz; teururoa.flavell@parliament.govt.nz; c.foss@ministers.govt.nz; craigfoss@backingthebay.co.nz; Paul.Foster-Bell@parliament.govt.nz; Julie.genter@parliament.govt.nz; phil.goff@parliament.govt.nz; phil@goff.org.nz; paul.goldsmith@parliament.govt.nz; j.goodhew@ministers.govt.nz; Kennedy.graham@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.christchurch@greens.org.nz; t.groser@ministers.govt.nz; nathan.guy@ministers.govt.nz; national.horowhenua@xtra.co.nz; national.kapiti@xtra.co.nz; kevin.hague@parliament.govt.nz; Hone.harawira@parliament.govt.nz; john.hayes@parliament.govt.nz; phil.heatley@parliament.govt.nz; tau.henare@parliament.govt.nz; tau.henaremp@parliament.govt.nz; chris.hipkins@parliament.govt.nz; josephine.collins@parliament.govt.nz; janette.granville@parliament.govt.nz; Brendan.horan@parliament.govt.nz; gareth.hughes@parliament.govt.nz; raymond.huo@parliament.govt.nz; paul.hutchison@parliament.govt.nz; hunua.electorate@xtra.co.nz; shane.jones@parliament.govt.nz; shanejonesmp@xtra.co.nz; s.joyce@ministers.govt.nz; n.kaye@ministers.govt.nz; j.key@ministers.govt.nz; genelle@johnkey.mp.net.nz; A.King@parliament.govt.nz; kilbirnieeo@xtra.co.nz; colin.king@parliament.govt.nz; colin.kingmp@xtra.co.nz; melissa.lee@parliament.govt.nz; Iain.lees-galloway@parliament.govt.nz; graham@iainleesgallowaymp.org; joyce@iainleesgallowaymp.org; Andrew.little@parliament.govt.nz; Jan.logie@parliament.govt.nz; Asenati.Lole-Taylor@parliament.govt.nz; NZFirst.aucklandsouth@parliament.govt.nz; peseta.sam.lotu-iiga@parliament.govt.nz; sam4maungakiekie@parliament.govt.nz; tim.macindoe@parliament.govt.nz; moana.mackey@labour.org.nz; nanaia.mahuta@parliament.govt.nz; tainuielectorate@xtra.co.nz; trevor.mallard@parliament.govt.nz; WOAoffice@xtra.co.nz; petone.eo@clear.net.nz; Tracey.martin@parliament.govt.nz; mojo.mathers@parliament.govt.nz; todd.mcclay@parliament.govt.nz; m.mccully@ministers.govt.nz; murray.mccully@xtra.co.nz; Ian.mckelvie@parliament.govt.nz; mark.mitchell@parliament.govt.nz; sue.moroney@parliament.govt.nz; waikatohub.mps@xtra.co.nz; Alfred.ngaro@parliament.govt.nz; russel.norman@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.wellington@parliament.govt.nz; Damien.oconnor@parliament.govt.nz; Simon.OConnor@parliament.govt.nz; Denis.ORourke@parliament.govt.nz; h.parata@ministers.govt.nz; david.parker@parliament.govt.nz; NZFirst@parliament.govt.nz; rajen.prasad@parliament.govt.nz; Richard.prosser@parliament.govt.nz; jen.toogood@parliament.govt.nz; office@grantrobertson.co.nz; ross.robertson@parliament.govt.nz; rae.waterhouse@parliament.govt.nz; michael.clatworthy@parliament.govt.nz; denise.roche@parliament.govt.nz; jam <-lee.rossmp@parliament.govt.nz>; BotanyMP@parliament.govt.nz; eric.roy@parliament.govt.nz; t.ryall@ministers.govt.nz; mike.sabin@parliament.govt.nz; Eugenie.sage@parliament.govt.nz; heather.henderson@parliament.govt.nz; pita.sharples@ministers.govt.nz; david.shearer@parliament.govt.nz; scott.simpson@parliament.govt.nz; sua.william.sio@parliament.govt.nz; n.smith@ministers.govt.nz; nick@nick4nelson.co.nz; barbara.stewart@parliament.govt.nz; maryan.street@parliament.govt.nz; rino.tirikatene@parliament.govt.nz; lindsay.tisch@parliament.govt.nz; Tisch.tekauwhata@xtra.co.nz; anne.tolley@ministers.govt.nz; tolleywhk@xtra.co.nz; tolleygis@parliament.govt.nz; c.tremain@ministers.govt.nz; napier.electorate@airnet.net.nz; metiria.turei@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.dunedin@greens.org.nz; t.turia@ministers.govt.nz; Tari.Turia@xtra.co.nz; phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz; libby.obrien@parliament.govt.nz; Upston.taupo@parliament.govt.nz; Upston.sthwaikato@parliament.govt.nz; Upston.cambridge@parliament.govt.nz; nicky.wagner@parliament.govt.nz; Chch.office@parliament.govt.nz; holly.walker@parliament.govt.nz; Mereana.Ruri@parliament.govt.nz; kate.wilkinson@parliament.govt.nz; waimakariri@xtra.co.nz; Andrew.williams@parliament.govt.nz; andrew.williamsMP@parliament.govt.nz; m.williamson@ministers.govt.nz; m.woodhouse@ministers.govt.nz; blueandgold@parliament.govt.nz; jian.yang@parliament.govt.nz; jonathan.young@parliament.govt.nz



