Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.


Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | ... | 69 | 70 | 71 | 72 | 73 | 74 | 75 | 76 | 77 | 78 | 79 | 80 | 81 | 82 | 83 | 84 | 85 | 86 | 87 | 88 | 89 | ... | 109
15312 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4035

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1641766 28-Sep-2016 12:49
Send private message

SaltyNZ:

 

networkn:

 

 

 

I suspect the reason he doesn't want to show his returns is he may have been caught out by underpaying taxes, and have paid penalties etc, which will not look good. 

 

 

 

 

Actually, I think the real reason is not that he has been underpaying, but that he has legally paid a tax bill that would make the average citizen incandescent with outrage. That is to say, not that he (for example) paid $100M but should have paid $150M, but more that despite being a billionaire, he legally was entitled to only pay $10K due to his financial structure, and did so.

 

 

Yes well that's the other possibility. I understand the rage but I understand it from his perspective too. 


370 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 85


  Reply # 1641771 28-Sep-2016 12:56
Send private message

SaltyNZ:

 

 

 

Actually, I think the real reason is not that he has been underpaying, but that he has legally paid a tax bill that would make the average citizen incandescent with outrage. That is to say, not that he (for example) paid $100M but should have paid $150M, but more that despite being a billionaire, he legally was entitled to only pay $10K due to his financial structure, and did so.

 

 

 

 

Perhaps one of the reasons why the US is $20B in debt, too many businesses creaming the tax system. It's a global thing though and probably explains why most western countries are seriously in debt. Time for a flat tax rate across the board, no perks etc.


 
 
 
 


15312 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4035

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1641774 28-Sep-2016 13:03
One person supports this post
Send private message

cynnicallemon:

 

SaltyNZ:

 

 

 

Actually, I think the real reason is not that he has been underpaying, but that he has legally paid a tax bill that would make the average citizen incandescent with outrage. That is to say, not that he (for example) paid $100M but should have paid $150M, but more that despite being a billionaire, he legally was entitled to only pay $10K due to his financial structure, and did so.

 

 

 

 

Perhaps one of the reasons why the US is $20B in debt, too many businesses creaming the tax system. It's a global thing though and probably explains why most western countries are seriously in debt. Time for a flat tax rate across the board, no perks etc.

 

 

Heh sure, GFC II here we come. 

 

 

 

They need to close some of the tax holes that exist (as does almost every country), so you need to be supporting a candidate who is campaigning for that. Wait.. Is that silence I hear? No candidate would be elected on that promise, because they would get zero support from the business community.

 

 


2129 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1027


  Reply # 1641775 28-Sep-2016 13:07
Send private message

networkn:

 

frankv:

 

networkn:

 

The TPPA *IS* dead. Neither of the primary candidates will pass it in it's current state. 

 

 

I suspect that it's just a bargaining position... what would big business give up in exchange for TPPA?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry, I am not sure what you mean by that ? Neither Candidate supports the TPP, it's dead. They will start again after the elections, from pretty much a scratch position. 

 

 

 

In your own words: "Neither of the primary candidates will pass it in it's current state. "

 

That leaves it open for "new information" to emerge, for the terms of TPPA to be adjusted, or for TPPAv2 to be unveiled. Whatever follows TPPA will be built on it, not from scratch.

 

 


6169 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2894

Subscriber

  Reply # 1641782 28-Sep-2016 13:10
One person supports this post
Send private message

Who was it who said politics is all about perception? The issue is not whether Trump broke any laws, or whether he was clever in taking advantage of loopholes, or whether he was playing the system in any other way, the issue is entirely how those who might vote for Trump perceive his actions. If it emerges that he has managed to pay little or no tax by whatever means, many people at the bottom of the pile may resent that. Some may applaud his cleverness but many may well feel he is ripping other taxpayers off and enjoying the good life on their backs. That could certainly cost him support, regardless of the morality or legality of his actions. Hillary scored points when she started listing all the veterans, hospitals, schools, etc. that would be deprived of his tax income.

 

 

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


3779 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1871

Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1641786 28-Sep-2016 13:20
Send private message

Rikkitic:

 

Who was it who said politics is all about perception? The issue is not whether Trump broke any laws, or whether he was clever in taking advantage of loopholes, or whether he was playing the system in any other way, the issue is entirely how those who might vote for Trump perceive his actions. If it emerges that he has managed to pay little or no tax by whatever means, many people at the bottom of the pile may resent that. Some may applaud his cleverness but many may well feel he is ripping other taxpayers off and enjoying the good life on their backs. That could certainly cost him support, regardless of the morality or legality of his actions. Hillary scored points when she started listing all the veterans, hospitals, schools, etc. that would be deprived of his tax income.

 

 

 





Sideface


5231 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2472


  Reply # 1641795 28-Sep-2016 13:24
Send private message

cynnicallemon: 

 

Perhaps one of the reasons why the US is $20B in debt.

