Who's Liable for The Excess?

Forums › Off topic › Who's Liable for The Excess?

1 | 2 | 3

3170 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1624

# 1707982 23-Jan-2017 12:19

Check your policy. Over 25 is likely to be covered. Make sure you have their name and contact details and have viewed the drivers license of each person who is going to test drive it (take a photo or copy). I use my judgement on accompanying for test drives or not. My cars are usually family type vehicles so don't get the ferrules knocking. I have not routinely accompanied them. The other idea is you could get them to sign a disclaimer that they will obey road rules, take reasonable care of the vehicle and if damaged agree that they will purchase the car at the advertised price.

Always be yourself, unless you can be Batman, then always be the Batman

BlinkyBill

406 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 310

# 1707995 23-Jan-2017 12:38

It's the CAR that's insured, not the driver. This is pretty simple.

BlinkyBill

mdooher

Hmm, what to write...
1010 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 522

Trusted

Subscriber

# 1708010 23-Jan-2017 13:12

networkn:

Heh, that reminds me. I once a near new S4 for a drive, legitimately interested in purchasing it. I wouldn't say I thrashed it, but I drove it like I owned it and was pretty keen on it, till the guy told me what he would offer as a trade to which I laughed. He then proceeded to pull an ipad from the back seat document holder and low and behold there were a bunch of driving stats on the screen. He made a very pointed comment about how the average speed was much faster than people who usually test drive cars.

When I test drive a car, I drive it like I stole it. I drive far harder than I ever plan on driving it normally. If it gets back to the dealer and the brakes aren't on fire and the engine isn't making contracting ticking noises then I haven't worked it hard enough. I once thrashed an Alfa 147, and when I took it back to the dealer I said. "I'll take one...but not this one" ok I probably went over the top with that poor car but you get the idea.

If I am buying privately it is a different story. I would expect the owner to come with me. I will still drive it hard but with more respect. I also check the owner has insurance and that it covers me to drive it. if not, I'm not touching it.

Matthew

mattwnz

14803 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2007

# 1708052 23-Jan-2017 13:35

If you go to a dealer, they will make you sign a form that says you have to pay excess if something happens. If you are selling privately, it may be a good idea to get a similar type of form of someone to fill in. Or you drive the car on the test drive . Or you take the risk. Although I guess it depends on the the value of the vehicle.

gzt

10706 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1759

# 1708124 23-Jan-2017 14:59

Driver is liable. If your insurance covers the driver, that driver is insured.

In a test drive situation at a dealer? That's an interesting one. Don't know the answer.

mdooher

Hmm, what to write...
1010 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 522

Trusted

Subscriber

# 1708127 23-Jan-2017 15:01

gzt: Driver is liable. If your insurance covers the driver, that driver is insured.

In a test drive situation at a dealer? That's an interesting one. Don't know the answer.

The driver is responsible. If you are the driver ask if he car is insured and what the excess is.

Matthew

afe66

1973 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 741

Lifetime subscriber

# 1708199 23-Jan-2017 17:26

Ask your insurance company, no one else's opinions count..

Athlonite

1828 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 215
Inactive user

# 1708211 23-Jan-2017 17:56

SATTV:

It is the same if you take your car to the mechanic and while they are taking the car on a test drive and have an accident.

Actually the business is Liable in that situation

When I worked as a Car Valet I was the only one allowed to drive the expensive or exotic cars because I was the only one with a full license and was over 25 the companies insurance wouldn't cover the other 3 members of staff who were either under 25 or did not hold a full license

in your case even though the mechanic was hit from behind they should still have covered your excess next time tell them you don't want anyone under 25 or not a full license holder to drive your car simple as that

mattwnz

14803 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2007

# 1708216 23-Jan-2017 18:16

gzt: Driver is liable. If your insurance covers the driver, that driver is insured.

In a test drive situation at a dealer? That's an interesting one. Don't know the answer.

The OP is talking about the excess, rather than just the insurance cover. IANAL Although someone maybe insured, if it is the drivers fault, they still have to pay an excess. If it is the fault of the other driver in the case of two cars being involved, then if the driver can prove the fault was the other driver, than the insurance comapny may refund the excess. It is potentially quite complicated. I had an issue where an unsecured load came off a truck that I was following, and it hit my car. I had to pay the excess initially even though it wasn't my fault, but the insurance eventually got it off the truck driver, so they refunded me. Although that took the best part of two years chasing it up with the insurance company.Poor experience,

mdooher

Hmm, what to write...
1010 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 522

Trusted

Subscriber

# 1708253 23-Jan-2017 19:27

afe66: Ask your insurance company, no one else's opinions count..