X


Why send it to the opposition members ? they do not support the bill.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


12872 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6079

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 871218 3-Aug-2013 14:16
Send private message

DonGould:
KiwiNZ:
DonGould:
What do we actually do about this spying without over sight?

How, as a community to we actually fix this problem?




Actually very little, the Government has the numbers to pass the legislation. in 2014 you can vote for say NZ Green, NZ Maori or Labour, the later has said they will repeal it however history has shown that it is seldom the case.


Ok so this law will come to pass and won't get rolled back.

So again, how do we, as a community, ensure over sight?




Change our Parliamentary system.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


509 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 155
Inactive user


  Reply # 871246 3-Aug-2013 15:54
Send private message

Oversight can only be achieved if there is significant understanding about the negative effects of uncontrolled "spying" on communities, which, other than George Orwells' fictional novel, I don't think that there is.

NZ needs to ensure that spy bills are "proportional" to real threats.

Before something is proposed as a solution there should be evidence that the solution works. Eg collection of data is causative and effective at curbing extremist behaviours, to the best of my knowledge this does not exist.

However should it suddenly exist like the world wide, month long, terrorist threats did, overnight

Oversight might include :
1/ Full documentation of the reasons for suspecting a person of a crime (or activity that might be a crime in the future)
2/ Full documentation on the impact of the crime on the Local, National or Global community and it's relevance to national security.
3/ Documented evidence of such a person/s planning to commit such a crime or retrospective evidence of similar historic crimes being committed by the same individual or close associates.
4/ documentation of the extent of intrusion required to gather the evidence required to prove the crime is being planned.
5/ Independent peer reviews of all evidence and reasoning performed by a randomised and constantly changing panel of rugby players and other sports stars.
6/ Further peer reviews of the peer reviews and the raw data, by independent journalists and whistle blowers .
7/ A Judge must then issue a warrant and all paperwork then becomes Creative Commons in 2 years, or upon conviction or reprieve.
8/ Significant liability and penalties for all reviewers and personal using or otherwise engaged in spying or data collection for any reason other than to protect national security, expressively excluding commercial or political gain.

Mr Key states for example that there are AQ operatives such as Mark Taylor living in Hamilton NZ. He has limitations on his activities that are extremely secret, so secret even he does not know what they are. It seems despite this the courts can not write an arrest warrant for the individual , he is free to roam the streets and do interviews with Patrick Gower from TV3. Yet he is the given reason why we should all be considered potential threats.

Of course if you need high grade Bull Shi*t you can buy it in bulk from a garden store like Palmers or Mitre 10, the source is written on the side of the bag.

4529 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2022

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 871263 3-Aug-2013 16:57
4 people support this post
Send private message

The government is also attempting to conflate their requirement to be able to spy on targeted individuals whom there are good reasons to suspect of serious crime, with their desire to wholesale spy on everyone, all the time, and save all that information just in case they or someone else like the NSA might decide it's useful in future.

These are two completely different things, and it is at best disingenuous to confuse them in the minds of the public in this way. Not even I have a problem with targeted interception of high risk individuals, with a warrant from someone or someones impartial. But I will not stand for my family and friends being spied on 'just in case'.

Your point about the inherent problem of having people so dangerous they need to be surveilled indefinitely yet so innocent they can't be arrested is also a good one, and it applies equally well to the no-fly lists in the states. At least we don't have that here yet.