 

 

 

 

It's trillion @cynicallemon. (and not at $20 trillion yet).

 

Using the Big Mac Index, $20 billion would give everybody on the planet roughly one free lunch.  $20 trillion would give them breakfast, lunch, and dinner every day for about a year. 

 

On a per capita basis it's only slightly worse than NZ. As a % of GDP, they're less in debt than NZ. 

 

Nigeria, Ethiopia, Haiti etc have very low debt by world standards - so debt level must be a great indicator of how well an economy is doing?

 

 


2129 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1027


  Reply # 1641820 28-Sep-2016 13:27
Send private message

networkn:

 

frankv:

 

networkn:

 

Having said that, if he is LEGALLY used methods in law to avoid paying taxes, then you can't penalize him for that, you can only criticise the law-makers.

 

 

Well, the legal system can't penalize him. But there's no compulsion to avoid tax, and many (most?) people believe that there is an ethical/moral obligation for people to pay "their fair share" of the taxation burden. Those people would criticise DT as a parasite sponging off them.

 

 

 

 

 

 

So how much tax "should" he pay? A Million? Billion? Trillion? What's his "moral" obligation?  He's running a business. If he is illegally avoiding tax, or even using "questionable" methods, then throw his ass in prison, otherwise, not sure what you expect to happen?

 

 

 

He gets audited almost every year, rest assured the tax dept are looking for him to fall over, he will be meeting his obligations, or paying the price. 

 

I suspect the reason he doesn't want to show his returns is he may have been caught out by underpaying taxes, and have paid penalties etc, which will not look good. 

 

 

 

 

I doubt he's paying less than his legal obligations (although what those obligations are is somewhat grey).

 

How much tax should he pay? If I was an American and anything less than a billionaire, the short answer would be "More than me".

 

What I would expect to happen: Americans will add up his flaws, compare them to Hillary's, and make a decision. For many, parasitism would push them over the hump into voting for Hillary. DT knows that, and therefore doesn't want to disclose how little he does actually pay.

 

 


15312 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4035

Trusted
Lifetime subscriber

  Reply # 1641824 28-Sep-2016 13:33
Send private message

frankv:

 

 

 

I doubt he's paying less than his legal obligations (although what those obligations are is somewhat grey).

 

How much tax should he pay? If I was an American and anything less than a billionaire, the short answer would be "More than me".

 

What I would expect to happen: Americans will add up his flaws, compare them to Hillary's, and make a decision. For many, parasitism would push them over the hump into voting for Hillary. DT knows that, and therefore doesn't want to disclose how little he does actually pay.

 

 

 

 

Yeah the "more than me thing seems "sort of" sound". 

 

To be fair, given everything else the Americans are ignoring about him, is him doing what every billionaire around is doing, going to push them over the edge? I doubt it. 

 

Thing is, even as the CEO, he isn't entirely in control of his own affairs, he will have a mandate from a board, and the board will be the ones who will (responsibly) be stating he must have tax consultants, to manage his affairs. 

 

At the end of the day, the tax laws are the issues, not the individuals.

 

 


5231 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2472


  Reply # 1641827 28-Sep-2016 13:37
One person supports this post
Send private message

frankv:

 

DT knows that, and therefore doesn't want to disclose how little he does actually pay.

 

 

 

 

I very much doubt that's the explanation - he stated loud and clearly that to pay no tax just proves how clever and smart he is.  He'd surely relish any opportunity to prove how clever he is.

 

How much or little tax he pays isn't why he's too scared to release his tax records.  Those records will also disclose his BS "charities" and other deductions he claims, where his income comes from.

 

All his abject BS about how he's going to put a stop to profit-shifting etc to "make America great again", there's a very good chance he's been using the same methods he condemns.  Lord knows what other deals and arrangement would also come to light, about the true nature of his indebtedness to Russian oligarchs, how "unleveraged" he really is, and how trustworthy he'd be to put the American people's interests ahead of his own if he was POTUS. 


10503 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1743

Trusted

  Reply # 1641830 28-Sep-2016 13:39
Send private message

frankv:

 

networkn:

 

frankv:

 

networkn:

 

Having said that, if he is LEGALLY used methods in law to avoid paying taxes, then you can't penalize him for that, you can only criticise the law-makers.

 

 

Well, the legal system can't penalize him. But there's no compulsion to avoid tax, and many (most?) people believe that there is an ethical/moral obligation for people to pay "their fair share" of the taxation burden. Those people would criticise DT as a parasite sponging off them.

 

 

 

 

 

 

So how much tax "should" he pay? A Million? Billion? Trillion? What's his "moral" obligation?  He's running a business. If he is illegally avoiding tax, or even using "questionable" methods, then throw his ass in prison, otherwise, not sure what you expect to happen?

