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Topic # 180829 23-Sep-2015 10:01
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I think it's time to get rid of Steven Moffat as head writer and show runner.

My thoughts on the first episode:

I bit of a jumbled mess with far too much going on.

The episode didn't need:
- Missy (the Master)
- U.N.I.T
- Medieval party

I like Peter Capaldi, and the darker tone since he came on board; but honestly the writing is a mess.

- Bi-planes with lasers, because "hey that's cool"
- Missy came back because "death is for other people", what?
- Missy needed to freeze all the planes in the world to get their attention? Um... not really.
- Clara and U.N.I.T. found the Doctor because "algorithms".
- Left a modern tank in Medieval times.
- Davros needed Clara to lead them to the Doctor, yet they had a Dalek agent there the whole time anyway (Beardy McBeardface who found the T.A.R.D.I.S.).
- T.A.R.D.I.S. very easily destroyed, because it suits the plot better this week.

It seems Moffat is more interested in, what he thinks are, interesting set pieces and clever reveals than a coherent story.

At a very basic level, the episode did have a good idea: The Doctor is responsible, because of his abandonment of young Davros, for what Davros became and in turn for the creation of the Daleks.
- The 'hand mines' were suitably creepy
- The revelation that the boy was Davros was good.
- I liked Davros's "I couldn't tell the Daleks what to do even if I wanted to" attitude.

But that's pretty much where it ended for me.

I look back at David Tennant's run under Russel T. Davies and weep. Some of those episodes certainly had their issues as well, but at least they tried.




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  Reply # 1392604 23-Sep-2015 11:23
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I too am becoming frustrated by Moffat cramming so much in to the point that I need to watch it twice, in case I miss something important.
He always leaves me with questions that never get answered.

Fun episode, just a bit too much in one go. Have they forgotten that it's still a children's show at heart?

It's a shame because I found his stories to be the better ones when Russell T Davies was at the helm.





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  Reply # 1392645 23-Sep-2015 12:27
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I felt it was a bit over done too.  I quite like the Missy character because I like stroppy women.  I feel the character could be positioned in the story better. And yeah, she died.  Sorry that's it.

I have never liked Clara as a character.  I just can't warm to her and I don't find her very believable.  In fact, as far as the Doctor is concerned she's a real pain.

Re the Medieval thing - huh?  I do like Capaldi - he has the gravitas you would expect from a time lord.

And, no, you don't blow up the tardis.  We all know it will be back somehow so not really the big shocker they were hoping for.

I think the writers are trying to out-do each other.  Trying to write 'the big one' and it leads to over the top story lines.  Thank goodness for iplayer.  When I had to watch the last season on Prime I gave up because of all the ad breaks.  Made it hard to follow the story.



 
 
 
 




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  Reply # 1392658 23-Sep-2015 12:53
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jmh: I felt it was a bit over done too.  I quite like the Missy character because I like stroppy women.  I feel the character could be positioned in the story better. And yeah, she died.  Sorry that's it.

I have never liked Clara as a character.  I just can't warm to her and I don't find her very believable.  In fact, as far as the Doctor is concerned she's a real pain.

Re the Medieval thing - huh?  I do like Capaldi - he has the gravitas you would expect from a time lord.

And, no, you don't blow up the tardis.  We all know it will be back somehow so not really the big shocker they were hoping for.

I think the writers are trying to out-do each other.  Trying to write 'the big one' and it leads to over the top story lines.  Thank goodness for iplayer.  When I had to watch the last season on Prime I gave up because of all the ad breaks.  Made it hard to follow the story.




I don't have a problem with the character of Missy, but Davros is the villain in this story arc and having Missy tag along serves no purpose. At least not so far. But it's insulting how they basically said "you knew she was gonna come back at some point, so we won't even try to explain it" - acknowledging the fact doesn't make it more clever or forgivable.

Clara is nice to look at, so she can stay.

Steven Moffat writes or co-writes a lot of the episodes, but as show runner he is responsible for those he doesn't write as well. He should be the one reigning in the over the top stuff.

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  Reply # 1392666 23-Sep-2015 13:11
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I'm really not digging Capaldi's doctor.  What I loved so much about Tennant, Smith and to a degree Eccleston was the humour.  I know Capaldi's going darker, but meh, Doctor Who has always been pretty stupid stories, but the humour makes it fun/enjoyable.

And I agree, moffat is going down hill pretty fast.   I loved Coupling and Sherlock though...

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  Reply # 1392777 23-Sep-2015 15:21
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jmh: I think the writers are trying to out-do each other.  Trying to write 'the big one' and it leads to over the top story lines.  


They already done it. It was the special with the War Doctor. 



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  Reply # 1393003 23-Sep-2015 19:26
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You can tell Capaldi really loved Baker's Doctor; there's a lot of vocal mannerisms that are very similar I've been noticing especially in this episode.

