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  Reply # 1645175 4-Oct-2016 12:33
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Fred99:

 

Yes - I have no expectation that rational debate ever influences conservative values much.  Lest those damned iconoclastic liberals start demolishing all kinds of precious things which are rationally indefensible.

 

 

So true!

 

I know it's OT, but I was thinking about this last night when I was watching this must-view clip from the Daily Show on the alternative world that some Trump supporters live in - check out towards the end of the clip, where the interviewer asks for the "evidence" the supporters have to back up their arguments (such as Obama not being born in the US; though my favourite bit is about the apparent wide support Trump has from African Americans!). These kinds of clips make me wonder if the Daily Show are hiring actors...

 

 

 

 

 

 


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  Reply # 1645206 4-Oct-2016 12:46
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I can't believe you guys have spent 9 pages discussing clothes! cool

 

I would have waded in earlier, but I was waiting for the comments on shoes which are more my speciality tongue-out


 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 1645218 4-Oct-2016 13:01
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MikeB4:

 

Fred99:

 

MikeB4:

 

Fred99:

 

gzt: The vast majority of NZ schools are not particularly focused on dress standards. Most parents would find it a bit silly and annoying if that was the case. That may explain some of the differences in expectation. Short answer, it's a Kiwi thing.

 

 

 

My understanding is that the quaint concept of school uniforms has survived to this day for only a few reasons:

 

Snobbery value (as in the case of schools for children of the the well-to-do)
Fund-raising (in the case of the official uniform supply rort)
Expectation that it promotes some kind of "team" or "military" pride concept.

 

Very false assumptions that high-school age children would either go completely wild if there weren't uniforms or at least strict dress codes, or that kids would turn up in expensive designer clothes to flaunt wealth - some kind of socialist "leveler" thing - which even if it had merit - is completely futile.  By about age 8 kids know what mommy dropping them off at the gates in a Porsche Cayenne GTS - means.

 

Our son went to high school where there weren't any dress code rules at all.  Surprisingly few "went wild" - almost all just wore the normal clothes that teenagers wear.  A very few had plenty of body piercings and wore some pretty radical teenage fashion (none of which ever offended me in the slightest), but as that had zero shock-impact and there was no need to "rebel" against a rule that didn't exist, there wasn't any problem for which a rule might have been needed.

 

 

 

 

I think your assumed reasons for uniforms in NZ are wrong, period.

 

 

 

 

Then please explain what you think the reasons could be.

 

(apart from "inertia" - hanging on to concepts from the past because it's "part of culture - just the way it is, always was, so is the way it should be")

 

 

 

 

1. cost effective

 

2. Team spirit (this is actually a good thing it teaches cooperation and socialbility)

 

3. Security

 

4. removing competition with clothing and alienation of those who are from back grounds that cannot afford the latest and greatest.

 

5. ability for schools to provide the uniform both new and used.

 

6. teachers kids that there is times and circumstances in life that standards are required and rules are to follow.

 

 

 

 

1. Not likely, some school uniforms are grossly expensive, and it does not end there, you require a sports uniform, a swimming uniform, etc etc etc

 

2. That is what team sport is for, it does NOT require a uniform.

 

3. What ? How ?

 

4. Yeah right, you knew which kids had 2nd hand uniforms, only had one uniform they wore all week, whose uniform was "repaired" etc etc etc.

 

5. Huh ?, you mean the school making money to cover the short fall in government funding ?

 

6. Yet the tolerance for people wearing the clothing expected of them by their religion and culture is very very low, yet when placed in another culture they too cling to what they know.

 

A uniform is all about control and conformance. Its to make anyone not wearing feel intimidated by standing out, being different. They have been used to make people believe they are less valuable than those who wear a different uniform. Uniforms were used in the military so you could know friend from foe in the heat of battle, but their use in schools.... no value at all.

 

Look at Apple, Google, Facebook, etc etc etc, no uniforms , no dress code. Senior Apple execs have been refused meeting because they did not turn up in a suit, those that refused to meet often their companies did not last long or they missed out on huge deals. Turns out the person in the clothes is more important than the clothes.


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  Reply # 1645231 4-Oct-2016 13:51
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Horseychick:

 

I can't believe you guys have spent 9 pages discussing clothes! cool

 

I would have waded in earlier, but I was waiting for the comments on shoes which are more my speciality tongue-out

 

 

 

 

Shoes, school girl uniforms, french maid uniforms, nurse uniforms...
Please post shoe photos for scrutiny by skilled team of fetishologists.


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  Reply # 1645242 4-Oct-2016 14:12
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On the subject of shoes I have been going around trying to find non-Chinese made leather shoes. A mission. There are some Portuguese, a couple of Italian but that's very small number compared. Some shops have "Italian made" posters but when you walk inside it is only one or two. Not funny.

Also, for the previous comment asking for photos... I know it was a jest but remember this is a family show.




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Reply # 1645243 4-Oct-2016 14:17
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Horseychick:

 

I can't believe you guys have spent 9 pages discussing clothes! cool

 

I would have waded in earlier, but I was waiting for the comments on shoes which are more my speciality tongue-out

 

 

The first job in New Zealand many years ago in the biggest & now non-existent Telecom Dealership in Auckland.

 

The "boss" is nice kiwi girl. She was walking barefoot in the office with the golden chain on her foot... I've got cultural shock. Nothing but high hills ladies were wearing in the Moscow office.