 

 

 

He gets audited almost every year, rest assured the tax dept are looking for him to fall over, he will be meeting his obligations, or paying the price. 

 

I suspect the reason he doesn't want to show his returns is he may have been caught out by underpaying taxes, and have paid penalties etc, which will not look good. 

 

 

 

 

I doubt he's paying less than his legal obligations (although what those obligations are is somewhat grey).

 

How much tax should he pay? If I was an American and anything less than a billionaire, the short answer would be "More than me".

 

What I would expect to happen: Americans will add up his flaws, compare them to Hillary's, and make a decision. For many, parasitism would push them over the hump into voting for Hillary. DT knows that, and therefore doesn't want to disclose how little he does actually pay.

 

 

 

 

It depends how voters see the importance of their party, against the importance of a leader, who, lets face it, cannot run a country, he has no skillset for that, he will be guided, prodded into doing what the GOP want. With that in mind, DT is an annoyance, but the greater good is getting the GOP in. And as they have been out for 8 years, thats a big motivation to gun for the party and hope they restrain the wild tiger.


10503 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1743

Trusted

  Reply # 1641831 28-Sep-2016 13:41
Send private message

Fred99:

 

frankv:

 

DT knows that, and therefore doesn't want to disclose how little he does actually pay.

 

 

 

 

I very much doubt that's the explanation - he stated loud and clearly that to pay no tax just proves how clever and smart he is.  He'd surely relish any opportunity to prove how clever he is.

 

How much or little tax he pays isn't why he's too scared to release his tax records.  Those records will also disclose his BS "charities" and other deductions he claims, where his income comes from.

 

All his abject BS about how he's going to put a stop to profit-shifting etc to "make America great again", there's a very good chance he's been using the same methods he condemns.  Lord knows what other deals and arrangement would also come to light, about the true nature of his indebtedness to Russian oligarchs, how "unleveraged" he really is, and how trustworthy he'd be to put the American people's interests ahead of his own if he was POTUS. 

 

 

Can he be impeached for any of that?


4123 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1671

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 1641832 28-Sep-2016 13:41
Send private message

frankv:

 

 

 

In your own words: "Neither of the primary candidates will pass it in it's current state. "

 

That leaves it open for "new information" to emerge, for the terms of TPPA to be adjusted, or for TPPAv2 to be unveiled. Whatever follows TPPA will be built on it, not from scratch.

 

 

 

 

The TPPA isn't "adjustable". It's a treaty: it has been agreed and signed already. If they US wants to change it, it's back to the negotiating table for everyone. Nobody, not even the US, can unilaterally modify it as they see fit.

 

I mean, sure, it is the US we are talking about here - they can do whatever the hell they want - but if they do, then nobody else has to hold up their end of the treaty towards the US either.





iPad Air + iPhone SE + 2degrees 4tw!

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.


11505 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 5211

Trusted

  Reply # 1641838 28-Sep-2016 13:46
Send private message

No one has ratified TPPA yet so changes will happen or the agreement will collapse which is more likely.




Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

Take My Advice, Pull Down Your Pants And Slide On The Ice!

 

 


5231 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2472


  Reply # 1641839 28-Sep-2016 13:46
3 people support this post
Send private message

GOP should be concerned with the important stuff - like whether to shoot the sequel to Brokeback Mountain in Wyoming or the Urals.

 


1 | ... | 69 | 70 | 71 | 72 | 73 | 74 | 75 | 76 | 77 | 78 | 79 | 80 | 81 | 82 | 83 | 84 | 85 | 86 | 87 | 88 | 89 | ... | 109
Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

$3.74 million for new electric vehicles in New Zealand
Posted 17-Jan-2018 11:27


Nova 2i: Value, not excitement from Huawei
Posted 17-Jan-2018 09:02


Less news in Facebook News Feed revamp
Posted 15-Jan-2018 13:15


Australian Government contract awarded to Datacom Connect
Posted 11-Jan-2018 08:37


Why New Zealand needs a chief technology officer
Posted 6-Jan-2018 13:59


Amazon release Silk Browser and Firefox for Fire TV
Posted 21-Dec-2017 13:42


New Chief Technology Officer role created
Posted 19-Dec-2017 22:18


All I want for Christmas is a new EV
Posted 19-Dec-2017 19:54


How clever is this: AI will create 2.3 million jobs by 2020
Posted 19-Dec-2017 19:52


NOW to deploy SD-WAN to regional councils
Posted 19-Dec-2017 19:46


Mobile market competition issues ComCom should watch
Posted 18-Dec-2017 10:52


New Zealand government to create digital advisory group
Posted 16-Dec-2017 08:47


Australia datum changes means whole country moving 1.8 metres north-east
Posted 16-Dec-2017 08:39


UAV Traffic Management Trial launching today in New Zealand
Posted 12-Dec-2017 16:06


UFB connections pass 460,000
Posted 11-Dec-2017 11:26



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.