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  # 1778275 9-May-2017 09:48
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At least a little common sense.

 

http://inews.co.uk/essentials/news/world/stephen-frys-irish-blasphemy-case-dropped-no-one-offended/

 

 


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  # 1778285 9-May-2017 10:12
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frankv:

 

shk292:

 

So, two accounts from very reputable news organisations showing how Sharia law is creeping into UK society, and some still believe that it is "laughable" and "not possible" for there to be any call for Sharia law in the UK.  What was that about flat earth?

 

 

What was laughable was this:

 

 shk292:

 

...calls for the imposition of Sharia law in parts of the UK is quite worrying

 

 

The two quoted news reports don't support that at all; that is quite different from "Sharia law is creeping into UK society". Rather, they show that British society is changing and adapting, as it has done for millennia.

 

 

 

 

So you're saying that there are no calls for Sharia law in the UK?  That none of the Islamic preachers (eg https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/24/radical-cleric-islamic-state-release-british-hostage-alan-henning and https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/20/abu-hamza-profile) that take a hard line view on their religion - some of whom have been prosecuted and at least one deported/extradited - have ever advocated for the introduction of Sharia law in Western countries such as the UK (that is what I mean by "calls for the imposition of...").  If you really believe that, then your knowledge of such affairs is, to use your term, "laughable".


 
 
 
 


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  # 1778299 9-May-2017 10:46
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shk292:

 

frankv:

 

shk292:

 

So, two accounts from very reputable news organisations showing how Sharia law is creeping into UK society, and some still believe that it is "laughable" and "not possible" for there to be any call for Sharia law in the UK.  What was that about flat earth?

 

 

What was laughable was this:

 

 shk292:

 

...calls for the imposition of Sharia law in parts of the UK is quite worrying

 

 

The two quoted news reports don't support that at all; that is quite different from "Sharia law is creeping into UK society". Rather, they show that British society is changing and adapting, as it has done for millennia.

 

 

 

 

So you're saying that there are no calls for Sharia law in the UK?  That none of the Islamic preachers (eg https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/24/radical-cleric-islamic-state-release-british-hostage-alan-henning and https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/20/abu-hamza-profile) that take a hard line view on their religion - some of whom have been prosecuted and at least one deported/extradited - have ever advocated for the introduction of Sharia law in Western countries such as the UK (that is what I mean by "calls for the imposition of...").  If you really believe that, then your knowledge of such affairs is, to use your term, "laughable".

 

 

Sure, and the McGillicuddy Serious Party called for NZ to take a "great leap backwards" to become a feudal society. Now I live in fear of being forced to become a Monty Pythonesque dung-covered serf.


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  # 1778325 9-May-2017 11:18
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BlueShift:

 

Sure, and the McGillicuddy Serious Party called for NZ to take a "great leap backwards" to become a feudal society. Now I live in fear of being forced to become a Monty Pythonesque dung-covered serf.

 

 

Hmm, OK if you're equating Islamification with joke political parties then I think there is no point in continuing this discussion.


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  # 1778330 9-May-2017 11:27
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Paul1977:

 

At least a little common sense.

 

http://inews.co.uk/essentials/news/world/stephen-frys-irish-blasphemy-case-dropped-no-one-offended/

 

 

 

 

 

 

Praise de lord....






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  # 1778335 9-May-2017 11:31
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shk292:

 

BlueShift:

 

Sure, and the McGillicuddy Serious Party called for NZ to take a "great leap backwards" to become a feudal society. Now I live in fear of being forced to become a Monty Pythonesque dung-covered serf.

 

 

Hmm, OK if you're equating Islamification with joke political parties then I think there is no point in continuing this discussion.

 

 

If you're equating far-right religious extremist rantings with the serious possibility of completely throwing out 2000 years of UK political history and replacing it with Sharia law, then I think you're right about the pointlessness of the discussion.


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  # 1778353 9-May-2017 11:58
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shk292:

 

frankv:

 

shk292:

 

So, two accounts from very reputable news organisations showing how Sharia law is creeping into UK society, and some still believe that it is "laughable" and "not possible" for there to be any call for Sharia law in the UK.  What was that about flat earth?

 

 

What was laughable was this:

 

 shk292:

 

...calls for the imposition of Sharia law in parts of the UK is quite worrying

 

 

The two quoted news reports don't support that at all; that is quite different from "Sharia law is creeping into UK society". Rather, they show that British society is changing and adapting, as it has done for millennia.

 

 

 

 

So you're saying that there are no calls for Sharia law in the UK?  That none of the Islamic preachers (eg https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/24/radical-cleric-islamic-state-release-british-hostage-alan-henning and https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/20/abu-hamza-profile) that take a hard line view on their religion - some of whom have been prosecuted and at least one deported/extradited - have ever advocated for the introduction of Sharia law in Western countries such as the UK (that is what I mean by "calls for the imposition of...").  If you really believe that, then your knowledge of such affairs is, to use your term, "laughable".

 

 

Neither of those articles says that either of those radical preachers ever called for Sharia law in the UK.

 

Please, if you can find some actual evidence of someone, anyone, calling for Sharia law to be imposed in the UK, prove me wrong on that point. Then, of course, you'll also have to find someone whose call for Sharia law has been taken seriously.

 

FYI:

 

https://fullfact.org/law/uks-sharia-courts/

 

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/nogozones.asp 

 

In response, British Prime Minister David Cameron termed Emerson “a complete idiot”:

 

After Emerson sparred with Araud, his claims were broadcast to a larger audience and met with considerable ridicule.

 

The citizens of Birmingham found his comments to be particularly amusing:

 

 

I agree with them: the whole thing is laughable.