The guitar scene was cheesy as hell but I loved it all the same. If only I could travel through time and insert that footage into my surf guitar Dr Who theme.

Clearly Clara and Missy aren't dead.
Didn't they disappear rather than collapse dead like people normally do when they're Exterminated? (in the reboot, anyway... as far as I recall.)




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  Reply # 1393027 23-Sep-2015 19:56
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I'm not sure if any of the previous posts were doctor who fans or had seen any of the previous series, but the trick to understanding a single DR Who episode is to have a relatively good knowledge of the episodes (and series) that went before - and an idea of the story that is likely to unfold.  The bits that seem disjointed are often pre-cursors to bits that have not yet occurred - so the story within the story.

I believe it is what they call now a layered episode.

The technology biplanes and lasers is explained in a much earlier series.  During the 1000 year war between the Kaleds and Thals, technology gets more primitive as weapons advance.  The joke about the fish and the tank refers to a race called 'The Hath' (series 4, episode 6 - the Drs Daughter).  I believe the man with an axe (Bors) appeared in the prequel 'The Magicians Apprentice'.






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  Reply # 1393441 24-Sep-2015 12:38
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TwoSeven: I'm not sure if any of the previous posts were doctor who fans or had seen any of the previous series, but the trick to understanding a single DR Who episode is to have a relatively good knowledge of the episodes


Been obsessed for 30 years here.




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  Reply # 1393537 24-Sep-2015 13:36
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People probably wondered about the Bad Wolf references, or the Spaceman by the lake, or even "Heaven" in the last series, and what relevance they had to the series thread. I am willing to give it some time to build.
I can see the possibility of a pretty reasonable time paradox building.
Remember the chant, "What do we want, Time Travel. When do we want it, Irrelevant..." :-)




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  Reply # 1393600 24-Sep-2015 14:14
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BurningBeard:
TwoSeven: I'm not sure if any of the previous posts were doctor who fans or had seen any of the previous series, but the trick to understanding a single DR Who episode is to have a relatively good knowledge of the episodes


Been obsessed for 30 years here.


+1

That said, this episode was a confusing mess with too many factors. Moffat is a genius, and here's hoping he'll sort at least some of it out. They still haven't explained Clara's "Impossible Girl" thing very well other than her jumping into The Doctor's timestream.

Still very pleased they changed the theme music to a more traditional type without the silly lightning noises etc. that they introduced with Matt Smith.





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  Reply # 1393771 24-Sep-2015 18:51
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Speaking of music, when he was playing the guitar for the first tune - was that the Dr Who theme tune?

 

 

Anyhow, the US prequels explain the new series storyline - also, so do the episode titles which are also known.

 

 

The thing with Dr Who, you just need to wait until yesterday for the new clues to come out.




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  Reply # 1394589 25-Sep-2015 20:49
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I didn't like this episode either.  Looking at overseas reviews I thought I was alone.  It was just.. well as above, all over the place.  The whole Doctor playing guitar and driving tanks in medieval times was... ridiculous and not in a good way.  It felt implausible to me, and for the Doctor Who universe that's quite a feat

That said I like Missy, doesn't feel she needs to explain herself least of all to inferior humans, just turns up, does what she wants, because that's what she does.  You get the feeling she's not completely entirely evil, more mischievous - sure she'll kill you without thinking, but she's doing it for fun, not profit.  Missy is pretty much a psychotic River Song, which is fun.  




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  Reply # 1394999 26-Sep-2015 18:55
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It just getting too random.. Missy being alive without even a token explanation was dumb. How did the Master survive to become Missy in the first place, never explained.

How is Davros alive, he died in the crucible explosion back in Journey's End (the Donna doctor, David Tenant era after which the 10th Doctor dies) and this is supposed to be an old(er) dying Davros, no explanation.

When they bring something back they used to do it well (new cybermen, new dalek's, old damaged dalek's reactivating)... some of the best episodes contain story about how the bad guy survived/came back.... suspension of disbelief was always required to watch dr who but it's is reaching absurd levels.

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  Reply # 1395060 26-Sep-2015 21:39
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Ragnor: It just getting too random.. Missy being alive without even a token explanation was dumb. How did the Master survive to become Missy in the first place, never explained.

How is Davros alive, he died in the crucible explosion back in Journey's End (the Donna doctor, David Tenant era after which the 10th Doctor dies) and this is supposed to be an old(er) dying Davros, no explanation.

When they bring something back they used to do it well (new cybermen, new dalek's, old damaged dalek's reactivating)... some of the best episodes contain story about how the bad guy survived/came back.... suspension of disbelief was always required to watch dr who but it's is reaching absurd levels.


If you watch some of the back story, this last episode was an alternate timeline. 




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  Reply # 1395446 27-Sep-2015 23:40
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2nd episode: much, much better.






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