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  # 1326469 17-Jun-2015 12:46
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scuwp:  or subverted on this occasion.


^^ This.  My impression when I read this on Facebook was just media trolling.




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  # 1326470 17-Jun-2015 12:47
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frankv:
DonGould: It would make much more sense to simply require them to attend driver training and pay for it.


I don't understand why NZ schools don't include driving as a part of their curriculum. Virtually every NZer will at some time need to learn to drive. It makes sense to me that our teaching institutions should do this.



I would suggest our school system focuses on things like reading, writing and maths before worrying about driving.

Basic financial education (HPs are BAD, Credit Cards poorly managed are BAD) would be well above driving in my book.

If you want to learn to drive - you can, schools don't need to do it. 



 
 
 
 


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  # 1326471 17-Jun-2015 12:51
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wasabi2k:
frankv:
DonGould: It would make much more sense to simply require them to attend driver training and pay for it.


I don't understand why NZ schools don't include driving as a part of their curriculum. Virtually every NZer will at some time need to learn to drive. It makes sense to me that our teaching institutions should do this.



I would suggest our school system focuses on things like reading, writing and maths before worrying about driving.

Basic financial education (HPs are BAD, Credit Cards poorly managed are BAD) would be well above driving in my book.

If you want to learn to drive - you can, schools don't need to do it. 




Makes my point.  Let's see how many folk click +1 to agree with you.

Interestingly reading, writting or math education, or financial education doesn't impact road death.

Should we be putting kids in go-carts from age 12 and getting them much more aware of controlling a vechicle?

How many more lives would be saved?

148 road deaths so far this year.




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  # 1326472 17-Jun-2015 12:53
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wasabi2k:
frankv:
DonGould: It would make much more sense to simply require them to attend driver training and pay for it.


I don't understand why NZ schools don't include driving as a part of their curriculum. Virtually every NZer will at some time need to learn to drive. It makes sense to me that our teaching institutions should do this.



I would suggest our school system focuses on things like reading, writing and maths before worrying about driving.

Basic financial education (HPs are BAD, Credit Cards poorly managed are BAD) would be well above driving in my book.

If you want to learn to drive - you can, schools don't need to do it. 




It enhances employment opportunity and that is what school is about so it makes sense to offer driver education in schools.




Mike
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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

Using empathy takes no energy and can gain so much. Try it.

 

 


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  # 1326473 17-Jun-2015 12:55
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DonGould:
MileHighKiwi: I actually think the best thing to do is impose mandatory jail sentences, say 7 days for repeated driving without a license.


That's $1,700 a time.  I'm happy with that idea as long as you're picking up the tab and not me.

It would make much more sense to simply require them to attend driver training and pay for it.




You're right. It costs us more in the long run. I guess my point is, fining these people doesn't work. I know a guy who had more than $60,000 in fines. I kid you not. My mates young, boy racer brother. This is going back more than 10 years, not sure you can get that far in debt these days??

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  # 1326474 17-Jun-2015 12:57
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MileHighKiwi:  not sure you can get that far in debt these days??


That's just some poor policing right there isn't it?

Likely to just drive someone to crime.




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  # 1326498 17-Jun-2015 13:35
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MileHighKiwi: On one hand I really don't like this, but on the other hand I think fining people who are unlikely to pay is just a waste of time. You only have to watch Road Cops or Police Ten Seven and hear the bros say "add it to the tab" to understand their attitude to fines. The tab gets bigger until they take $10 per week from their benefit. I actually think the best thing to do is impose mandatory jail sentences, say 7 days for repeated driving without a license.


No need; just crush their cars.




iPad Pro 11" + iPhone XS + 2degrees 4tw!

 

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.


 
 
 
 




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  # 1326508 17-Jun-2015 13:44
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DonGould:
MileHighKiwi:  not sure you can get that far in debt these days??


That's just some poor policing right there isn't it?

Likely to just drive someone to crime.


That's a preposterous argument!

He accrued the fines by committing crimes in the first place.  To suggest otherwise (and that somehow the police caused the situation by charging him after he committed those crimes) is a failure of logic.

