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  Reply # 1199094 17-Dec-2014 13:27
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dpw:
DravidDavid:
dpw: I heard something on TV recently, a discussion about the role of cats in harming native wildlife. I didn't hear the full article but caught the mention of Trap-Neuter-Return by someone. I may have incorrectly heard that the person who mentioned it (possibly someone from SPCA?) said it's not a good solution for the alarming issue of rising cat population.

My partner is a vet nurse, and we are involved with the local Christchurch organisation called Cat Rescue. To my knowledge they're the only one in the country who are running a TNR programme. We have fostered numerous feral (they prefer to call it "unsocialised") kittens so far. They have been raised to be amazing young cats (thanks to one of our dogs who turned out to be a kitten whisperer extraordinaire), before they're neutered/spayed and placed in suitable homes. I don't believe TNR is the silver bullet for the rising cat population issue, then again, I'm not sure such a silver bullet exists for this issue. However, I think it can be a great part of of a wider solution. I'm surprised it hasn't been mentioned more around the country.

Have you guys heard of this programme? What are your thoughts?


My partner (also a vet nurse) was actively involved with cat colonies with an organisation called Lonely Meow.  TNR was their policy and re-homing kittens that could be domesticated is also practiced.  Any cat with aids or other diseases are sadly euthanized, but the rest are returned.

I filmed a feral cat being trapped on a crappy digital camera and uploaded it to YouTube.  I've recently hit 1000 likes and 100,000 views.  I've also been in touch with Aucklanders in the YouTube comments about sourcing a trap to catch their feral cat.


DravidDavid: I don't think those stating TNR is contributing to the rising cat population.  I believe it is keeping it at bay while slowly reducing it.  From what I understand, removing a cat only puts more in it's place as they migrate from other areas.  Keeping the cat colony population stable by returning them while disallowing them to breed stops other cats migrating from other areas.


I can't recall anyone actually saying TNR contributes to the rising cat population. I just heard that it was not the solution to it or some such. I agree with you about the removal of a cat from its territory, which made me question this quote from Lonely Miaow website:

"Lonely Miaow's mission is 'No more Strays'.  Our rescue method is known as trap-assess-resolve (TAR). We never return a cat back to a colony situation and we do whatever possible to rehome the cats and kittens we rescue."

It sounds like they're not practicing TNR at all. I'm not a cat population control expert, so please do not take this as me saying one is better than the other. I'm just curious.


Interesting.  Perhaps I got it wrong.  I do think they return the bigger cats,  the ones too far gone to domesticate that is.  The kittens certainly go to homes no questions asked.  They get checked by the vet, and if the vet OK's the kitten it goes to a foster home.

My understanding was that they thought removing cats was a bad idea because of some kind of territorial blow-back that resulted in more cats than there were previously.

This was a year or so ago now however.  Perhaps their policy has changed.  I'll follow up with my partner tonight and clarify.





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  Reply # 1199098 17-Dec-2014 13:31
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Rikkitic:
DravidDavid:
Fred99:
We don't seem to have much of a clue about how animals think, and seem to underestimate their intelligence.  I'm not sure about cats, but dogs seem to understand us with greater depth than we understand them.


I think all animals have a similar understanding of us.  I think we all under-estimate their intelligence.  I think people find dogs understand them more because they express their feelings in a very similar way to what we do.  They are as enthusiastic about us as we are them!

Cats don't have the same level of emotion that we can visibly see, but are probably expressing it in ways we can't really pick up on.


I am not a cat expert, just a cat lover, but I have spent a lot of time around them and made some observations. Cats do not respond the same way dogs do, but their capacity for emotion should not be underestimated. I have seen my cats happy and sad, and their feelings are unmistakable. My cats also love me, and they express it better than most people do. Cats make their feelings crystal-clear.


You and I certainly see it that way.  But some people are terrible at picking up emotions from people, let alone animals.  We are animal lovers and tune in to their thoughts and behaviors more than an average "family that has a cat" might do.

I still can't help but say dogs seem to convey their feelings to us at least in a more enthusiastic manner.  In saying that.  when I stick Hazel's food cup in to the food container, she runs right up eyes bulging out of her skull trying to tap the cup out of my hand before I can get it to the food bowl, haha!





