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18332 posts

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  # 1832615 28-Jul-2017 07:12
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Geektastic:

 

It's a bit like drafting a Trust Deed.

 

The Trustees will usually be placed in the position of having to use their best endeavours to determine some aspect of the Settlor's intent. The courts would usually only expect people in those positions to do the best they can. As long as you've taken professional advice, not acted in contravention of it and the trustees (or, in this case, executors) have discussed it and agreed a course of action that the man on the Clapham Omnibus would not consider unreasonable  it is unlikely the court would consider that you should have done more (what more can you do, for a start?) although I guess you never know with the law.

 

If it were me, I would personally define benefit in this context as being something that has lasting positive outcomes for the beneficiaries. I'd say that within that sort of area you as executors are actually entitled to use your judgement and that the person who made the will intended you to do so because otherwise they would have been absolutely specific and left it (for example) as education and maintenance.

 

 

Thats where we see it. When they are due, they make whatever choice they like. When they are not due, but request funds, the bolded must apply, as distinct from cool, I want this I want that. Thats why the age is 26


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  # 1832621 28-Jul-2017 07:57
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Difficult, but I agree with your position taken. IMHO, what the claimant wants is why the will specifies age 26, hoping that as they get older they will be better able to make wiser expenditure decisions. 

 

Good luck!


 
 
 
 


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  # 1832629 28-Jul-2017 08:37
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Is it an all or nothing situation? Perhaps a small contribution that may assist with some of the more pressing items, whilst the other "luxuries" can wait?

 

Can the beneficiaries otherwise raise the funds to fit out the flat?

 

Have the beneficiaries been prudent in their approach to needs, or is it all new, top end over the top stuff?

 

Nothing wrong with 2nd hand goods from the salvation army etc to fit out basic needs on a flatting situation, my brother did this when he split from his wife, spent a fraction of what it would have cost to otherwise get himself started. I'm sure most of it has since been upgraded as time and money has allowed, but it served its purpose.

 

 

 

 




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  # 1832633 28-Jul-2017 08:53
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sen8or:

 

Is it an all or nothing situation? Perhaps a small contribution that may assist with some of the more pressing items, whilst the other "luxuries" can wait? All. We offered help with direct baby setup costs

 

Can the beneficiaries otherwise raise the funds to fit out the flat? Its one, and no idea. Has two parents, lives with one, the partner must have parents

 

Have the beneficiaries been prudent in their approach to needs, or is it all new, top end over the top stuff? NO. Caps intended, and yes

 

Nothing wrong with 2nd hand goods from the salvation army etc to fit out basic needs on a flatting situation, my brother did this when he split from his wife, spent a fraction of what it would have cost to otherwise get himself started. I'm sure most of it has since been upgraded as time and money has allowed, but it served its purpose. Exactly, and what all of us did in some form or other when we left the nest. 2nd hand, borrow, get given. Then over time upgrade. Or blow half of a not insignificant legacy, including near 5 figures for a car, then thats it. Relationship ends, lose some, most of the gear. Ifn3 years its all near valueless as well 

 

 

 

 

 


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  # 1832647 28-Jul-2017 09:19
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If you acquiesce to this request, then the express provision in the will for the beneficiaries' access to the funds to be limited until they're 26 is really having no effect at all. In fact, preventing the 20 year olds from filling a house with a wishlist of brand new stuff seems like it would be the exact reason you'd structure your will in that way in the first place.




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  # 1832658 28-Jul-2017 09:35
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allio:

 

If you acquiesce to this request, then the express provision in the will for the beneficiaries' access to the funds to be limited until they're 26 is really having no effect at all. In fact, preventing the 20 year olds from filling a house with a wishlist of brand new stuff seems like it would be the exact reason you'd structure your will in that way in the first place.

 

 

100% as I see it


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  # 1832729 28-Jul-2017 11:00
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sen8or:

 

Is it an all or nothing situation? Perhaps a small contribution that may assist with some of the more pressing items, whilst the other "luxuries" can wait?

