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Devastation by stupidity
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  #960856 3-Jan-2014 17:15
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I want to thank everyone who has contributed to this discussion. I started this thread because I have had a lot of bad experiences with Chinese products and I wanted to know what others thought about this.

 

 

I do think a lot of rubbish is dumped on New Zealand. No doubt this will correct itself over time, but right now it is still a major issue. I hope if enough voices are raised, things may improve sooner rather than later. Many good points have been made, the most obvious being you get what you pay for and you shouldn’t buy junk. The problem in my opinion is that there is not always a lot of choice and with electronics in particular it is often impossible to tell if something is any good or not. I just don’t like the feeling that I am spinning a roulette wheel every time I buy something. When I purchase a product, I want it to just work. I don’t need the hassle that comes with repeated failures and warranty claims. I want the item I pay good money for to work as it is supposed to from the beginning and I don’t think that is an unreasonable demand, even for cheap generic stuff. Someone mentioned Taiwan and that is a good example of this. Over the years I have had a lot of inexpensive generic products from Taiwan, and never problems with any of them. I do make a distinction in this regard between Taiwan and mainland China.

 

 

Is Chinese stuff rubbish? I am aware that Apple and other leading brands are made there. I also have a Foxconn motherboard and Lenovo monitors and different hard drives that have worked flawlessly for years. But of course the issue is not with products that work well, which is what they are supposed to do anyway, but with those that don’t. In my experience, too many don’t. This assertion is based on my actual experience, not snobbishness or any kind of prejudice. I wish Chinese products did work well. It would make my life a lot easier.

 

 

I do agree that quality control is the main issue. There are rarely problems with brand names made in China. I also agree that quality is more likely to suffer where factory workers are treated badly. Occasionally a scandal leaks out, but otherwise how can a consumer here know which product is ethical and which isn’t? Most products available here are generic and carry names that don’t mean anything and change with every batch.

 

 

Someone asked which specific products I had trouble with and how much I paid for them. In most cases I don’t have that information at hand and retrieving it would be more trouble than I want to go to. What I can say is that my means are limited so I do look for bargains, and what is wrong with that? Some things came from the Internet, others from Jaycar or Dick Smith. Both companies sell a lot of rebranded Chinese merchandise. Unlike Apple, I don’t think they exercise a lot of quality assurance. I sometimes wonder how they make money if so much of their stuff has to be replaced under warranty. Maybe people just don’t bother.

 

 

Thanks again for the responses, also from those who don’t have any problem with Chinese products. It is good to have balanced feedback on a subject like this.

 

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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  #960859 3-Jan-2014 17:24
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I find this thread quite amusing. Open just about any phone, TV, Fridge, Photocopier, Computer, Motor Vehicle, DVD  player....... and voilà Chinese components.




Mike
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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

He waka eke noa


 
 
 
 


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  #960874 3-Jan-2014 17:34
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KiwiNZ: I find this thread quite amusing. Open just about any phone, TV, Fridge, Photocopier, Computer, Motor Vehicle, DVD  player....... and voilà Chinese components.


Exactly.

Regarding stuff being dumped here that the OP just mentioned, its a case of NZ based resellers/retailers importing the stuff. China has a reputation, sure, but given the massive volume of stuff that is here in NZ, IT gear, homeware, fridges, everything, if it was that bad most of the stuff we own will be falling apart, so in my opinion, its about balancing past reputation with what is happening now, and looking at all the products, and excluding thje unbranded, really cheap stuff as that is likely to be the cheap stuff behaving as expected. The OP is of limited means and thats ok, but its often better to buy better now and save in the medium term. 

Google a product, there will be info on Google. If there isn't, dont buy, if reviews, utterings are not good, dont buy. Caveat Emptor

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  #960892 3-Jan-2014 18:19
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Experienced buyers are well aware of the MTBF/failure and expected return rates of the factories and brokers they buy from. The reason they are buying is because they understand the failure rate, they are set up to handle it, and they know retail customers still buy in spite of the failure rate. There is a market for $40 DVD players.

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  #960912 3-Jan-2014 20:02
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gzt: Experienced buyers are well aware of the MTBF/failure and expected return rates of the factories and brokers they buy from. The reason they are buying is because they understand the failure rate, they are set up to handle it, and they know retail customers still buy in spite of the failure rate. There is a market for $40 DVD players.


The $300+ DVD players are full of Chinese components .




Mike
Change Management Consultant
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

He waka eke noa


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  #960938 3-Jan-2014 21:26
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KiwiNZ:
gzt: Experienced buyers are well aware of the MTBF/failure and expected return rates of the factories and brokers they buy from. The reason they are buying is because they understand the failure rate, they are set up to handle it, and they know retail customers still buy in spite of the failure rate. There is a market for $40 DVD players.


The $300+ DVD players are full of Chinese components .


Yup, but if the $40 DVD player croaks after 12 months then no one would blink. If the $300+ player croaks in the same timeframe in would be marched back to the store.
Our thirst for cheap (and nasty) and retailers need for a profit margin means there is a market for junk!




Nothing is impossible for the man who doesn't have to do it himself - A. H. Weiler


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  #961071 4-Jan-2014 12:58
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robjg63:
KiwiNZ:
gzt: Experienced buyers are well aware of the MTBF/failure and expected return rates of the factories and brokers they buy from. The reason they are buying is because they understand the failure rate, they are set up to handle it, and they know retail customers still buy in spite of the failure rate. There is a market for $40 DVD players.


The $300+ DVD players are full of Chinese components .


