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  Reply # 2062023 25-Jul-2018 08:26
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The kid's 19 and made a huge mistake. Personally, I'm in favour of leniency and I think suspended sentences can work in these sort of cases. Not sure about discharge without conviction though.





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  Reply # 2062024 25-Jul-2018 08:44
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Dulouz:

 

The kid's 19 and made a huge mistake. Personally, I'm in favour of leniency and I think suspended sentences can work in these sort of cases. Not sure about discharge without conviction though.

 

 

Its a hard one. 19, did something silly. But 29 laptops, plus it seems HDD's, so well over $15,000, and breach of trust

 

I'd see 200 hours of Community Service, which is every Saturday and Sunday until completed. Full repayment back to the victim, and not the $5 per week variety. Has a car, that's taken and sold by the bailiff to begin finnacial restoration. He will have a conviction for theft, but no jail time, so that's too bad if he wants to travel, get a visa To Australia or the US. Police checks, tough, thats what they are there for.

 

200 hours, full repayment seems fair to me.


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  Reply # 2062048 25-Jul-2018 09:46
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I am torn. This is planned, premeditated and calculated over a long period of time. I think I'd like to see him lose his car, 200 hours of community service seems a pittance, so maybe 1000 hours, plus repay back in full. Nothing that stops him travelling. He goes onto probation for 5 years and any offenses subsequent see him get no leniancy for his second crime + he gets what he would have gotten the first time added on. 

 


This way, if this is a one-off act of thoughtless stupidity, his life isn't ruined, and if it's not, he didn't get off scot-free. 

 

 




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  Reply # 2062062 25-Jul-2018 10:02
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networkn:

 

I am torn. This is planned, premeditated and calculated over a long period of time. I think I'd like to see him lose his car, 200 hours of community service seems a pittance, so maybe 1000 hours, plus repay back in full. Nothing that stops him travelling. He goes onto probation for 5 years and any offenses subsequent see him get no leniancy for his second crime + he gets what he would have gotten the first time added on. 

 


This way, if this is a one-off act of thoughtless stupidity, his life isn't ruined, and if it's not, he didn't get off scot-free. 

 

 

 

 

I thought of a big CS as well, but I've never seen more than 200 hours. 200 hours at 16 hours per weekend is 3 months of no weekends. Maybe 6 months? 1000 is just over a year, yes, that's not unreasonable. Like a "jail-lite" sentence

 

Travel wont be affected, he would just have to get a visa, a non custodial record should not matter, they seem to draw the line at 12 months prison, even then you could still get one. If it was  3 laptops at once, silly as, but as you say, planned over time.


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  Reply # 2062064 25-Jul-2018 10:04
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I have to wonder how big a company needs to be to not notice 3 laptops going missing from stock.

 

 




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  Reply # 2062066 25-Jul-2018 10:05
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Plus full repayment is also a "fine" Its probably closer to $20,000 and he probably recieved 30%-40% of that so he is repaying what he stole plus the other 60%-70%, so a decent penalty there also




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  Reply # 2062069 25-Jul-2018 10:09
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networkn:

 

I have to wonder how big a company needs to be to not notice 3 laptops going missing from stock.

 

 

 

 

Over a year, it was just over 2 physically being removed per month. So a storeroom of computer stuff all over the place, even if tidy, not hard to not notice that. But he must have been doing the stocktakes, and adding the stolen ones in so they wont show up on the monthly P+L report


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  Reply # 2062328 25-Jul-2018 14:37
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200 hours for $30k of theft.  That's $150/hour.  I pay most of my contractors less than that and they are people with skills, qualifications and experience





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  Reply # 2062332 25-Jul-2018 14:40
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MikeAqua:

 

200 hours for $30k of theft.  That's $150/hour.  I pay most of my contractors less than that and they are people with skills, qualifications and experience

 

 

I agree, 200 hours is not even close to enough. If the alternative is jail, ask the kid how many hours he is prepared to do?

 

 


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  Reply # 2062339 25-Jul-2018 15:06
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One stolen laptop is a mistake and/or stuipd decision of youth. 30 of them plus other bits n pieces? Not so much

 

The sensible sentencing trust would have you believe we are far too soft on crime and we need to "punish" offenders.