Edit: damn autocorrect.




iPad Air + iPhone SE + 2degrees 4tw!

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.


810 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 191
Inactive user


  Reply # 871292 3-Aug-2013 17:30
Send private message

To best ensure oversight we should become a republic and rewrite the constitution to explicitly require transparency from: government, parliament, the judiciary, all ministries and departments, any other government/public entity I've forgotten about, and from any entity otherwise working for or providing services to the aforementioned.

It would be a challenge writing the mechanism for requiring transparency while remaining clear, concise, and leaving no loop holes. More challenging still would be the process of getting to a point where we can, as a country, rewrite our constitution from scratch. And the most challenging part would be getting everyone to agree on the new constitution.

119 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 22
Inactive user


  Reply # 871536 4-Aug-2013 11:41
Send private message

I agree with turnin, salty and paul - Random panel of rugby players lol.

KiwiNZ - I included opposition members as they won't be in opposition forever.

This is the fourth amendment to the US Constitution (written to limit the powers of government).

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers,
and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be
violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause,
supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place
to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Granted the USG no longer follows it's constitution.

I think bills coming before parliament should be conscience votes unless it was a party issue before the election.

Below is a good example of a system protecting itself in Iceland
http://www.opendemocracy.net/can-europe-make-it/thorvaldur-gylfason/democracy-on-ice-post-mortem-of-icelandic-constitution

The Jones Plantation 12 mins
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vb8Rj5xkDPk

The Tiny Dot 6 mins
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6b70TUbdfs

STATISM: The Most Dangerous Religion?! 15 mins
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS-MCvmNDu8

National Security 20 mins
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJRTqOvCaAg



3889 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 163


  Reply # 871665 4-Aug-2013 19:08
Send private message

Woolly: You can email the members of the club.

Below is an example

Keep it concise (not like my posts) and be polite.

Please don't post from your work email.

Once you've crafted your little gift pass it on to others to spread the love.

Request a Read and Delivery Receipt.

Subject: I do not consent to the GCSB bill 109-2

Message Body:

Dear Member of Parliament,

I do not consent to the GCSB bill 109-2.

I do no consent to any spying from any agency.

Sincerely,

Joe Bloggs.

The email addresses are from the link below ~175
http://www.parliament.nz/en-nz/mpp/mps/contact/00HOOOCMPPMPsContact1/contact-list

I'd suggest copying and pasting the addresses below into the BCC "Blind Carbon Copy" field.