 

 


 
 
 
 


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  # 1778361 9-May-2017 12:02
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BlueShift:

 

shk292:

 

BlueShift:

 

Sure, and the McGillicuddy Serious Party called for NZ to take a "great leap backwards" to become a feudal society. Now I live in fear of being forced to become a Monty Pythonesque dung-covered serf.

 

 

Hmm, OK if you're equating Islamification with joke political parties then I think there is no point in continuing this discussion.

 

 

If you're equating far-right religious extremist rantings with the serious possibility of completely throwing out 2000 years of UK political history and replacing it with Sharia law, then I think you're right about the pointlessness of the discussion.

 

 

 

 

The UK has thrown out plenty of things it did for a long time. They no longer execute witches, for example. That stopped only within the last 300 years.

 

Do not be so sure that what seems unlikely today is somehow therefore impossible. The tentacles of PC liberalism run deep in some UK institutions and the appetite for the political classes to do stupid things in the name of 'equality' or 'human rights' knows no bounds in the current age.






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  # 1778365 9-May-2017 12:06
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shk292:

 

BlueShift:

 

Sure, and the McGillicuddy Serious Party called for NZ to take a "great leap backwards" to become a feudal society. Now I live in fear of being forced to become a Monty Pythonesque dung-covered serf.

 

 

Hmm, OK if you're equating Islamification with joke political parties then I think there is no point in continuing this discussion.

 

 

What problem do you have with Islamification? It sounds like you think it's a bad thing?

 

 


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  # 1778367 9-May-2017 12:11
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Geektastic:

 

The tentacles of PC liberalism run deep in some UK institutions and the appetite for the political classes to do stupid things in the name of 'equality' or 'human rights' knows no bounds in the current age.

 

 

Interestingly, PC liberalism in the name of 'equality' and 'human rights' in the guise of women's rights groups is in the vanguard of opposing Sharia "courts".

 

 


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  # 1778380 9-May-2017 12:31
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frankv:

 

Neither of those articles says that either of those radical preachers ever called for Sharia law in the UK.

 

Please, if you can find some actual evidence of someone, anyone, calling for Sharia law to be imposed in the UK, prove me wrong on that point. Then, of course, you'll also have to find someone whose call for Sharia law has been taken seriously.

 

 

No, sorry, I don't think there is any point in trying to persuade you on this.  If you really believe that these fundamentalists wouldn't want their laws imposed in their country of residence, then that is fine, you go on believing that.  I'm not discussing it further.  As someone pointed out above, fortunately in the Stephen Fry case, the whole thing has been dropped anyway.


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  # 1778425 9-May-2017 13:06
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frankv:

 

What problem do you have with Islamification? It sounds like you think it's a bad thing?

 

 

 

 

Primarily I'm opposed to religion having significant influence on the legislative and executive functions of government, or controlling people's lives in extra-judicial ways.  And those things seem to happen more frequently and to a greater extent in Islamic nations/societies.

 

I'm not a huge fan of FGM, stoning, preventing women from driving or throwing homosexuals of tall buildings either - but any suggestions that those phenomena have anything to do with Islamification are presumably "laughable"


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  # 1778428 9-May-2017 13:09
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shk292:

 

frankv:

 

Neither of those articles says that either of those radical preachers ever called for Sharia law in the UK.

 

Please, if you can find some actual evidence of someone, anyone, calling for Sharia law to be imposed in the UK, prove me wrong on that point. Then, of course, you'll also have to find someone whose call for Sharia law has been taken seriously.

 

 

No, sorry, I don't think there is any point in trying to persuade you on this.  If you really believe that these fundamentalists wouldn't want their laws imposed in their country of residence, then that is fine, you go on believing that.  I'm not discussing it further.  As someone pointed out above, fortunately in the Stephen Fry case, the whole thing has been dropped anyway.

 

 

I have no problem believing that fundamentalists would like their laws imposed on their country, but I also believe that NZ's Christian Heritage Party had a better chance of getting fundamentalist scripture-based law in NZ than Islamic fundamentalists have of getting the entire UK legal and justice system replaced with Sharia law.

 

Its not the desires of the fringe I have a problem believing, its their chances of being taken seriously.


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  # 1778438 9-May-2017 13:26
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shk292:

 

No, sorry, I don't think there is any point in trying to persuade you on this.  If you really believe that these fundamentalists wouldn't want their laws imposed in their country of residence, then that is fine, you go on believing that.  I'm not discussing it further. 

 

 

There is nothing wrong with fundamentalists (apart from a certain nuttiness and resistance to rational argument), nor with people (even fundamentalists) wanting laws changed in their country of residence, nor even with with people (even fundamentalists) working to get laws changed. Everyone has that right in a democracy.

 

But! Finally! Something that we agree on! I believe that I've conclusively demonstrated that "calls for imposition of Sharia law in the UK", if they ever existed, would be laughable. So you certainly won't persuade me to your position based on nothing but prejudice and a fertile imagination. 

 

 


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  # 1778445 9-May-2017 13:31
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shk292:

 

Primarily I'm opposed to religion having significant influence on the legislative and executive functions of government, or controlling people's lives in extra-judicial ways.  And those things seem to happen more frequently and to a greater extent in Islamic nations/societies.

 

I'm not a huge fan of FGM, stoning, preventing women from driving or throwing homosexuals of tall buildings either - but any suggestions that those phenomena have anything to do with Islamification are presumably "laughable"

 

 

You mean like forcing the non-Christian majority in New Zealand to sit through prayers at parliament and on Anzac Day? 

 

Also, conflating the extremist practices of ISIS (and Saudi Arabia) with the beliefs of ordinary Muslims does nothing to further your argument. The two are completely separate and distinct. When ISIS-controlled areas of Mosul and elsewhere were liberated, no-one celebrated more enthusiastically than the ordinary (devout) Muslims who live there.

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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