Dallas shootings - 10 officers shot

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#1588503 8-Jul-2016 20:27

MikeB4:
Geektastic:

And of course it assumes that they WANT their attitudes changed. If they prefer to live that way, I am not sure that is anyone's business but theirs, really.

One thing is for sure: shooting policemen in the US is very unlikely to cause less hostility...

Their attitudes affects others then it is others business. Racists and bigots don't keep their attitudes to themselves.

You are quite right, racists and bigots don't keep their attitudes to themselves. But are those who consider themselves to be sitting on the other side of the fence any better? Majority opinion prevails at the end of the day.

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#1588507 8-Jul-2016 20:46

DaveB:

You are quite right, racists and bigots don't keep their attitudes to themselves. But are those who consider themselves to be sitting on the other side of the fence any better? Majority opinion prevails at the end of the day.

Apologies, it could be my current medication but I don't really get what you are saying here

tripper1000

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#1588533 8-Jul-2016 22:10

Trump needs to hurry up and build that wall of his before this American madness spreads to the civilised world.

DaveB

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#1588536 8-Jul-2016 22:24

MikeB4:
DaveB:

You are quite right, racists and bigots don't keep their attitudes to themselves. But are those who consider themselves to be sitting on the other side of the fence any better? Majority opinion prevails at the end of the day.

Apologies, it could be my current medication but I don't really get what you are saying here

What I am saying Mike is that "Majority opinion prevails at the end of the day". And when it comes to the good old US, that concerns me because of the "trickle down effect".

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#1588542 8-Jul-2016 22:28

Look at what happened after the worst mass killing (49 people) in June that they've yet had there. A hell of a lot of people went out and purchased more guns.

I really do think the USA is beyond any rational solution to its gun violence issues. Many thousands killed every year still isn't enough to cause any meaningful change.

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#1588546 8-Jul-2016 22:48

DarthKermit:

Look at what happened after the worst mass killing (49 people) in June that they've yet had there. A hell of a lot of people went out and purchased more guns.

I really do think the USA is beyond any rational solution to its gun violence issues. Many thousands killed every year still isn't enough to cause any meaningful change.

It is the Wild West. They expect to carry guns and they expect to use them. They have never, in the history of the nation, been banned from doing so.

Why would we expect them to suddenly decide to adopt our way of looking at this instead of theirs?

Aside from all that, it would be tantamount to impossible to do anything about it. There are 112.6 guns per 100 residents in the USA and a population of 324 million. Since the firearms are largely unregistered how could you possibly ever track them down and recover them if you were ever mad enough to do that? I have heard anecdotally from people who lived in Australia when they decided to ban firearms (and yet, oddly, arm the police) that plenty just got wrapped in greased paper and buried in boxes in the bush. It would not surprise me in the least if that was so and it is certainly what would happen if they ever tried serious control measures in the USA.

DarthKermit

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#1588552 8-Jul-2016 22:54

Agreed. Even if not a single new gun was manufactured or imported ever again, there would still be untold millions of them out there. That horse has well and truly bolted long ago.

All the talk about restrictions on selling to people on the no fly lists, etc won't ever achieve much.

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#1588622 9-Jul-2016 07:20

Rikkitic:

This is a terrible tragedy. It is terrible to be black in America and to be in constant fear of being shot by a police officer at any time for any reason. It is terrible to be a police officer and to constantly wonder if every car you stop in the line of duty may be your last. The whole mess is just terrible. With everyone in the country going around armed to the teeth I do not see any solution.

You've nailed it. This is ALL about America's insane gun culture. The people who want to carry, the police who live in fear and shoot at any sudden movements, the people who respond to the errors (and whitewashes) with anger and violence targeting the police.....

It's all about guns and fear of guns.

Any halfwit can see it's the guns that need to go.

Not enough people have been upgraded to halfwit.

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Linuxluver

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#1588623 9-Jul-2016 07:25

Geektastic:

DarthKermit:

Look at what happened after the worst mass killing (49 people) in June that they've yet had there. A hell of a lot of people went out and purchased more guns.

I really do think the USA is beyond any rational solution to its gun violence issues. Many thousands killed every year still isn't enough to cause any meaningful change.

It is the Wild West. They expect to carry guns and they expect to use them. They have never, in the history of the nation, been banned from doing so.

They have been. Until Reagan (or whichever idiot did it) repealed most of the gun laws it was difficult to carry a gun in public.

Why would we expect them to suddenly decide to adopt our way of looking at this instead of theirs?

Aside from all that, it would be tantamount to impossible to do anything about it. There are 112.6 guns per 100 residents in the USA and a population of 324 million. Since the firearms are largely unregistered how could you possibly ever track them down and recover them if you were ever mad enough to do that? I have heard anecdotally from people who lived in Australia when they decided to ban firearms (and yet, oddly, arm the police) that plenty just got wrapped in greased paper and buried in boxes in the bush. It would not surprise me in the least if that was so and it is certainly what would happen if they ever tried serious control measures in the USA.

That part's easy. You declare an amnesty for guns and require them to be turned in. If after the amnesty is over you find people with guns you prosecute the crap out of them and crush the guns. It would take a few years, but the guns would be found, destroyed and gone....or kept well hidden (and not ever used because that would attract *serious* attention). Any crime committed with a gun - whether it was used or not - gets life imprisonment. Make guns kryptonite for crims. Yes, there would stil be stupid and defiant and defiant stupid people......but over time the culture would change. Aim for that.

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#1588624 9-Jul-2016 07:43

Linuxluver:

Rikkitic:

This is a terrible tragedy. It is terrible to be black in America and to be in constant fear of being shot by a police officer at any time for any reason. It is terrible to be a police officer and to constantly wonder if every car you stop in the line of duty may be your last. The whole mess is just terrible. With everyone in the country going around armed to the teeth I do not see any solution.

