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  Reply # 1956459 13-Feb-2018 16:57
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bagheera:

 

you can write in and try to get it waived - got to love how MP does not have to do jury service but think money hardship not a reason not to do it.

 

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/97095141/financial-hardship-not-an-excuse-for-skipping-jury-duty-minister-says

 

 

The fine for non-attendance is $1,000 so there is a point at which it's the cheaper option.





Mike

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  Reply # 1956467 13-Feb-2018 17:07
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MaxLV:

 

When I asked why I had been selected, they said it's a random selection of people from the electoral roll, and no checks are made to see if any of the people have had previous jury service in the last two years. 

 

 

Sounds like incompetence at the top to me. Not really acceptable in the days of ummmm... computer databases. 

 

 




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  Reply # 1956469 13-Feb-2018 17:11
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MikeAqua:

 

bagheera:

 

you can write in and try to get it waived - got to love how MP does not have to do jury service but think money hardship not a reason not to do it.

 

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/97095141/financial-hardship-not-an-excuse-for-skipping-jury-duty-minister-says

 

 

The fine for non-attendance is $1,000 so there is a point at which it's the cheaper option.

 

 

Isn't a $1000 fine per day until you show up, also a conviction? 

 

I'd have paid $1000 for my guy not to be away in a heart beat. 

 

 


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  Reply # 1956470 13-Feb-2018 17:12
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Geektastic:

 

networkn:

 

Geektastic:

 

Geektastic:

 

So what happens if you are the only employee in your business?

 

 

 

 

Does anyone know?

 

 

You write in and get waived. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Oh, ok. There is not a single mention of that circumstance on the website etc that I could find.

 

 

That's because there is no waiver for self-employed. 

 

You can write in like anyone else, but doesn't mean a waiver will be given.  

 

I had my foreign client write a letter for me that i was required. 

 

Incidentally, a friend in the 'justice system'  told me that one way of assuring you will get off is by telling them you don't recognize the jurisdiction of the NZ courts . 

 

I don't know if he is correct or not, but he has sat through a large number of trials. 




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  Reply # 1956472 13-Feb-2018 17:14
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Incidentally, a friend in the 'justice system'  told me that one way of assuring you will get off is by telling them you don't recognize the jurisdiction of the NZ courts . 

 

I don't know if he is correct or not, but he has sat through a large number of trials. 

 

 

Doesn't seem like that works :)

 

 


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  Reply # 1956488 13-Feb-2018 18:02
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It seems to be of questionable fairness where a person is a sole trader (and obviously therefore cannot work if in court) to pay them a paltry sum that bears not the slightest resemblance to what their lost earnings might have been.

 

 

 

Why did you lose that $100,000 contract? Well, I was on jury duty earning $31/day....






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  Reply # 1956497 13-Feb-2018 18:36
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Geektastic:

 

It seems to be of questionable fairness where a person is a sole trader (and obviously therefore cannot work if in court) to pay them a paltry sum that bears not the slightest resemblance to what their lost earnings might have been.

 

 

 

Why did you lose that $100,000 contract? Well, I was on jury duty earning $31/day....

 

 

Yep, should be like ACC and pay 80% of your average income.


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  Reply # 1956510 13-Feb-2018 19:25
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Or like having a baby, where you get paid for time off work. Maybe jury duty is a public service, but so is going on a council, or into politics, and those all pay well, for the time spent. Maybe not what someone could earn in some private businesses, although that seems to be reversing.

 

But the system isn't fair. You can get 80% of your wage if you get injured paying sport(which IMO can sometimes be partialy self inflicted, as some sports have high rates of injury, and it is peoples choice to pay them or not). But if you get ill, which potentially can be caused by external factors too, but maybe impossible to prove, you only get the basic sickness benefits.


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  Reply # 1956538 13-Feb-2018 19:30
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bagheera:

 

networkn:

 

Geektastic:

 

Geektastic:

 

So what happens if you are the only employee in your business?

 

 

 

 

Does anyone know?

 

 

You write in and get waived. 

 

 

 

 

you can write in and try to get it waived - got to love how MP does not have to do jury service but think money hardship not a reason not to do it.

 

 

 

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/97095141/financial-hardship-not-an-excuse-for-skipping-jury-duty-minister-says

 

 

 

 

Weren't that bunch also up until they got voted out, denying there was a housing crisis? Can we really trust what politicians say, as this report shows we do have a crisis http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11992960


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  Reply # 1956588 13-Feb-2018 20:30
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networkn:

 

 

Incidentally, a friend in the 'justice system'  told me that one way of assuring you will get off is by telling them you don't recognize the jurisdiction of the NZ courts . 

 

I don't know if he is correct or not, but he has sat through a large number of trials. 

