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  #2004782 29-Apr-2018 22:51
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TonyR1973:

 

tdgeek:

 

Before I watch your video, who said EV users are evangelical and that cars are the only thing destroying the planet?

 

 

Well, I didn't say EV users and I didn't mention anything in relation to cars being the only thing 'destroying the planet' either.

 

 

EV evangelists that think they're saving the planet.

 

Seems a strong inference to me


gzt

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  #2004784 29-Apr-2018 23:03
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TonyR1973: Here's some numbers [snip]

I made it to halfway on double speed. Australia has different challenges to NZ. NZ generates almost all power with hydro. Aust said by this guy is 85% hydrocarbon.

Coincidentally Tesla batteries massively reduced spot prices in the Australian energy market and are poised to play a role in renewables.

 
 
 
 


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  #2004787 29-Apr-2018 23:12
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shk292:

 

tdgeek:

 

Before I watch your video, who said EV users are evangelical and that cars are the only thing destroying the planet?

 

 

There's certainly at least one evangelical EV user on this forum.

 

 

Lol, me? I don't have one. But I dont disregard a technology that could save me money, (after 50,000km is a general rule I see) and that will help the climate change issue. Many drops in a bucket will help fill the bucket. EV is one of many ways that will help. Or bury ones head in the sand.


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  #2004788 29-Apr-2018 23:15
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gzt:
TonyR1973: Here's some numbers [snip]

I made it to halfway on double speed. Australia has different challenges to NZ. NZ generates almost all power with hydro. Aust said by this guy is 85% hydrocarbon.

Coincidentally Tesla batteries massively reduced spot prices in the Australian energy market and are poised to play a role in renewables.

 

Only half way for me too. EV and solar are the way of the future.  


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  #2004805 30-Apr-2018 06:58
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tdgeek:

 

Batman:

 

MikeB4:

 

any move to alternatives like EVs in any meaningful numbers now or near future is next to impossible. There is not the range and stock of vehicles available. The charging infrastructure is still in its infancy and our power generation could not cope with even a modest increase. Our economy is mobility depedent so we have to stick with the status quo for sometime.

 

 

Glad you brought up our economy.

 

Our economy's top two big tickets -

 

Production + Export of Dairy/Meat

 

Tourism that requires people to fly 10,000-20,000 kms per way, and return after 10-20 days.

 

 

So, what are you saying? All these cause CO2 so therefore lets not worry about it ? ?

 

 

I'm saying it's complicated.





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


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  #2004811 30-Apr-2018 07:26
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tdgeek:

 

gzt:
TonyR1973: Here's some numbers [snip]

I made it to halfway on double speed. Australia has different challenges to NZ. NZ generates almost all power with hydro. Aust said by this guy is 85% hydrocarbon.

Coincidentally Tesla batteries massively reduced spot prices in the Australian energy market and are poised to play a role in renewables.

 

Only half way for me too. EV and solar are the way of the future.  

 

 

EV definitely has its uses. I want it for the acceleration the E-motor can generate.

 

In beijing, where air quality is one of the worst if not the worst in the world (can barely see 100m ahead), 48 hrs before the opening of their olympic games, the government decreed all the cars to stop driving and all the factories to stop operation. the air quality completely resolved. like 100% resolved! so for air quality's sake, that's a proven plus for me as a cyclist and pedestrian (i don't drive a lot).

 

but lithium mining on one hand to reverse CO2 while the other hand (lifestyle) is encouraging, buying, supporting CO2 emission - is ignorant at best, or hypocritical at worst.





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


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  #2004844 30-Apr-2018 08:57
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China is adding nearly a couple of thousand electric buses per week:

Bloomberg : The numbers are staggering. China had about 99 percent of the 385,000 electric buses on the roads worldwide in 2017, accounting for 17 percent of the country’s entire fleet. Every five weeks, Chinese cities add 9,500 of the zero-emissions transporters—the equivalent of London’s entire working fleet, according Bloomberg New Energy Finance. All this is starting to make an observable reduction in fuel demand. And because they consume 30 times more fuel than average sized cars, their impact on energy use so far has become much greater than the passenger sedans produced by companies from Tesla Inc. to Toyota Motor Corp.

Air quality has been a big driver for that. In relatively short time that will translate over to light and heavy transport vehicles.

 
 
 
 




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  #2004866 30-Apr-2018 09:45
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Technofreak: Should be good for the plant life.

To be honest I wouldn't take as gospel everything posted on that website. Many of the headlines read just like click bait. Even the article linked in the first post was lacking any substance as to what the numbers really mean.

 

Scientific American is one or the more reputable science mags and has been for decades.  

 

Besides.....410ppm of CO2 in the atmosphere is what it is no matter the source. 


 

 





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  #2004868 30-Apr-2018 09:49
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networkn:

 

Rikkitic:

 

But those SUVs are so cool. And public transport is so lame. And it sounds so sexy when I rev it. And the smell of leather and bass sounds pumping out the speakers make me feel important while I am stuck waiting in traffic. Surely my little old 6 litre oil burner won't make that much of a difference to the climate? It is just one vehicle. Why should I have to give up my comforts when everyone else has theirs? And so on.

 

 

Oh good grief! Stereotype much?!

 

 

Stereoypes are a funny thing. They aren't true for everyone, but they contain enough truth to be recognisable. It's a model, of sorts. How many attributes of this model apply to me? 