This is going to sound smart arse but I am really trying not to be.... If you crash someone else's car you are going to pay for it. If the car is insured for you as a driver (hopefully the policy isn't named driver only etc) they might pay out. Any excess is down to you. If someone else caused it, the insurance company might bother to chase it but they don't have to. It is your problem. How do I know this? Because I can read. (that's the smart arse bit).

My insurance company, and yours, are a pack of mongrels. You don't ask them for advice, you read there policy document and if you don't understand it you ask a Lawyer. You don't ask them.

Matthew

mattwnz

14803 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 2007

# 1708254 23-Jan-2017 19:31

One person supports this post

mdooher:

My insurance company, and yours, are a pack of mongrels. You don't ask them for advice, you read there policy document and if you don't understand it you ask a Lawyer. You don't ask them.

Or the nicer term for them is, fair-weather friends.

mdooher

Hmm, what to write...
1010 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 522

Trusted

Subscriber

# 1708255 23-Jan-2017 19:33

mattwnz:

mdooher:

My insurance company, and yours, are a pack of mongrels. You don't ask them for advice, you read there policy document and if you don't understand it you ask a Lawyer. You don't ask them.

Or the nicer term for them is, fair-weather friends.

Indeed

Matthew

BlinkyBill

406 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 310

# 1709997 26-Jan-2017 13:32

For goodness sake! The misinformation.

If you own a car, you are responsible for the car, and for who drives it, and for insuring the car. If you let someone drive your car, that driver is not responsible for insurance. This is excepting professional situations such as a mechanic testing your car or similar where that mechanic will hold public liability insurance.

Unless you specifically and in writing make it clear to the test driver that they are responsible for all damages to the car, and they in writing accept that responsibility, then the car owner is responsible for any insurance arrangements. The policy describes if the insurance arrangements are named-driver only, or 25+ only, or dogs only, and those conditions apply to the test driver also. Excess provisions apply also.

This could not be simpler: the car is insured according to an insurance policy, the provisions of the policy apply to any driver of the car (i.e. whether that driver is covered or not, to what extent, and what excess applies), and it is up to the policy owner to make sure the car is driven within those bounds/limits. Otherwise there is no insurance coverage for the usage.

I do not understand why people don't clearly understand this. The same principle applies to any insurance policy.

BlinkyBill

mdooher

Hmm, what to write...
1010 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 522

Trusted

Subscriber

# 1710104 26-Jan-2017 14:59

BlinkyBill: For goodness sake! The misinformation.

If you own a car, you are responsible for the car, and for who drives it, and for insuring the car. If you let someone drive your car, that driver is not responsible for insurance. This is excepting professional situations such as a mechanic testing your car or similar where that mechanic will hold public liability insurance.

Unless you specifically and in writing make it clear to the test driver that they are responsible for all damages to the car, and they in writing accept that responsibility, then the car owner is responsible for any insurance arrangements. The policy describes if the insurance arrangements are named-driver only, or 25+ only, or dogs only, and those conditions apply to the test driver also. Excess provisions apply also.

This could not be simpler: the car is insured according to an insurance policy, the provisions of the policy apply to any driver of the car (i.e. whether that driver is covered or not, to what extent, and what excess applies), and it is up to the policy owner to make sure the car is driven within those bounds/limits. Otherwise there is no insurance coverage for the usage.

I do not understand why people don't clearly understand this. The same principle applies to any insurance policy.

This is so wrong, I almost don't know where to start.

If you let someone drive your car and that person crashes it is their problem. If your insurance covers them, then they, and you, are lucky. If it doesn't cover them you are both unlucky. But in any event the person causing the damage is ultimately responsible.

If you are stupid enough to drive someone else's car without enquiring into the insurance arrangements you could be in for a very big shock. If it is not insured or has a $5000 excess then you are going to be paying.

So as for the "in writing bit" above it is exactly the opposite. Unless you have it in writing that the car is insured.... it isn't! and you are a fool to drive it.

What do you thinks happens if you go to a car dealer and test drive his car and crash it? You pay! "Oh I thought it was insured" doesn't work in court. This is why you ask the dealer "how much is the excess" and "how far from the yard am I covered for"

Matthew

BlinkyBill

406 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 310

# 1710133 26-Jan-2017 15:46

Mdooher your comments support what I am saying. Which is that is is the car that is insured, not the driver. And the t's&c's of the insurance policy apply. The policy owner is responsible for the excess, and would have to recover from the driver if they want to.

If you have a visitor to your house, and they accidentally break a window, that breakage is covered by the t's and c's of your applicable household policy, and the excess is payable by you, the policy holder. Or you can have a crack at the visitor and not make a claim.

Armstrong Prestige, my car dealer, has insurances on their cars that cover test drives; and also their driving of my cars performed in accordance with required vehicle testing.

BlinkyBill

1 | 2 | 3