 

 

Doesn't seem like that works :)

 

 

You would think that they would want to avoid the risk of having people in the jury room who might be disruptive or uncooperative. 


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  Reply # 1956641 13-Feb-2018 21:37
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The form I've got says

" If you do not show up for jury service, or you refuse or neglect to serve on a jury, you may be fined up to $1000 under the Juries Act 1981, or you may be arrested and taken to court for jury service."

So they can arrest you and throw you onto the Jury, seems they don't care how deciatated someone is, just they've got them there occupying a space.

My employer is not happy, and I don't have a clue what I'm doing, just got to go with flow.

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  Reply # 1956661 13-Feb-2018 22:14
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rugrat: The form I've got says

" If you do not show up for jury service, or you refuse or neglect to serve on a jury, you may be fined up to $1000 under the Juries Act 1981, or you may be arrested and taken to court for jury service."

So they can arrest you and throw you onto the Jury, seems they don't care how deciatated someone is, just they've got them there occupying a space.

My employer is not happy, and I don't have a clue what I'm doing, just got to go with flow.


If they arrest you and take you to court for jury service, how on earth would they ensure that you discharged that duty properly?

If I was the defence barrister, I'd make my first job having any such jurors dismissed.





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  Reply # 1956690 14-Feb-2018 00:46
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Geektastic:
rugrat: The form I've got says

" If you do not show up for jury service, or you refuse or neglect to serve on a jury, you may be fined up to $1000 under the Juries Act 1981, or you may be arrested and taken to court for jury service."

So they can arrest you and throw you onto the Jury, seems they don't care how deciatated someone is, just they've got them there occupying a space.

My employer is not happy, and I don't have a clue what I'm doing, just got to go with flow.


If they arrest you and take you to court for jury service, how on earth would they ensure that you discharged that duty properly?

If I was the defence barrister, I'd make my first job having any such jurors dismissed.

 

 

 

The fact that the barristers can chose the jury anyway IMO creates a bit of a bias. Some may want to avoid have someone in teh jury who is highly educated and inteligent. Although I am not 100% sure how they do select people out of the jurors who turn up, and what sort of questions they ask


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  Reply # 1956695 14-Feb-2018 01:18
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They don't ask questions.

 

 

Your name is called from the front of the room to sit in the chair, you start walking. The lawyers look at you and say "challenge" and thats it. They don't have to give a reason. It is a bit of a farce given how many challenges they get each.

 

 

For my one in the end it was a four day trial, total waste of everyone's time, as the person who was the victim obviously didn't even want to be there and the defense had already worked out a bargain.

 

 

But we still had to deliberate on the last charge.

 

 

12 Jurors, 8 of us followed the judges instruction. They give you a flow chart basically.

 

We then spent 6 hours convincing the other 4 that just because "he looks like he is a bit of a dick" is not a reason to send someone to prison for 5 years.

 

 

I wouldn't want to do it again. No one wanted to be there.

 

 


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  Reply # 1956696 14-Feb-2018 01:41
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Oldmanakbar: They don't ask questions. Your name is called from the front of the room to sit in the chair, you start walking. The lawyers look at you and say "challenge" and thats it. They don't have to give a reason. It is a bit of a farce given how many challenges they get each. For my one in the end it was a four day trial, total waste of everyone's time, as the person who was the victim obviously didn't even want to be there and the defense had already worked out a bargain. But we still had to deliberate on the last charge. 12 Jurors, 8 of us followed the judges instruction. They give you a flow chart basically. We then spent 6 hours convincing the other 4 that just because "he looks like he is a bit of a dick" is not a reason to send someone to prison for 5 years. I wouldn't want to do it again. No one wanted to be there.

 

In New Zealand, counsel for both the prosecution and defence have only four challenges without cause, and an unlimited number of challenges for cause (this changes slightly in trials with multiple defendants, where the Crown gets four peremptory challenges per accused).

 

The Juries Act 1981 provides for the jury pool list to be provided to counsel one week before the trial. This list contains all of the names of potential jurors, along with their date of birth, address, and occupation as listed on the electoral roll.

 

Jury vetting

 

Jury vetting in New Zealand has, in practice, been almost exclusively the domain of the Crown. In most jury trials, the Police vet the list of potential jurors in advance as a part of their duty to assist the Crown.

 

This information can include non-relevant criminal convictions, associations with known criminals, family ties, and other information contained in the Police’s vast intelligence database. While the Crown routinely has access to very private, closely guarded information, it does not appear that they look closely at publicly available information.

 

The fact that neither prosecutor nor defence counsel looks at publicly available information regarding potential jurors astounds many.

 

https://www.lawsociety.org.nz/lawtalk/lawtalk-archives/issue-867/jury-vetting-in-the-digital-age

 

 


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