Climate Change: Sh*t is getting real....and fast.

Forums › Off topic › Climate Change: Sh*t is getting real....and fast.

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#1598241 25-Jul-2016 15:03

MikeAqua:

andrew027:

My wife read something last year that said if global warming continued at it's current rate, in another decade Wellington would be like Brisbane.

Only if you ignore the wind chill!!

Wind chill, we don't have wind chill. We have breeze deviations.

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andrew027

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#1598255 25-Jul-2016 15:21

MikeAqua:

andrew027: My wife read something last year that said if global warming continued at it's current rate, in another decade Wellington would be like Brisbane.

Only if you ignore the wind chill!!

There won't be much wind chill when the ambient temperature is in the mid-20s and there's no snow north of Arthur's Pass.

Smithy100

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#1598256 25-Jul-2016 15:25

As a returned (from Brisbane) Wellingtonian, more please :)

wellygary

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#1598263 25-Jul-2016 15:34

andrew027:

My wife read something last year that said if global warming continued at it's current rate, in another decade Wellington would be like Brisbane. How awful! Far too many kiwis in Brisbane...

Or Not,

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/82245751/Decade-of-temperature-data-from-Auckland-Wellington-and-Christchurch-shows-whos-heating-up

Temperatures in Auckland and Christchurch are gently rising above average, though the capital is lagging behind, according to Niwa.

Since the summer of December 2004/05, Auckland has been 0.3 Celsius hotter than average, Christchurch has climbed to 0.7C above average at one station and 0.1C at another, yet in Wellington, the temperature anomalies have balanced out to 0C.

The temperatures are hugely dependent on how each city stands up to winds, Niwa meteorologist Ben Noll said.

"In Christchurch you get the warm wind off the land, maybe the same can be said for Auckland. If you get a south wind into Wellington there's no terrain blocking it."

Cook Strait is notoriously cold, professor of physical geography, Dr James Renwick of Victoria University said.

"[Wellington] is sort of tied back a bit because of that."

frankv

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#1598288 25-Jul-2016 15:53

nunz: Look - One Volcano eruption throws more c02 in a few days than 5 years of human emissions.

Actually, it's irrelevant whether volcanoes do or don't emit more CO2 than people. Firstly, volcanoes are part of the *natural* environment, and have been doing their thing for millions of years. The fact that they emit a certain amount of CO2 and other stuff is *why* our environment is currently like it is. Secondly, we can't control volcanoes, so we have to live with whatever they do, and adjust what *we* do.

frankv

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#1598292 25-Jul-2016 15:57

BurningBeard:

MikeB4: Daffodils generally start about now

Lol, spot the gardening n00b!

Lol spot the geographical/climatological n00b!

Daffodils in one part of the country can normally start flowering about now, and normally start flowering later in other parts.

MikeAqua

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#1598329 25-Jul-2016 16:49

andrew027:

MikeAqua:

andrew027: My wife read something last year that said if global warming continued at it's current rate, in another decade Wellington would be like Brisbane.

Only if you ignore the wind chill!!

There won't be much wind chill when the ambient temperature is in the mid-20s and there's no snow north of Arthur's Pass.

Draw a line SE from Wellignton and see where it hits land

Mike

MikeAqua

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#1598330 25-Jul-2016 16:50

MikeB4:

MikeAqua:

andrew027:

My wife read something last year that said if global warming continued at it's current rate, in another decade Wellington would be like Brisbane.

Only if you ignore the wind chill!!

Wind chill, we don't have wind chill. We have breeze deviations.

No good running that line on me. I went out at lunch without gloves

Mike

webwat

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#1598623 25-Jul-2016 23:32

frankv:

nunz: Look - One Volcano eruption throws more c02 in a few days than 5 years of human emissions.

Actually, it's irrelevant whether volcanoes do or don't emit more CO2 than people. Firstly, volcanoes are part of the *natural* environment, and have been doing their thing for millions of years. The fact that they emit a certain amount of CO2 and other stuff is *why* our environment is currently like it is. Secondly, we can't control volcanoes, so we have to live with whatever they do, and adjust what *we* d

Meaning that humans have very little effect on CO2 levels, climate has always changed and always will. H2O is the main greenhouse gas.

Time to find a new industry!

tdgeek

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#1598629 26-Jul-2016 00:09

webwat:

frankv:

nunz: Look - One Volcano eruption throws more c02 in a few days than 5 years of human emissions.

Actually, it's irrelevant whether volcanoes do or don't emit more CO2 than people. Firstly, volcanoes are part of the *natural* environment, and have been doing their thing for millions of years. The fact that they emit a certain amount of CO2 and other stuff is *why* our environment is currently like it is. Secondly, we can't control volcanoes, so we have to live with whatever they do, and adjust what *we* d

Meaning that humans have very little effect on CO2 levels, climate has always changed and always will. H2O is the main greenhouse gas.

Quote from a Yahoo Answer below. We have been pouring chemicals into the atmosphere since the Industrial Revolution. Yes, Volcano's are a big hit, we see the spread of the smoke on the TV, its huge. But volcanoes arent lined up two per town around the world, but our chimneys, industrial chimneys, car fumes, aircraft fumes are. Id love to see a makeup of what size one smoke plume would be that equals what human are pumping up at any one time. A plume the size of NYC? 5 fold bigger or more probably. Unlike volcano's the pollution we give off dissipates into invisibility, which is really good, as what we can't see we don't need to worry about.Imagine if every unnatural pollution was black, or pink, or yellow? Then we could see what we do.