a.adams@ministers.govt.nz; selwynoffice@parliament.govt.nz; jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz; shane.ardern@parliament.govt.nz; chris.auchinvole@parliament.govt.nz; kanwaljit.singh.bakshi@parliament.govt.nz; j.banks@ministers.govt.nz; johnbanks.epsom@parliament.govt.nz; Maggie.barry@parliament.govt.nz; carol.beaumont@parliament.govt.nz; david.bennett@parliament.govt.nz; felicity.cuzens@parliament.govt.nz; c.borrows@ministers.govt.nz; chester.wanganui@xtra.co.nz; chester.hawera@xtra.co.nz; s.bridges@ministers.govt.nz; steffan.browning@parliament.govt.nz; g.brownlee@parliament.govt.nz; ainslie.newell@parliament.govt.nz; cam.calderMP@parliament.govt.nz; speakersoffice3@parliament.govt.nz; cartermp@parliament.govt.nz; david.clark@parliament.govt.nz; david.clendon@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.auckland@greens.org.nz; j.coleman@ministers.govt.nz; j.collins@ministers.govt.nz; office@judithcollins.co.nz; clayton.cosgrove@parliament.govt.nz; clayton.cosgrove.mp@parliament.govt.nz; david.cunliffe@parliament.govt.nz; newlynnmp@parliament.govt.nz; clare.curran@parliament.govt.nz; lianne.dalziel@parliament.govt.nz; Jacqui.dean@parliament.govt.nz; Catherine.delahunty@parliament.govt.nz; p.dunne@ministers.govt.nz; electjville@xtra.co.nz; ruth.dyson@parliament.govt.nz; porthills.mp@parliament.govt.nz; b.english@ministers.govt.nz; elecgor@esi.co.nz; matthew.swann@parliament.govt.nz; mana.electorate@parliament.govt.nz; darien.fenton@parliament.govt.nz; office@labournorth.org.nz; c.finlayson@ministers.govt.nz; teururoa.flavell@parliament.govt.nz; c.foss@ministers.govt.nz; craigfoss@backingthebay.co.nz; Paul.Foster-Bell@parliament.govt.nz; Julie.genter@parliament.govt.nz; phil.goff@parliament.govt.nz; phil@goff.org.nz; paul.goldsmith@parliament.govt.nz; j.goodhew@ministers.govt.nz; Kennedy.graham@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.christchurch@greens.org.nz; t.groser@ministers.govt.nz; nathan.guy@ministers.govt.nz; national.horowhenua@xtra.co.nz; national.kapiti@xtra.co.nz; kevin.hague@parliament.govt.nz; Hone.harawira@parliament.govt.nz; john.hayes@parliament.govt.nz; phil.heatley@parliament.govt.nz; tau.henare@parliament.govt.nz; tau.henaremp@parliament.govt.nz; chris.hipkins@parliament.govt.nz; josephine.collins@parliament.govt.nz; janette.granville@parliament.govt.nz; Brendan.horan@parliament.govt.nz; gareth.hughes@parliament.govt.nz; raymond.huo@parliament.govt.nz; paul.hutchison@parliament.govt.nz; hunua.electorate@xtra.co.nz; shane.jones@parliament.govt.nz; shanejonesmp@xtra.co.nz; s.joyce@ministers.govt.nz; n.kaye@ministers.govt.nz; j.key@ministers.govt.nz; genelle@johnkey.mp.net.nz; A.King@parliament.govt.nz; kilbirnieeo@xtra.co.nz; colin.king@parliament.govt.nz; colin.kingmp@xtra.co.nz; melissa.lee@parliament.govt.nz; Iain.lees-galloway@parliament.govt.nz; graham@iainleesgallowaymp.org; joyce@iainleesgallowaymp.org; Andrew.little@parliament.govt.nz; Jan.logie@parliament.govt.nz; Asenati.Lole-Taylor@parliament.govt.nz; NZFirst.aucklandsouth@parliament.govt.nz; peseta.sam.lotu-iiga@parliament.govt.nz; sam4maungakiekie@parliament.govt.nz; tim.macindoe@parliament.govt.nz; moana.mackey@labour.org.nz; nanaia.mahuta@parliament.govt.nz; tainuielectorate@xtra.co.nz; trevor.mallard@parliament.govt.nz; WOAoffice@xtra.co.nz; petone.eo@clear.net.nz; Tracey.martin@parliament.govt.nz; mojo.mathers@parliament.govt.nz; todd.mcclay@parliament.govt.nz; m.mccully@ministers.govt.nz; murray.mccully@xtra.co.nz; Ian.mckelvie@parliament.govt.nz; mark.mitchell@parliament.govt.nz; sue.moroney@parliament.govt.nz; waikatohub.mps@xtra.co.nz; Alfred.ngaro@parliament.govt.nz; russel.norman@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.wellington@parliament.govt.nz; Damien.oconnor@parliament.govt.nz; Simon.OConnor@parliament.govt.nz; Denis.ORourke@parliament.govt.nz; h.parata@ministers.govt.nz; david.parker@parliament.govt.nz; NZFirst@parliament.govt.nz; rajen.prasad@parliament.govt.nz; Richard.prosser@parliament.govt.nz; jen.toogood@parliament.govt.nz; office@grantrobertson.co.nz; ross.robertson@parliament.govt.nz; rae.waterhouse@parliament.govt.nz; michael.clatworthy@parliament.govt.nz; denise.roche@parliament.govt.nz; jam <-lee.rossmp@parliament.govt.nz>; BotanyMP@parliament.govt.nz; eric.roy@parliament.govt.nz; t.ryall@ministers.govt.nz; mike.sabin@parliament.govt.nz; Eugenie.sage@parliament.govt.nz; heather.henderson@parliament.govt.nz; pita.sharples@ministers.govt.nz; david.shearer@parliament.govt.nz; scott.simpson@parliament.govt.nz; sua.william.sio@parliament.govt.nz; n.smith@ministers.govt.nz; nick@nick4nelson.co.nz; barbara.stewart@parliament.govt.nz; maryan.street@parliament.govt.nz; rino.tirikatene@parliament.govt.nz; lindsay.tisch@parliament.govt.nz; Tisch.tekauwhata@xtra.co.nz; anne.tolley@ministers.govt.nz; tolleywhk@xtra.co.nz; tolleygis@parliament.govt.nz; c.tremain@ministers.govt.nz; napier.electorate@airnet.net.nz; metiria.turei@parliament.govt.nz; greenmps.dunedin@greens.org.nz; t.turia@ministers.govt.nz; Tari.Turia@xtra.co.nz; phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz; libby.obrien@parliament.govt.nz; Upston.taupo@parliament.govt.nz; Upston.sthwaikato@parliament.govt.nz; Upston.cambridge@parliament.govt.nz; nicky.wagner@parliament.govt.nz; Chch.office@parliament.govt.nz; holly.walker@parliament.govt.nz; Mereana.Ruri@parliament.govt.nz; kate.wilkinson@parliament.govt.nz; waimakariri@xtra.co.nz; Andrew.williams@parliament.govt.nz; andrew.williamsMP@parliament.govt.nz; m.williamson@ministers.govt.nz; m.woodhouse@ministers.govt.nz; blueandgold@parliament.govt.nz; jian.yang@parliament.govt.nz; jonathan.young@parliament.govt.nz