Yup, but if the $40 DVD player croaks after 12 months then no one would blink. If the $300+ player croaks in the same timeframe in would be marched back to the store.
Our thirst for cheap (and nasty) and retailers need for a profit margin means there is a market for junk!


I believe that there is another factor in play here. If you buy the $300 DVD player, you might expect it to work for 5 years without problems and it will be feature packed. If you buy the $40 player, it will have fewer features and will die after 12 months so you buy another one for another $40 and you find that most of the features that were lacking on the one from last year have now made it onto the new one and your cheap DVD player has now cost you $80 (you had to buy two of them) and it is now not so far behind the $300 unit that you could have bought.

Another year, another $40 DVD player and your $120 now has you a unit that is actually an advance over the $300 unit.

Finally after 5 years, you have spent $200 on $40 DVD players and your latest one, like the 5 year old #300 DVD player is now on it's last legs. Compared to your $40 dollar player, the $300 looks like some piece of 19th century steam punk junk, it does not support quantum plasma fields, you still need to actually plug it in and the remote control cannot integrate with your holographic instant microwave fridge.

In areas of consumer electronics, people actually appreciate ultra cheap stuff that lasts for a year and can then be replaced with an upgraded model for the same money. What's the upgrade cycle for cell phones? It's not just electronics. In Europe, imported clothing has become so cheap that young people view an outfit as a disposable item bought for one evening out and worn just once.


 
 
 
 


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  #961075 4-Jan-2014 13:14
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jpoc: I believe that there is another factor in play here. If you buy the $300 DVD player, you might expect it to work for 5 years without problems and it will be feature packed. If you buy the $40 player, it will have fewer features and will die after 12 months so you buy another one for another $40 and you find that most of the features that were lacking on the one from last year have now made it onto the new one and your cheap DVD player has now cost you $80 (you had to buy two of them) and it is now not so far behind the $300 unit that you could have bought.

Another year, another $40 DVD player and your $120 now has you a unit that is actually an advance over the $300 unit.


You are forgetting the environmental impact of this, and the risk of the cheap machine potentially failing suddenly at an inconvenient time.

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  #961076 4-Jan-2014 13:19
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A problem I find is people buy $40 DVD's expecting to get $300 DVD's for $40 and are angry and surprised when they work as $40 components should.




Mike
Change Management Consultant
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

He waka eke noa




Devastation by stupidity
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  #961095 4-Jan-2014 14:40
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KiwiNZ: A problem I find is people buy $40 DVD's expecting to get $300 DVD's for $40 and are angry and surprised when they work as $40 components should.

 

I think you are oversimplifying a little here. I paid $160 for a sub-woofer amp and it lasted all of two weeks. I did not buy it because it was cheap but because it was the only item I could find that met my requirements. I paid $60 for a digital photo frame on special. It died after a few months. I got my money back but would rather have had a working photo frame. My Openbox was not cheap and nasty, but supposedly one of the better satellite receivers. I forget exactly what I paid, I think over $200. It barely lasted out the warranty period. There are other examples but I will stop here. I did not buy any of these items with the idea that they were $40 DVD players that would die in a year and still save me money in the long run. I paid the prices being asked and bought them in the hope and expectation that they would perform as promised and last for a reasonable period of time. I have seen nothing here that has made me change my mind about the performance of Chinese wares.

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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  #961096 4-Jan-2014 14:53
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That's certainly a bad run, how many others here have repeated failures on Chinese gear?

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  #961097 4-Jan-2014 14:56
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Bought a cheap Android USB TV stick from China a year or so ago. It was faulty as it would not download and save Play Store apps without giving Write errors. Sent it back and received a replacement which had the same problem. Sent the second one back and the supplier claimed it never arrived so never received a refund.

Since then I am wary of buying electronics direct from China. I have however recently ordered 4 cheap 12V LED lamps which I hope are better than those the op tried. LED spot light bulbs are so much more expensive here which can also come from China. Should these LED bulbs fail I think it will cure me from buying goods direct from China for quite some time.

Perhaps we need a forum topic which lists companies from China that do supply reliable goods.

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  #961098 4-Jan-2014 14:56
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KiwiNZ: A problem I find is people buy $40 DVD's expecting to get $300 DVD's for $40 and are angry and surprised when they work as $40 components should.


I agree

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  #961102 4-Jan-2014 15:05
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geek4me: Bought a cheap Android USB TV stick from China a year or so ago. It was faulty as it would not download and save Play Store apps without giving Write errors. Sent it back and received a replacement which had the same problem. Sent the second one back and the supplier claimed it never arrived so never received a refund.

Since then I am wary of buying electronics direct from China. I have however recently ordered 4 cheap 12V LED lamps which I hope are better than those the op tried. LED spot light bulbs are so much more expensive here which can also come from China. Should these LED bulbs fail I think it will cure me from buying goods direct from China for quite some time.

Perhaps we need a forum topic which lists companies from China that do supply reliable goods.


Yep. There are a gazillion suppliers and brands there, what we see in NZ is supposedly the more reliable suppliers and products. Always a market for $40 DVD players and $9 kettles and that's fine. As per a previous post I'd rather buy a $300 player and enjoy it, sell it to upgrade when I want new features than run through 5 crap players over 5 years.

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  #961107 4-Jan-2014 15:16
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geek4me: Perhaps we need a forum topic which lists companies from China that do supply reliable goods.

China does have major local electronics brands. We do not have those here. A list of good quality brands for each market segment may be more useful. These brands have a reputation to maintain. It is required to effectively compete against Japanese/Taiwanese/Korean goods in the mainland market.

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