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  # 1326514 17-Jun-2015 13:52
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6FIEND:
DonGould:
MileHighKiwi:  not sure you can get that far in debt these days??


That's just some poor policing right there isn't it?

Likely to just drive someone to crime.


That's a preposterous argument!

He accrued the fines by committing crimes in the first place.  To suggest otherwise (and that somehow the police caused the situation by charging him after he committed those crimes) is a failure of logic.


It seems more logical to me that the example of restorative justice be used and those fines converted into X number of hours of community work.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

Using empathy takes no energy and can gain so much. Try it.

 

 




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  # 1326522 17-Jun-2015 14:03
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MikeB4: It seems more logical to me that the example of restorative justice be used and those fines converted into X number of hours of community work.


I'd agree with you there.  Providing the effective hourly rate for the community work is no greater than the national median.
(I.e. you don't get to swap out $60k in fines for 200hrs community service, which would be an effective pay rate of $300/hr net. (over $900k per year gross))

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  # 1326523 17-Jun-2015 14:05
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frankv: Whilst I agree with the "one rule for all" sentiment, there is a key aspect which hasn't been mentioned in this thread... to avoid a fine, there is a requirement to gain a license within 2 months.


Very good point here.

We had inadvertently gone past our WOF period by a day or so when we were stopped at a police random stop checkpoint on a Sunday.
The officer inspected the car, checked the children were secured correctly in the proper child seats etc and then found our front left tyre to be worn on the outer edge.

We were issued a $180 fine, but with instructions that this would be waived if we presented a new WOF pass sheet to the local police station within one week.

Went in that Monday, got the WOF, did have to replace the tyre too, took the sheet into the Police station and the fine was waived.

The Police Office made it clear right from the start that his main concern was keeping the cars safe on the road, especially family vehicles in this case as he'd attended a few roll over crashes where the front tyres had popped.

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  # 1326539 17-Jun-2015 14:33
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Is this April 1 again? That was a quick year!




Swype on iOS is detrimental to accurate typing. Apologies in advance.


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  # 1326541 17-Jun-2015 14:38
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Jaxson:
frankv: Whilst I agree with the "one rule for all" sentiment, there is a key aspect which hasn't been mentioned in this thread... to avoid a fine, there is a requirement to gain a license within 2 months.


Very good point here.

We had inadvertently gone past our WOF period by a day or so when we were stopped at a police random stop checkpoint on a Sunday.
The officer inspected the car, checked the children were secured correctly in the proper child seats etc and then found our front left tyre to be worn on the outer edge.

We were issued a $180 fine, but with instructions that this would be waived if we presented a new WOF pass sheet to the local police station within one week.

Went in that Monday, got the WOF, did have to replace the tyre too, took the sheet into the Police station and the fine was waived.

The Police Office made it clear right from the start that his main concern was keeping the cars safe on the road, especially family vehicles in this case as he'd attended a few roll over crashes where the front tyres had popped.


The ironic thing is that parking wardens can also fine you if they can see your WOF isn't valid, but there is no grace period. I recall being fined about $400 for this oversight.  I susppect that is more about revenue gathering by council, so ratepayers don't have to pay so much in rates.

As for the topic, all drivers should be treated the same, no matter what race. Infact how do they even know you are maori. My nephew is maori on paper, but has light skin and is blond , but qualifies for maori scholarships.

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  # 1326555 17-Jun-2015 15:04
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It reads: "All Maori drivers detected driving without liscences or in breach of liscence conditions given compliance and referred to community based driver liscence training. Failure to compy within a 2 mnth period will result in an infringement being issed."

That's clear then - you will be issed if you don't compy in 2 mnth and get your liscence.




McLean


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  # 1326575 17-Jun-2015 15:10
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mclean: It reads: "All Maori drivers detected driving without liscences or in breach of liscence conditions given compliance and referred to community based driver liscence training. Failure to compy within a 2 mnth period will result in an infringement being issed."

That's clear then - you will be issed if you don't compy in 2 mnth and get your liscence.


How can they tell you are 'Maori' though? Maori bloodlines are pretty dilluted these days, that a significant percentage of the population have some maori blood, and possibly many don't even identify as being maori, just as a NZer.

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