X



Well that's a bit of a mission.

My mail system didn't like 175 addresses in a single message. 

There seems to be quite a few addresses in that list that cause delivery failure as well.

But hey, done my bit to support the cause :)

D





Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

Check out mine - i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz - don@i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz


3889 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 163


  Reply # 871668 4-Aug-2013 19:14
Send private message

PaulBags: To best ensure oversight we should become a republic and rewrite the constitution to explicitly require transparency from: government, parliament, the judiciary, all ministries and departments, any other government/public entity I've forgotten about, and from any entity otherwise working for or providing services to the aforementioned.

It would be a challenge writing the mechanism for requiring transparency while remaining clear, concise, and leaving no loop holes. More challenging still would be the process of getting to a point where we can, as a country, rewrite our constitution from scratch. And the most challenging part would be getting everyone to agree on the new constitution.


I really think we have to think within the bounds of reality.

It's just silly thinking that we're going to consider moving to a republic.

More realistically we need to be thinking about how we manage a world where the GCSB has these powers which it's clearly going to get.






Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

Check out mine - i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz - don@i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz


2385 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 286
Inactive user


  Reply # 871672 4-Aug-2013 19:23
Send private message

Woolly: You can email the members of the club.

Below is an example


Careful. If you using gmail, Google may just be snooping on your emails and passing this information onto Government. 

Rather send them snail mail if you would like to remain anonymous.

12872 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 6079

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Subscriber

  Reply # 871697 4-Aug-2013 20:18
Send private message

DonGould:
PaulBags: To best ensure oversight we should become a republic and rewrite the constitution to explicitly require transparency from: government, parliament, the judiciary, all ministries and departments, any other government/public entity I've forgotten about, and from any entity otherwise working for or providing services to the aforementioned.

It would be a challenge writing the mechanism for requiring transparency while remaining clear, concise, and leaving no loop holes. More challenging still would be the process of getting to a point where we can, as a country, rewrite our constitution from scratch. And the most challenging part would be getting everyone to agree on the new constitution.


I really think we have to think within the bounds of reality.

It's just silly thinking that we're going to consider moving to a republic.

More realistically we need to be thinking about how we manage a world where the GCSB has these powers which it's clearly going to get.




 

your life will not change.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


810 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 191
Inactive user


  Reply # 871742 4-Aug-2013 21:17
Send private message

DonGould:
PaulBags: To best ensure oversight we should become a republic and rewrite the constitution to explicitly require transparency from: government, parliament, the judiciary, all ministries and departments, any other government/public entity I've forgotten about, and from any entity otherwise working for or providing services to the aforementioned.

It would be a challenge writing the mechanism for requiring transparency while remaining clear, concise, and leaving no loop holes. More challenging still would be the process of getting to a point where we can, as a country, rewrite our constitution from scratch. And the most challenging part would be getting everyone to agree on the new constitution.


I really think we have to think within the bounds of reality.

It's just silly thinking that we're going to consider moving to a republic.

More realistically we need to be thinking about how we manage a world where the GCSB has these powers which it's clearly going to get.




In your scenario we're being managed by the world, not the other way around.

509 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 155
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  Reply # 871743 4-Aug-2013 21:19
Send private message

KiwiNZ:  

your life will not change.


Thats what my father in law told me. 

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