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tdgeek
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  #1582313 28-Jun-2016 20:06
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Geektastic:

 

Letter from today's Telegraph:

 

 

 

SIR – In 1992, a slight majority of Swiss voters refused to join the European Economic Area (50.3 per cent to 49.7 per cent).

 

According to the pundits – and most national newspapers – the country was going to break up. (It was indeed divided between a French-speaking Europhile minority and a German speaking anti-European majority.) The economy was going to crash and the Swiss franc was to be worth less than the Zimbabwean dollar.

 

Calls for a second vote came, and companies warned they were ready to leave the country. Local authorities talked of individual cantons joining the EU. The government was warning of a massive haemorrhage of talent.

 

None of this happened. Instead, after a slight recession, the economy started to grow again. Nowadays, even if the country’s relationship with the EU is far from settled, almost no one seriously envisages joining the EU or the all-but-defunct EEA. As Britain goes through similar times, it is worth remembering this.

 

Nicholas Antenen
Geneva, Switzerland

 

 

100%. Again, Im not English, although I have long childhood links, its not UK being outcast. Its probably more the EU being worried about more exits. So, in between all this there  is a healthy child in between a mere free trade region, and a Europe Country. The EU is not a country but from what Ive read its quite controlling. Im happy to be corrected


tdgeek
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  #1582327 28-Jun-2016 20:18
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Fred99:

 

There's now a real possibility of a vote by the public on a "new deal" with the EU by way of a second referendum, or a dissolution and new election.  Rumours of this have seen the GBP rise and financial markets recover.

 

Hope it's true.  Bigots won't like it.  Would be good to see an attempt at true democracy instead of that knee-jerk post-factual pseudo-democratic trash UK media led BS referendum.

 

 

I don't have an issue with either side. But who are the bigots?


 
 
 
 


tdgeek
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  #1582333 28-Jun-2016 20:24
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Fred99:

 

There's now a real possibility of a vote by the public on a "new deal" with the EU by way of a second referendum, or a dissolution and new election.  Rumours of this have seen the GBP rise and financial markets recover.

 

Hope it's true.  Bigots won't like it.  Would be good to see an attempt at true democracy instead of that knee-jerk post-factual pseudo-democratic trash UK media led BS referendum.

 

 

Link? A quick scout at BBC doesnt find anything


gzt

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  #1582367 28-Jun-2016 21:38
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UK health minister announces run for PM and calls for second referendum.

It could happen, but anything could happen at this point. A 1.89% margin on a non-binding referendum is a recipe for anything really.

Geektastic

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  #1582369 28-Jun-2016 21:40
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tdgeek:

Satch:


PhantomNVD: "Let's find our NHS instead"

Is neither a promise, or incorrect, it's an OPTION in what else to do with the money, and most arguments about the total sum revolve around defraying a part of it against the 'income' they receive for various things in their country too.


Let's be a bit sensible here.  The slogan on the bus implies that the 350m would possibly be put into NHS instead.  It doesn't guarantee it but it implies it, and a lot of voters I'm sure would have taken that as something firmly on the table.



True, it implies funds will be available. All, most or some. The implication is a reasonable amount.



The money does not even exist yet. It's entirely futile debating whether a future government will or won't spend it in a particular way.

The point being made was, obviously, that an amount of money currently used to benefit the EU could be used to benefit Britain instead.






gzt

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#1582373 28-Jun-2016 21:49
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In an alternate universe does that money exist? That's the hard question. ; ).


Brumfondl
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  #1582375 28-Jun-2016 22:11
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Geektastic:
The money does not even exist yet. It's entirely futile debating whether a future government will or won't spend it in a particular way.

The point being made was, obviously, that an amount of money currently used to benefit the EU could be used to benefit Britain instead.

 

1) This is your interpretation and seems a fair a reasonable one. This in no way means it was the general interpretation of the people that voted to leave.

 

2) The money NEVER existed. There were rebates, etc., that meant far less than 350m was paid but the number used was never changed because it sounded better. Like good politicians they never let the facts get in the way of a good soundbite/slogan/whatever.






 
 
 
 


Geektastic

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  #1582377 28-Jun-2016 22:26
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Brumfondl:

 

Geektastic:
The money does not even exist yet. It's entirely futile debating whether a future government will or won't spend it in a particular way.

The point being made was, obviously, that an amount of money currently used to benefit the EU could be used to benefit Britain instead.

 

1) This is your interpretation and seems a fair a reasonable one. This in no way means it was the general interpretation of the people that voted to leave.

 

2) The money NEVER existed. There were rebates, etc., that meant far less than 350m was paid but the number used was never changed because it sounded better. Like good politicians they never let the facts get in the way of a good soundbite/slogan/whatever.

 

 

 

 

My point exactly - it's electioneering.

 

 

 

When a politician produces a card (or, in one case, a stone tablet!) which says "We will do x,y and z" then it is perfectly fair to hold them to that.

 

If they say anything else, it's caveat emptor. Carry out your own due diligence and satisfy yourself before you make your X in the box. Do not just accept the first thing you hear and then be shocked and outraged when it turns out not to be entirely correct....






gzt

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  #1582385 28-Jun-2016 23:06
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Next in line for disillusion:

"British fishermen have been warned that, despite the promises made by the leave campaign, they cannot expect to be granted greater catches after the UK leaves the European Union, and they may face increased economic turmoil."

DarthKermit
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  #1582399 29-Jun-2016 02:47
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gzt: Next in line for disillusion:

"British fishermen have been warned that, despite the promises made by the leave campaign, they cannot expect to be granted greater catches after the UK leaves the European Union, and they may face increased economic turmoil."

 

Looks like the economic turmoil is already here. How long and how bad it may get is anyone's guess...


Batman
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  #1582423 29-Jun-2016 08:34
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Well better buy up all the houses in the SOuth Island, coz the Brits are coming! It cou.d be difficult for Labour and Peters that they don't confuse the Brit sounding names this time ...





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


Geektastic

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  #1582430 29-Jun-2016 08:44
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DarthKermit:

gzt: Next in line for disillusion:

"British fishermen have been warned that, despite the promises made by the leave campaign, they cannot expect to be granted greater catches after the UK leaves the European Union, and they may face increased economic turmoil."


Looks like the economic turmoil is already here. How long and how bad it may get is anyone's guess...


True.

There's a piece in the Times today interviewing Scottish trawler skippers who overwhelmingly voted out. You need to know the political slants of the UK papers so you can take what they write in context....





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  #1582451 29-Jun-2016 09:51
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Which is the least slanted paper? They all seem to have very strong slants and it's hard to find (at least reasonably) balanced reporting at the moment.

Rikkitic
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  #1582459 29-Jun-2016 10:02
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Before Murdoch The Times would have come closest, then The Independent, now I'm not so sure.

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


Fred99
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  #1582466 29-Jun-2016 10:05
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tdgeek:

 

issue with either side. But who are the bigots?

 

 

What?  Here in this forum, in the UK?

 

You want me to name them?  Surely not.


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