As for the specific comments......if we look through the many posts related to vehicles, we will find these comments littered among them. 

Models are useful. 





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  #2004873 30-Apr-2018 09:54
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Batman:

 

Linuxluver:

 

This isn't good. Sure...the full effects will take a decade or two to be realised....but it will be much like those videos of the Japanese tsunami in 2011.......at first an apparently small change....followed by a force that sweeps all before it. 

Amazing to think we were warned about this for over 30 years and we've been thoughtless and selfish and let it happen. 

...and it's still climbing. 

If we had any sense we'd at least park the dino-burners right now...and take a bus or ride a bike.....and eat less meat to reduce emissions from that sector. 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/we-just-breached-the-410-ppm-threshold-for-co2/

 

 

How many times do people need to understand, it is not the car that gives out all the CO2.

 

- the airplanes carrying tourists, relatives but mainly business people

 

- the sea cargo carrying your new TVs and new timber for your dinner table

 

- the air cargo carrying you new iphone, ipad, iwatch, imac, i junks

 

- factories producing your next ijunk, food, drinks - just look at the packaging they use for a start

 

- rockets sending old teslas to mars

 

- diplomatic travel

 

- the cows producing your beef and milk

 

- the hotels, restaurants, hospitals, any commercial undertaking (look at the stuff they buy and throw away)

 

- the bottomline - existence of people.*

 

*is there a graph comparing global population to this co2 rise?

 



An average car releases 2.2kg of carbon for each litre of petrol burned. Over a billion cars and trucks globally dwarf other transport emissions. 

Transport accounts for almost 20% of all emissions. It's being targeted as it's easier than telling cows to not fart. 

Have a google at the effect of population on emissions. You'll soon see it's the consumerist lifestyle we enjoy that maximises emissions. Population isn't the only factor. It's what the people do that also makes a big difference. 

Thake the moment to do the research. This issue has been around for 30 years minimum. Every day since has been an opportunity to take a few minutes to find out more. 





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  #2004907 30-Apr-2018 10:20
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Linuxluver:

 

Batman:

 

Linuxluver:

 

This isn't good. Sure...the full effects will take a decade or two to be realised....but it will be much like those videos of the Japanese tsunami in 2011.......at first an apparently small change....followed by a force that sweeps all before it. 

Amazing to think we were warned about this for over 30 years and we've been thoughtless and selfish and let it happen. 

...and it's still climbing. 

If we had any sense we'd at least park the dino-burners right now...and take a bus or ride a bike.....and eat less meat to reduce emissions from that sector. 

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/we-just-breached-the-410-ppm-threshold-for-co2/

 

 

How many times do people need to understand, it is not the car that gives out all the CO2.

 

- the airplanes carrying tourists, relatives but mainly business people

 

- the sea cargo carrying your new TVs and new timber for your dinner table

 

- the air cargo carrying you new iphone, ipad, iwatch, imac, i junks

 

- factories producing your next ijunk, food, drinks - just look at the packaging they use for a start

 

- rockets sending old teslas to mars

 

- diplomatic travel

 

- the cows producing your beef and milk

 

- the hotels, restaurants, hospitals, any commercial undertaking (look at the stuff they buy and throw away)

 

- the bottomline - existence of people.*

 

*is there a graph comparing global population to this co2 rise?

 



An average car releases 2.2kg of carbon for each litre of petrol burned. 

 

I can't follow that. A litre of fuel weighs about 800g of which I guess about 660g is carbon and most of the rest is hydrogen. Where is the extra ~1.4kg of carbon coming from?

 

 

 

 

 

 


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  #2004913 30-Apr-2018 10:27
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kryptonjohn:

 

Linuxluver:

 



An average car releases 2.2kg of carbon for each litre of petrol burned. 

 

I can't follow that. A litre of fuel weighs about 800g of which I guess about 660g is carbon and most of the rest is hydrogen. Where is the extra ~1.4kg of carbon coming from?

 

 

I assume a typo "carbon" instead of "CO2".


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  #2004919 30-Apr-2018 10:37
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Another problem is that the litre of fossil fuel contains (stored/chemical) about the same energy as about 50 kg of charged lithium ion battery, so even though most of that energy is wasted as heat, liquid fuels have a huge practical advantage for transport when the energy source needs to be carried. In a hypothetical electric air-liner, most of the stored energy would be "wasted" by the need to get the batteries up in the air and keep them there long enough to travel a useful distance. 


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  #2004923 30-Apr-2018 10:44
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Also... there's a significant amount of losses in both technologies but electricity has significant distribution losses in heat from the power lines etc plus losses at the generation and storage parts of the chain. Not so much an issue in NZ where most of it is generated from hydro etc but in other countries generating from coal, or in NZ if extra generation comes from coal(which clown cancelled gas exploration permits?) then there's going to be significant losses lost from burning coal.

 

 


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  #2004925 30-Apr-2018 10:53
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kryptonjohn:

 

Also... there's a significant amount of losses in both technologies but electricity has significant distribution losses in heat from the power lines etc plus losses at the generation and storage parts of the chain. Not so much an issue in NZ where most of it is generated from hydro etc but in other countries generating from coal, or in NZ if extra generation comes from coal(which clown cancelled gas exploration permits?) then there's going to be significant losses lost from burning coal.

 

 

There's not enough money being invested in fusion energy.

 

Given an unlimited clean energy source, liquid fuel for transport could even be produced by extracting CO2 from the air.

 

 


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