 

Other groups argue that our current method of punishing and imprisoning has not worked and is why our jails are getting over populated. The same groups argue that our prisons have too many Maori / Pasifika in them so the justice system must be racially biased. 

 

Community service seems like a reasonable compromise so long as its monitored and administered the right way.

 

Home detention seems too much like a forced vacation. Sure, you have your "freedom" removed in that you can't just come and go as you please, but I can think of a lot worse places than home to be "locked in" for a given period.

 

I do believe however that there are those that are simply unworthy of continuing to use this earth's valuable resources and should simply be disposed of.


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  Reply # 2062342 25-Jul-2018 15:15
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While I understand that home detention is a very very long way from prison, when I lost my license and I couldn't drive, and lived outside the zones where buses were convenient, my life consisted of work, and being at home. For a month. I was climbing the walls after 10 days, I was beside myself after 21 days, and I was a freaking mess when my month expired. Not being able to leave the house at all, even if I had the internet, xbox, play station and netflix, would still be a punishment. Maybe not 30 laptops worth, but still not a pleasant experience.

 

 


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  Reply # 2062350 25-Jul-2018 15:33
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tdgeek:

Over a year, it was just over 2 physically being removed per month. So a storeroom of computer stuff all over the place, even if tidy, not hard to not notice that. But he must have been doing the stocktakes, and adding the stolen ones in so they wont show up on the monthly P+L report



That doesn't add up either. If he was still counting them as being present, the number of unsold secondhand laptops mounting up would be a red flag. Maybe they were on the books at such a low value that the owner didn't care.

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  Reply # 2062382 25-Jul-2018 16:03
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tdgeek:

 

A standard bike like mine, GSX 650, will stop better than a standard car. A better combination of weight, tyres and brakes. If the car was a sports car with a bit lighter weight, wide tyres, it will stop a bit better. 

 

 

I don't think so. 

 

2013 Toyota Camry 120 feet (40m) same as the newer ones

 

2017 GSXR 600 123 feet!! (40.6m)

 

 

 

NB Googling bike data is awkward. Seem the 100-0 brake distance is no longer popular. Plus nearly all cars have ABS which is brilliant, and only a handful of bikes do, though I think a lot BMW bikes seem to come with it. 




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  Reply # 2062391 25-Jul-2018 16:15
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Bung:
tdgeek:

Over a year, it was just over 2 physically being removed per month. So a storeroom of computer stuff all over the place, even if tidy, not hard to not notice that. But he must have been doing the stocktakes, and adding the stolen ones in so they wont show up on the monthly P+L report



That doesn't add up either. If he was still counting them as being present, the number of unsold secondhand laptops mounting up would be a red flag. Maybe they were on the books at such a low value that the owner didn't care.


I’d expect the unsold laptops are the ones in the storeroom. On those three shelves, about 20 of them. If it’s magically 18 who would know if they didn’t run an inventory system? I see the that with small businesses . I have a financial background, I would know the stock on hand at any tine. The physical stocktake I would reconcile but who would do that in a small business? Not too many

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  Reply # 2062394 25-Jul-2018 16:19
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400 hours community work is the maximum that can be given.

 

The maximum penalty is set by the charge.  In this case it appears he has been charged with 6 theft charges - 3 for hard drives at $150 each and 3 for laptops presumably at $550 each.

 

The hard drive charges will have a maximum of 3 months prison and the laptop charges will have a maximum of 1 year prison.

 

He has denied the other 26 laptops and there is obviously not enough evidence to charge him with that.  It appears he is not owning up to everything (which is not a surprise as he is clearly dishonest), just to what there is proof of, which is his right.

 

The reparation sought looks like it will be limited to $500 - the cash paid for the two laptops bought by friends in the sting (presuming that wasn't recovered).

 

The three hard drives and three laptops that he has been charged with stealing have been recovered so no reparation will be payable for that.

 

I would like to think a s106 application in this instance would not be successful, but there's a balancing test to be explored - details in sections 106 and 107 of the Sentencing Act 2002.

 

The business owner will not get anything else out of this unless an emotional harm reparation payment is agreed.

 

The reality is this thieving individual will get a slap with a wet bus ticket if he does get convicted.


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