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Aredwood
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  #2145935 15-Dec-2018 23:13
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When Chrome autofils my email address on a form, and it adds a space on the end. And the website then rejects my login due to an incorrect email address.

2 different systems both failing to strip the space character from email addresses, and them complaining that a space is not a valid character in an email address.





SirHumphreyAppleby
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  #2145947 16-Dec-2018 08:14
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Aredwood: When Chrome autofils my email address on a form, and it adds a space on the end. And the website then rejects my login due to an incorrect email address.

2 different systems both failing to strip the space character from email addresses, and them complaining that a space is not a valid character in an email address.

 

Why do you consider it a failure for the receiving Website to reject the incorrect information you provide?

 

As a developer (not of Websites), I consider rejection to be correct behaviour. Beyond sanitising for database queries, and possibly normalising the domain name (setting case or converting IDNs to punycode), E-mail addresses don't require any validation when they are used as an identifier for an existing account. If you can get away with using stricmp() or equivalent, just do that.


 
 
 
 


freitasm
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  #2145948 16-Dec-2018 08:19
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He doesn't seem to think login rejection is the failure but rather the irritating consequence on the actual failure which is the browser adding an unnecessary space at the end of auto filled fields.




 

 

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SirHumphreyAppleby
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  #2145950 16-Dec-2018 08:24
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freitasm: He doesn't seem to think login rejection is the failure but rather the irritating consequence on the actual failure which is the browser adding an unnecessary space at the end of auto filled fields.

 

I respectfully disagree. He states "2 different systems both failing to strip the space character".


freitasm
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  #2145952 16-Dec-2018 08:33
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Good point.




 

 

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Shadowfoot
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  #2146016 16-Dec-2018 10:19
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A smart system would trim trailing spaces before validating it. Web developers should expect this some users to copy and paste.




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freitasm
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  #2146077 16-Dec-2018 12:22
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Shadowfoot: A smart system would trim trailing spaces before validating it. Web developers should expect this some users to copy and paste.

 

Usually the same developers who create accounts before validating if email exists or belong to the new account holder...





 

 

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freitasm
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  #2146119 16-Dec-2018 14:41
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Supermarket bread. Breads are usually a sorry thing, with soft, tasteless dough. Some supermarkets make ciabatta, French stick, sourdough and they basically all taste the same - and usually have the same consistence in different shape. Baguettes are a joke - most of times they have a soft outside, to the point they bend if you hold from one end. 

 

Most supermarkets sprinkle flour on top of a bread after baking and call it "artisan".

 

It's seriously hard to find good bread around...





 

 

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Aredwood
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  #2146148 16-Dec-2018 15:34
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SirHumphreyAppleby:


Why do you consider it a failure for the receiving Website to reject the incorrect information you provide?


As a developer (not of Websites), I consider rejection to be correct behaviour. Beyond sanitising for database queries, and possibly normalising the domain name (setting case or converting IDNs to punycode), E-mail addresses don't require any validation when they are used as an identifier for an existing account. If you can get away with using stricmp() or equivalent, just do that.



It is a big problem from a usability point of view. As a human can't tell just by reading, if a space character has been added to the end of a text string. So the user can only tell that an extra space character is present, by placing the cursor into a form field and / or typing extra stuff into that field.

And on websites that simply give a blanket "login failed" message. Most users would assume that they had typed their password incorrectly. Especially as often the email address that they entered is still displayed (and reads correctly to the user). Good for security, but very difficult for users who don't know to check for rogue space characters. And it would be a nightmare from hell for people who use screen readers.

So a fail from the website, as it is a useability barrier. Yet not stripping spaces from email addresses doesn't improve security, as an email address shouldn't contain a space anyway. So no problems from a user trying to unintentionally login to someone else's account.