 

Bless you Michelle


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  Reply # 1645252 4-Oct-2016 14:40
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freitasm:  it is only one or two.

 

Were they at least a pair?





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These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.


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  Reply # 1645254 4-Oct-2016 14:41
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RUKI:

 

 

 

The first job in New Zealand many years ago in the biggest & now non-existent Telecom Dealership in Auckland.

 

The "boss" is nice kiwi girl. She was walking barefoot in the office with the golden chain on her foot... I've got cultural shock. Nothing but high hills ladies were wearing in the Moscow office.

 

Bless you Michelle

 

 

I tried high heels once, to a party where you had to cross-dress, in Southland in a farming community - not where I'm from but felt I had to make the effort to fit in...
I don't know how that kind of theme for a party would go down in Russia, but not very well I expect.

 

The wig, makeup, undergarments, gown - all no problem.  The shoes - you can absolutely forget it.  I couldn't make it from the car to the front door. 


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  Reply # 1645266 4-Oct-2016 15:10
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freitasm: On the subject of shoes I have been going around trying to find non-Chinese made leather shoes. A mission. There are some Portuguese, a couple of Italian but that's very small number compared. Some shops have "Italian made" posters but when you walk inside it is only one or two. Not funny.

Also, for the previous comment asking for photos... I know it was a jest but remember this is a family show.

 

 

 

There is a fine shoe shop in Courtney place - Mark Kendall shoes.

 

A number of excellent English leather shoemakers are available there, such as Loake and Barkers.






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Reply # 1645269 4-Oct-2016 15:36
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Fred99:

 

I tried high heels once, to a party where you had to cross-dress, in Southland in a farming community - not where I'm from but felt I had to make the effort to fit in...

 

Hmmm... so you were happy to conform so long as it involved wearing high heels, silky undergarments, and a dress?

 

Perhaps we should put this forward as a proposal for school uniforms?

 

I wonder if my boss would buy those for the department uniform?

 

laughing

 

 


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  Reply # 1645271 4-Oct-2016 15:40
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frankv:

 

Fred99:

 

I tried high heels once, to a party where you had to cross-dress, in Southland in a farming community - not where I'm from but felt I had to make the effort to fit in...

 

Hmmm... so you were happy to conform so long as it involved wearing high heels, silky undergarments, and a dress?

 

Perhaps we should put this forward as a proposal for school uniforms?

 

I wonder if my boss would buy those for the department uniform?

 

laughing

 

 

 

 

 

 

The question we should be asking him, of course, is "Are you a Lumberjack?"






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  Reply # 1645286 4-Oct-2016 16:07
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freitasm: On the subject of shoes I have been going around trying to find non-Chinese made leather shoes. A mission. There are some Portuguese, a couple of Italian but that's very small number compared. Some shops have "Italian made" posters but when you walk inside it is only one or two. Not funny.

Also, for the previous comment asking for photos... I know it was a jest but remember this is a family show.

 

 

 

Try Bullick Blackmore in Masterton





Mike
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The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1645288 4-Oct-2016 16:14
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Fred99:

 

 

 

I tried high heels once, to a party where you had to cross-dress, in Southland in a farming community - not where I'm from but felt I had to make the effort to fit in...
I don't know how that kind of theme for a party would go down in Russia, but not very well I expect.

 

The wig, makeup, undergarments, gown - all no problem.  The shoes - you can absolutely forget it.  I couldn't make it from the car to the front door. 

 

 

Flats are always preferable to heels. Comfort over fashion any day.

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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  Reply # 1645290 4-Oct-2016 16:19
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Rikkitic:

 

Fred99:

 

 

 

I tried high heels once, to a party where you had to cross-dress, in Southland in a farming community - not where I'm from but felt I had to make the effort to fit in...
I don't know how that kind of theme for a party would go down in Russia, but not very well I expect.

 

The wig, makeup, undergarments, gown - all no problem.  The shoes - you can absolutely forget it.  I couldn't make it from the car to the front door. 

 

 

Flats are always preferable to heels. Comfort over fashion any day.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not if you are wearing sneans that is never allowed, ever!! according to my sons. tongue-out





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

The great divide is the lies from both sides.

 

 


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  Reply # 1645293 4-Oct-2016 16:29
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Geektastic:

 

frankv:

 

Fred99:

 

I tried high heels once, to a party where you had to cross-dress, in Southland in a farming community - not where I'm from but felt I had to make the effort to fit in...

 

Hmmm... so you were happy to conform so long as it involved wearing high heels, silky undergarments, and a dress?

 

Perhaps we should put this forward as a proposal for school uniforms?

 

I wonder if my boss would buy those for the department uniform?

 

laughing

 

 

 

 

 

 

The question we should be asking him, of course, is "Are you a Lumberjack?"

 

 

 

 

Including me, there was at least tree fellers in drag, so the answer has to be affirmative.

 

I had a horrific experience meeting a work colleague of SWMBO's who (unknown to me beforehand) had undergone some gender reassignment.  At that stage kind of partial, but I'm not good enough at anatomy to put a % completion figure to it.  Not only can I not elucidate for fear of incurring wrath for NSFW content, but it seriously pains me to think about it, how - despite trying to be a good tolerant person - you can faux pas your way into a situation from which it's actually impossible to escape from politely, morally and emotionally intact.  I turned and ran - like a true coward - it seemed like a better idea than standing there, frozen speechless in terror, with a look of panic in my eyes. No more transgender cosplay for me - I've straightened up - big time.


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