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  Reply # 1131990 19-Sep-2014 10:26
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BDFL - Memuneh
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  Reply # 1131993 19-Sep-2014 10:33
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How The NSA Enabled Israel Military Intelligence To Politically Persecute Innocent Palestinians


In a letter to their commanders, to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and to the head of the Israeli army, they charged that Israel used information collected against innocent Palestinians for “political persecution.” In testimonies and interviews given to the media, they specified that data were gathered on Palestinians’ sexual orientations, infidelities, money problems, family medical conditions and other private matters that could be used to coerce Palestinians into becoming collaborators or create divisions in their society.


Again: people not involved in any criminal activities being spied on so that later their private lives can be used against them.







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  Reply # 1131995 19-Sep-2014 10:36
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Glassboy:
turnin: 
In the past 6 weeks we have learned a lot of secrets about NZ politics, so far everyone who has shown us these more than likely truths has been dismissed as conspiracy theorists, including Greenwald.
I understand why people can make the mistake of thinking these are simply "election stunts" but then, I also understand why dogs can tie themselves up in their leads.



We've learnt exactly zero secrets.  Secret means that people didn't know.  People did know.


Orly.. I suspect senior national staff knew, but not the general public.

- People (and especially reporters) didn't know that Slater was getting preferential treatment being directed to put in specific wording as part of OIAs
- We didn't know Ede the senior staffer in Keys office was working actively with Slater on the release of the labour partys database to have the most impact
- We didn't know that Slater was taking money to blog on certain things while appearing to get them "from the tip line" and pretending to hold some journalistic integrity.
- We knew that Collins had a close relationship with Slater, but we didn't know it was that close and how foolish unwise she was in aiding and abetting cyber bullying by handing a public servants name onto Slater who then ended out getting death threads on WhaleOil. This was while she was Minister of Justice (or was it Police at the time?). And now she says if the indiviual in question wants to make a complaint he is free to knowing full well that public servants are supposed to remain politically neutral. Not that she would apologize for it.
- That MSM journalists were being incredibly slack and trusting what Slater was saying as honest and truthful thus re-printing it verbatim. Something now that has thankfully stopped apart from newstalk ZB. 

Hummm should I go on?





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  Reply # 1132011 19-Sep-2014 10:56
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freitasm: How The NSA Enabled Israel Military Intelligence To Politically Persecute Innocent Palestinians


In a letter to their commanders, to Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and to the head of the Israeli army, they charged that Israel used information collected against innocent Palestinians for “political persecution.” In testimonies and interviews given to the media, they specified that data were gathered on Palestinians’ sexual orientations, infidelities, money problems, family medical conditions and other private matters that could be used to coerce Palestinians into becoming collaborators or create divisions in their society.


Again: people not involved in any criminal activities being spied on so that later their private lives can be used against them.



Yep its going to be embarrassing when they use my text messages to my wife nagging for new toys, dammit.




Mike
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The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1132013 19-Sep-2014 10:58
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I don't think you need the NSA (*note: not GCSB, at least no evidence as yet) to spy on you to get your private life.

Cue Nicky Hager

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  Reply # 1132067 19-Sep-2014 11:53
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However we are still placed in the position where

1) In a 'non-online' world, police and security agencies can seek HUMINT from a wide variety of sources - agents in place, informers, observation operations and so on, almost all of which are regarded as a normal part of policing.

2) If the crims, terrorists etc then go on line and hide their comms etc that way, and the security agencies and police cannot find out about the activities from informers etc, how exactly are they supposed to catch them?

I do not suggest that I actually WANT mass surveillance. I merely posit that the internet world has gifted the scum of society a handy way to avoid being caught (mostly) and because of it's nature, some form of difference in powers between IRL and Online for the relevant authorities seems to me essential.

I'd hate, for example, to see a commuter train blown up in Auckland because the police were powerless to sift the electronic comms of the population as a method of helping identify the nutters responsible unless they had a warrant and the judge would not sign the warrant unless they could provide evidence of reasonable suspicion.

As I say, it's a Catch 22. I think expecting to transfer the same methodologies etc from real life to online is unlikely to work.





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  Reply # 1132074 19-Sep-2014 12:03
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What annoys me the most is a few mainly non NZers have hijacked the election for personal and covert agendas and the real issues have been forgotten such as...

Affordable sustainable housing,
Fiscal growth and management,
Tertiary education,
Health and child poverty,
Climate change,
Christchurch,
etc etc etc




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1132076 19-Sep-2014 12:05
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KiwiNZ: What annoys me the most is a few mainly non NZers have hijacked the election for personal and covert agendas and the real issues have been forgotten such as...

Affordable sustainable housing,
Fiscal growth and management,
Tertiary education,
Health and child poverty,
Climate change,
Christchurch,
etc etc etc


Not sure anyone has forgotten Christchurch. It seems to be mentioned so often it's verging on becoming background noise though or the victim of 'disaster fatigue'.

I've heard all the other issues mentioned with tedious regularity as well.





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  Reply # 1132082 19-Sep-2014 12:12
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Geektastic:
KiwiNZ: What annoys me the most is a few mainly non NZers have hijacked the election for personal and covert agendas and the real issues have been forgotten such as...