And a fail by the autofil system. As adding an extra space character is assuming that I want to continue typing into that text input field. But assuming that the autofil added the correct text, I won't need to type anything else into that text field.






eracode
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  #2146152 16-Dec-2018 15:49
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freitasm:

Supermarket bread. Breads are usually a sorry thing, with soft, tasteless dough. Some supermarkets make ciabatta, French stick, sourdough and they basically all taste the same - and usually have the same consistence in different shape. Baguettes are a joke - most of times they have a soft outside, to the point they bend if you hold from one end. 


Most supermarkets sprinkle flour on top of a bread after baking and call it "artisan".


It's seriously hard to find good bread around...



You’re right. In recent years we have done two seven-week Home Exchange stints living and shopping in France in different places and done small road trips each time. Wherever you buy a baguette in France, it is always wonderful and a small piece of heaven on Earth. We have missed this when we have returned home.

NZ is not alone with this problem. We have done similar stints in Florida, N California, Calgary, 3x UK and Australia - all with the same bread issue. North American factory bread is particularly foul.

We have found one German baker here on the North Shore who makes pretty good baguettes - but it’s a ten minute drive each way and $5 each. TBH probably don’t miss a good baguette enough to do that every day.




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SirHumphreyAppleby
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  #2146163 16-Dec-2018 16:56
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Aredwood:
And a fail by the autofil system. As adding an extra space character is assuming that I want to continue typing into that text input field. But assuming that the autofil added the correct text, I won't need to type anything else into that text field.

 

I agree it is a failure of the auto fill system, but I'm sticking with rejecting input as being correct behaviour.

 

Should 'smart' sites also remove tabs? What about other white space characters, of which there are literally dozens defined in Unicode, with the potential for more to be added?

 

It is technically possible for Unicode white space characters to appear in e-mail addresses. ASCII Space (0x20) can appear in the user portion of an address, if but only if quoted, so that's never an issue if stripping leading spaces.


MikeB4
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  #2146164 16-Dec-2018 17:04
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freitasm:

 

Supermarket bread. Breads are usually a sorry thing, with soft, tasteless dough. Some supermarkets make ciabatta, French stick, sourdough and they basically all taste the same - and usually have the same consistence in different shape. Baguettes are a joke - most of times they have a soft outside, to the point they bend if you hold from one end. 

 

Most supermarkets sprinkle flour on top of a bread after baking and call it "artisan".

 

It's seriously hard to find good bread around...

 

 

We hve solved this, we make our own bread


jarledb
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  #2146224 16-Dec-2018 18:19
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freitasm:

 

Most supermarkets sprinkle flour on top of a bread after baking and call it "artisan".

 

It's seriously hard to find good bread around...

 

 

They can take that flour they sprinkle on the bread and.... 

 

And I agree, really hard to find good bread in NZ.

 

The sourdough at the local New World is pretty good, but they just have to add that stupid flour sprinkling that ends up all over the kitchen when I cut the bread.

 

There is a little french place in Raumati that have good baguettes, don´t think I have ever seen anything that I would classify as a baguette in a regular NZ supermarket.

 

Of the ready cut bread I find the Bürgen bread the best, but even that fails in comparison to even cheap supermarket bread that I can buy when I am in Norway.


Geektastic
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  #2146240 16-Dec-2018 19:24
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freitasm:

 

Supermarket bread. Breads are usually a sorry thing, with soft, tasteless dough. Some supermarkets make ciabatta, French stick, sourdough and they basically all taste the same - and usually have the same consistence in different shape. Baguettes are a joke - most of times they have a soft outside, to the point they bend if you hold from one end. 

 

Most supermarkets sprinkle flour on top of a bread after baking and call it "artisan".

 

It's seriously hard to find good bread around...

 

 

 

 

Very true. When did you last see sliced organic stoneground wholemeal for sale in a supermarket?






Geektastic
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  #2146242 16-Dec-2018 19:26
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My MiL.

 

Currently pushing me towards a nervous breakdown as I juggle between not wishing to upset my wife and suppressing my temper...






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