The term Greenhouse Gases isn't the most accurate one as it's not really comparable to a greenhouse. The way a greenhouse traps heat is different to the way the atmosphere traps heat. To answer your second point first - I've never come across anything to suggest greenhouses are bad for the environment; if anything they encourage plant growth which is good for the environment because plants take carbon dioxide out of the atmosphere. Returning to your first point - what is a greenhouse gas (GHG). The term is used to describe those gases that have the ability to trap heat within our atmosphere and they do this because there's a difference between heat from the sun entering our atmosphere and heat from the Earth leaving it. Heat from the sun, solar radiation, can easily pass through the atmosphere and the Earth absorbs this heat. The heat radiated back by the Earth is thermal radiation and this is a different wavelength to solar radiation. It's still heat but a different kind of heat and it has problems escaping from the atmosphere. It's this trapping of the heat which is referred to as the greenhouse effect. Almost all the atmosphere is made up of just three gases - nitrogen, oxygen and argon and together they account for more than 99.9% of the atmosphere but they're not greenhouse gases. Only about 0.05% (one part in every 2000) of the atmosphere is a greenhouse gas and the main one is carbon dioxide, the other two important ones are nitrous oxide and methane. These three gases occur naturally but they're also produced by human activities. There's a whole host of synthetic greenhouse gases, many of which have now been banned. You've probably heard of the group known as CFC's (chlorofluorocarbons), there are similar groups as well such as HFC's and HCFC's (hydrofluorocarbons and hydrochlorofluorocarbons). These gases are extremely effective as greenhouse gases go and they also destroy the ozone layer (the reason they're banned). One greenhouse gas I haven't mentioned is water vapour, this is almost entirely naturally occurring and the amount in the atmosphere varies considerably. Unlike other greenhouse gases there's a limit as to how much water vapour the atmosphere can contain, when the limit is reached the excess falls as rain. With the other GHGs they just keep on accumulating in the atmosphere. Although most of them deteriorate over time we're adding to them much faster than they're being naturally removed. You asked if GHGs are bad for the environment and the answer is both yes and no. If there weren't any GHGs there would be no greenhouse effect and the planet would be so cold that life would never have evolved, this natural greenhouse effect is essential to life on earth. The problem in the last 150 years or so has been that human activities have produced far more greenhouse gases then nature can handle and as a result the planet is now warming many times faster than it should be doing naturally. Basically it's a balancing act and we've messed it up.

jpoc

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#1598630 26-Jul-2016 00:09

Aredwood:

...

About the only thing that could ever provide enough cheap energy to replace fossil fuels - Nuclear Fusion. So better hope that practical nuclear fusion gets perfected soon.

...

Agreed.

I put actual money behind that concept and invested in Lockheed-Martin. Let's hope that their compact high-beta fusion project plays out according to the projected timescales.

The managers there are putting big money - shareholder funds - my money - behind the concept. They seem to be confident.

dickytim

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#1598659 26-Jul-2016 06:41

Linuxluver: It is now getting literally warmer every year.

To avoid more than 2C of warming now we would basically all have to park our fossil fuel cars tomorrow and never drive them again. Everyone. Everywhere.

http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/technology/heat-records-1.3686944

Don't see you turning off your computer, appliances etc. to effect change?

Typical fear mongering, and is there a mention of the natural heating and cooling of the earth that has been going on for millions of years?

frankv

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#1598674 26-Jul-2016 07:29

webwat:

frankv:

nunz: Look - One Volcano eruption throws more c02 in a few days than 5 years of human emissions.

Actually, it's irrelevant whether volcanoes do or don't emit more CO2 than people. Firstly, volcanoes are part of the *natural* environment, and have been doing their thing for millions of years. The fact that they emit a certain amount of CO2 and other stuff is *why* our environment is currently like it is. Secondly, we can't control volcanoes, so we have to live with whatever they do, and adjust what *we* d

Meaning that humans have very little effect on CO2 levels, climate has always changed and always will. H2O is the main greenhouse gas.

Meaning no such thing. The important thing is the "balance point"... prior to the Industrial Revolution, things were more-or-less balanced, including volcanoes and forests and oceans and animals.

Yes, climate has changed naturally in the past. But there is overwhelming evidence that climate change is being caused by human activity. There is no doubt that we *can* change the climate.

Given that we have optimised our activities for the current climate, any change is going to be sub-optimal. i.e.a Bad Thing (TM). If we shift things in one direction or another (or do nothing and allow things to change naturally), then we better be prepared to pay for the consequences of the change.

tdgeek

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#1598684 26-Jul-2016 07:50

dickytim:

Linuxluver: It is now getting literally warmer every year.

To avoid more than 2C of warming now we would basically all have to park our fossil fuel cars tomorrow and never drive them again. Everyone. Everywhere.

http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/technology/heat-records-1.3686944

Don't see you turning off your computer, appliances etc. to effect change?

Typical fear mongering, and is there a mention of the natural heating and cooling of the earth that has been going on for millions of years?

On the many docos I've watched, there always is. There is no need to hide that, nor hide the fact the greenhouse gases are vital to us, otherwise, we will live at -18C average instead of the +15C average that we do now. The issue is what cream on top we have added since the 1800's, the massive amounts that we have pumped into the limited volume atmosphere.

gzt

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#1598686 26-Jul-2016 08:02

https://www.skepticalscience.com/volcanoes-and-global-warming.htm

Numerous sources including government sources provide the same stats.

Unfortunately a lot of this thread looks like arguing with conspiracy theorists. There is always some other reason and some other reason but essentially there is a belief that it is a large conspiracy.

Also the potential solutions are just overwhelming for some people.

Some people really have trouble believing humans can affect anything at all on a global scale and just retreat into a mental fog la la land.

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