Affordable sustainable housing,
Fiscal growth and management,
Tertiary education,
Health and child poverty,
Climate change,
Christchurch,
etc etc etc


Not sure anyone has forgotten Christchurch. It seems to be mentioned so often it's verging on becoming background noise though or the victim of 'disaster fatigue'.

I've heard all the other issues mentioned with tedious regularity as well.


Christchurch not forgotten just being managed badly.So the loss of objective focus means that the fiasco will continue. I believe with Christchurch we will end up with a shiny new city all dressed up and no place to go. Thus monies poorly spent.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1132084 19-Sep-2014 12:18
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KiwiNZ:
Geektastic:
KiwiNZ: What annoys me the most is a few mainly non NZers have hijacked the election for personal and covert agendas and the real issues have been forgotten such as...

Affordable sustainable housing,
Fiscal growth and management,
Tertiary education,
Health and child poverty,
Climate change,
Christchurch,
etc etc etc


Not sure anyone has forgotten Christchurch. It seems to be mentioned so often it's verging on becoming background noise though or the victim of 'disaster fatigue'.

I've heard all the other issues mentioned with tedious regularity as well.


Christchurch not forgotten just being managed badly.So the loss of objective focus means that the fiasco will continue. I believe with Christchurch we will end up with a shiny new city all dressed up and no place to go. Thus monies poorly spent.


Oh I agree with you there. I have never seen anything take so long. One cannot help but think the Japanese, Germans etc would have had it all done and dusted ages ago had it been in their countries.

Of course, they do not waste decades 'consulting' with everyone - they come up with a reasonable plan, have a brief period of consultation and then tell people what will be happening!





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  Reply # 1132093 19-Sep-2014 12:33
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I can't agree more. Why can't Christchurch people see that? I am allowed to say that as I quit the city

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  Reply # 1132097 19-Sep-2014 12:37
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KiwiNZ: What annoys me the most is a few mainly non NZers have hijacked the election for personal and covert agendas and the real issues have been forgotten such as...


What annoys me the most is when someone claims the election has been hijacked just because someone has raised issues that aren't on his own personal agenda.

(Having said that, the issues you list are all also important :) ).

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  Reply # 1132100 19-Sep-2014 12:45
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frankv:
KiwiNZ: What annoys me the most is a few mainly non NZers have hijacked the election for personal and covert agendas and the real issues have been forgotten such as...


What annoys me the most is when someone claims the election has been hijacked just because someone has raised issues that aren't on his own personal agenda.

(Having said that, the issues you list are all also important :) ).


See you don't know me.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1132106 19-Sep-2014 13:08
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BarTender:
Glassboy:
turnin: 
In the past 6 weeks we have learned a lot of secrets about NZ politics, so far everyone who has shown us these more than likely truths has been dismissed as conspiracy theorists, including Greenwald.
I understand why people can make the mistake of thinking these are simply "election stunts" but then, I also understand why dogs can tie themselves up in their leads.



We've learnt exactly zero secrets.  Secret means that people didn't know.  People did know.


Orly.. I suspect senior national staff knew, but not the general public.

- People (and especially reporters) didn't know that Slater was getting preferential treatment being directed to put in specific wording as part of OIAs
- We didn't know Ede the senior staffer in Keys office was working actively with Slater on the release of the labour partys database to have the most impact
- We didn't know that Slater was taking money to blog on certain things while appearing to get them "from the tip line" and pretending to hold some journalistic integrity.
- We knew that Collins had a close relationship with Slater, but we didn't know it was that close and how foolish unwise she was in aiding and abetting cyber bullying by handing a public servants name onto Slater who then ended out getting death threads on WhaleOil. This was while she was Minister of Justice (or was it Police at the time?). And now she says if the indiviual in question wants to make a complaint he is free to knowing full well that public servants are supposed to remain politically neutral. Not that she would apologize for it.
- That MSM journalists were being incredibly slack and trusting what Slater was saying as honest and truthful thus re-printing it verbatim. Something now that has thankfully stopped apart from newstalk ZB. 

Hummm should I go on?


What you don't know doesn't equate to the general public. Also the general public isn't pushing a distinct political agenda.

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  Reply # 1132134 19-Sep-2014 13:52
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As an uncommitted and undecided voter, I am looking for some cogent analysis of what's happening just before the election. There's not a lot. It's like the election day ban on political advertising has started a day early and not much is happening. Maybe the journalists and commentators are saving it up for the post-election analysis.

This morning the only thread on politics in the geekzone "recent" list is this one. I thought there would more happening than just this thread which is probably the nadir for recent discussions. It has got to 26 pages without much of any import that relates directly to the "Moment of Truth" and NZ - although some of the links to overseas events are very interesting.

I've read the links posted by the OP. It's all very underwhelming and hardly justifies the tags others have used (such as #dirtyPM or #dirtypolitics) and the obvious scaremongering in some of those linked webpages.

I am very unlikely to ever vote for John Key but It seems to me that he's come out of this looking better than he went into it.

[edits to remove repeated word and fix spelling mistake. It doesn't pay to type when I'm unwell.]

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