You've nailed it. This is ALL about America's insane gun culture. The people who want to carry, the police who live in fear and shoot at any sudden movements, the people who respond to the errors (and whitewashes) with anger and violence targeting the police.....

It's all about guns and fear of guns.

Any halfwit can see it's the guns that need to go.

Not enough people have been upgraded to halfwit.

I'm not sure it's about guns itself. There is a racial disparity between whites and blacks in the USA. It's complex and difficult to explain in one line. It's like two colours of skin exist under different set of rules and different opportunities. Read about this man and imagine it still happens today, and you will understand.

Linuxluver

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#1588625 9-Jul-2016 07:47

joker97:

Linuxluver:

Rikkitic:

This is a terrible tragedy. It is terrible to be black in America and to be in constant fear of being shot by a police officer at any time for any reason. It is terrible to be a police officer and to constantly wonder if every car you stop in the line of duty may be your last. The whole mess is just terrible. With everyone in the country going around armed to the teeth I do not see any solution.

You've nailed it. This is ALL about America's insane gun culture. The people who want to carry, the police who live in fear and shoot at any sudden movements, the people who respond to the errors (and whitewashes) with anger and violence targeting the police.....

It's all about guns and fear of guns.

Any halfwit can see it's the guns that need to go.

Not enough people have been upgraded to halfwit.

I'm not sure it's about guns itself. There is a racial disparity between whites and blacks in the USA. It's complex and difficult to explain in one line. It's like two colours of skin exist under different set of rules and different opportunities. Read about this man and imagine it still happens today, and you will understand.

You're right. Racism is a big part of it. Guns just make that instantly fatal.

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#1588643 9-Jul-2016 09:38

cruxis:

Karma, In response to killing of Philando Castile Minnesota police shooting. Peacefull demonstrations is not working, it was a matter of time someone would take action against the police. I would expect more action against police from some of the calls to kill police videos being posted about.

I'm sorry did you seriously just call the the mass murder of 5 people, and the attempted murder of 7 others, Karma?

That is screwed up.

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JWR

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#1588645 9-Jul-2016 09:44

Geektastic:

DarthKermit:

Look at what happened after the worst mass killing (49 people) in June that they've yet had there. A hell of a lot of people went out and purchased more guns.

I really do think the USA is beyond any rational solution to its gun violence issues. Many thousands killed every year still isn't enough to cause any meaningful change.

It is the Wild West. They expect to carry guns and they expect to use them. They have never, in the history of the nation, been banned from doing so.

Why would we expect them to suddenly decide to adopt our way of looking at this instead of theirs?

Aside from all that, it would be tantamount to impossible to do anything about it. There are 112.6 guns per 100 residents in the USA and a population of 324 million. Since the firearms are largely unregistered how could you possibly ever track them down and recover them if you were ever mad enough to do that? I have heard anecdotally from people who lived in Australia when they decided to ban firearms (and yet, oddly, arm the police) that plenty just got wrapped in greased paper and buried in boxes in the bush. It would not surprise me in the least if that was so and it is certainly what would happen if they ever tried serious control measures in the USA.

I agree with a lot of that.

But, we aren't really concerned with hand guns and single shot rifles here.

It is the likes of the Ar-15 that is causing most of the ongoing problems.

I know it isn't fully automatic in the civilian versions. But, the damage is still ridiculous.

After each mass killing with an AR-15, the sales seem to soar.

Surely, that can be legislated.

Rikkitic

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#1588651 9-Jul-2016 09:53

I think you are right. At the least they could start with assault weapons and gradually work their way down from there. Whether there will ever be a will to do that there is very much the question.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

Geektastic

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#1588654 9-Jul-2016 10:09

Linuxluver:

Geektastic:

DarthKermit:

Look at what happened after the worst mass killing (49 people) in June that they've yet had there. A hell of a lot of people went out and purchased more guns.

I really do think the USA is beyond any rational solution to its gun violence issues. Many thousands killed every year still isn't enough to cause any meaningful change.

It is the Wild West. They expect to carry guns and they expect to use them. They have never, in the history of the nation, been banned from doing so.

They have been. Until Reagan (or whichever idiot did it) repealed most of the gun laws it was difficult to carry a gun in public.

Why would we expect them to suddenly decide to adopt our way of looking at this instead of theirs?

Aside from all that, it would be tantamount to impossible to do anything about it. There are 112.6 guns per 100 residents in the USA and a population of 324 million. Since the firearms are largely unregistered how could you possibly ever track them down and recover them if you were ever mad enough to do that? I have heard anecdotally from people who lived in Australia when they decided to ban firearms (and yet, oddly, arm the police) that plenty just got wrapped in greased paper and buried in boxes in the bush. It would not surprise me in the least if that was so and it is certainly what would happen if they ever tried serious control measures in the USA.

That part's easy. You declare an amnesty for guns and require them to be turned in. If after the amnesty is over you find people with guns you prosecute the crap out of them and crush the guns. It would take a few years, but the guns would be found, destroyed and gone....or kept well hidden (and not ever used because that would attract *serious* attention). Any crime committed with a gun - whether it was used or not - gets life imprisonment. Make guns kryptonite for crims. Yes, there would stil be stupid and defiant and defiant stupid people......but over time the culture would change. Aim for that.

It's really not difficult, in a country that sells handguns in the equivalent of Mitre 10, to carry a gun in public without anyone being any the wiser. Ankle holsters, waistband holsters, shoulder holsters, CCW clothing and all sorts of ways. Sure it probably won't be an IMI Desert Eagle but that hardly matters. There are even collapsible SMG's that fit in briefcases - and to complete the set, the briefcases double as temporary armour in a firefight.

You can wish all you like, but it won't ever happen.

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