Sometimes what you don't get is a blessing in disguise!

 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 1199106 17-Dec-2014 13:41
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DravidDavid: 

My partner (also a vet nurse) was actively involved with cat colonies with an organisation called Lonely Meow.  TNR was their policy and re-homing kittens that could be domesticated is also practiced.  Any cat with aids or other diseases are sadly euthanized, but the rest are returned.

I filmed a feral cat being trapped on a crappy digital camera and uploaded it to YouTube.  I've recently hit 1000 likes and 100,000 views.  I've also been in touch with Aucklanders in the YouTube comments about sourcing a trap to catch their feral cat.

I don't think those stating TNR is contributing to the rising cat population.  I believe it is keeping it at bay while slowly reducing it.  From what I understand, removing a cat only puts more in it's place as they migrate from other areas.  Keeping the cat colony population stable by returning them while disallowing them to breed stops other cats migrating from other areas.

Here is the YouTube video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQ8C8mGqmh4

Here is another video of my vicious cat attacking the local bird life:
http://youtu.be/vGKzC_dbr68



I just popped out & snapped a pic of one of the simple, easy to make cat traps we use.

Made mainly of 2nd hand ply, mesh on the floor & other end.

The door is light galv sheet, heavy enough to drop fast but not heavy enough to hurt any tails.

Click to see full size




Glurp
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  Reply # 1199136 17-Dec-2014 13:57
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When my cats were tiny, I caught them and brought them inside because trapping, transferring, and transporting the previous litter for neutering when they were nearly adult size had been like restaging the Land Wars. I raised the 5 little ones until they were big enough to be operated. When I arrived at the vet I was asked what their names were. 'Uhhh..., Eeny, Meeny, Miney, Moe', I replied, unable to think of anything else. 'And Big Eyes'. Thus it was.

 

 

I was going to release them after that, but by then they thought I was mummy and I had fallen in love with them. We have been an item ever since. They cuddle up to me in bed at night, and nearly push me out now that they are nearly grown. They like to get up a lot earlier than I do and they run up the curtains and bounce off the walls if I don't let them out in time. When I get angry and curse them, they run and hide until the coast is clear. They know perfectly well they are misbehaving, and they hang their heads in shame. In so many ways they are exactly like small children. Anyone who thinks they do not have an emotional life as full and rich as ours simply does not know cats.

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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  Reply # 1199230 17-Dec-2014 15:12
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Hi, do you have some pics of your current kitties?




Whatifthespacekeyhadneverbeeninvented?




Glurp
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  Reply # 1199251 17-Dec-2014 15:25
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DarthKermit: Hi, do you have some pics of your current kitties?

 

 

That's the one I posted on the pet thread. It's about in the middle or a little further. Sorry, I don't have the link. It shows them looking at a picture of themselves on the big screen.

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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  Reply # 1199256 17-Dec-2014 15:29
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Tuna bombs those are called.  They aren't used anymore because they don't work.  Exclusion nets are now best practice for keeping out seals.  They work about 98% but seals are clever.

What we forget is that a food is a very powerful positive reinforcement, and will generally override fear.
 
I have seen footage of cranes/storks feeding on rubbish heaps in Africa.  The rubbish is on fire, some of the birds have visible leg burns, every now and then an aerosol can explodes, the birds don't even flinch.




Fred99:
Some salmon farms used to use waterproof firecrackers to scare off seals that wanted to enjoy a free easy feed.  Then the seals got used to the bangs, then worse, they seemed to use the sound of the bangs as dinner gongs.  

We don't seem to have much of a clue about how animals think, and seem to underestimate their intelligence.  I'm not sure about cats, but dogs seem to understand us with greater depth than we understand them.




Mike

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  Reply # 1199261 17-Dec-2014 15:40
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Rikkitic:
DarthKermit: Hi, do you have some pics of your current kitties?
That's the one I posted on the pet thread. It's about in the middle or a little further. Sorry, I don't have the link. It shows them looking at a picture of themselves on the big screen.


I found it. They're lovely cats. Scrolling thru that thread made me feel really sad again that my baby has gone. frown




Whatifthespacekeyhadneverbeeninvented?


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