 

Can the beneficiaries otherwise raise the funds to fit out the flat?

 

Have the beneficiaries been prudent in their approach to needs, or is it all new, top end over the top stuff?

 

Nothing wrong with 2nd hand goods from the salvation army etc to fit out basic needs on a flatting situation, my brother did this when he split from his wife, spent a fraction of what it would have cost to otherwise get himself started. I'm sure most of it has since been upgraded as time and money has allowed, but it served its purpose.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree with this position. While they could go out and fit out their flat with new high end stuff, do they really need to? A brand new 55" TV is not a necessity in my opinion, but nice baby gear (strollers, cots, change tables etc) is, although even that doesn't have to be brand new in most cases. Likewise, a safe $5000 family car would be just as useful as a safe $25,000 family car. Wants vs needs.....

 

I am fortunate in that the will I am currently executing does not have any minor beneficiaries. Having said that, it is a complicated estate and my co-executors and I had to make many decisions in the best interests of all the beneficiaries.This means there has been a wait of over two years while we used cash held by the estate to effect about 20 years of deferred maintenance and improvements on some of the real estate held by the estate. One of the beneficiaries was a bit grumpy about this delay, however they will end up getting around 30% more from the distribution than they would have had we simply sold the properties 'as is'. On a seven figure sum, 30% is not to be sneezed at!


 
 
 
 


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  # 1832750 28-Jul-2017 11:31
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That always depends on the properties. A purchaser could make it all look futile by clearing the section and rebuilding.

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  # 1832854 28-Jul-2017 13:03
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1) get the person to provide you with a list of all the things they need for the said house and baby (include costs) and why they need such items (reminding them they are not really entitled to all funds before the said age unless for education/needs it to survive)

 

2) decide and rank the list (and remove anything not deemed necessary)

 

3) Issue funds / budget and ensure you get receipts. 

 

This way, the person isnt getting too much or too less and you are upholding the responsibility of being the executor of the will. (Executor means you are responsible so need to act that way with the funds). 

 

easy?

 

 


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  # 1832866 28-Jul-2017 13:26
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If there was no baby on the way, they wouldn't be asking for things to furnish a house, that wasn't the intent of the will.

 

A car, I would make an allowance for if they didn't already have one between them, and up to a figure such as 5k (for the baby's benefit).

 

If this was my will being executed, I would hope my intent was made clear by putting the age at 26, and items such as house or education so the money is not used frivolously.

 

 

 

edit: Another idea, if the (I assume parent) was alive now, and the new baby was on the way, what sort of help would they have given? I know my parents bought us a stroller, the in laws bought a cot, etc.. we provided the rest. Maybe a set figure for them to spend on baby gear, and hope they use it wisely.

 

 




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  # 1832870 28-Jul-2017 13:31
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esawers:

 

If there was no baby on the way, they wouldn't be asking for things to furnish a house, that wasn't the intent of the will.

 

A car, I would make an allowance for if they didn't already have one between them, and up to a figure such as 5k (for the baby's benefit).

 

If this was my will being executed, I would hope my intent was made clear by putting the age at 26, and items such as house or education so the money is not used frivolously.

 

 

 

 

Agree. The baby seems to be a good reason to go for gold. No issue with helping out with baby gear, but its 90% me gear. Like everyone else, start off as best you can, we all do or did that. In a few years, bang, an inheritance. A nice kick start. Or well gone by then, and yes, thats not the intent


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  # 1832880 28-Jul-2017 13:40
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tdgeek:

 

sen8or:

 

Have the beneficiaries been prudent in their approach to needs, or is it all new, top end over the top stuff? NO. Caps intended, and yes

 

 

 

And there's the reason it was set at 26.

 

Will they benefit from this long term, or in a few years will they just have a flat full of items that are worth 10% of their original purchase price?

 

Would it also set a dangerous precedent for whenever they wanted anything else?


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