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gzt

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  Reply # 2067785 3-Aug-2018 20:41
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Compulsory statistics survey: Would you participate or is it an intrusion?

It would not bother me. It is confidential anyway. I'm more annoyed at banks and other random institutions and their silly information demands tbh. This one would be time demanding tho and that would be annoying until I got over it..

gzt

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  Reply # 2067787 3-Aug-2018 20:42
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Geektastic: Why can't they move it to an online format so people can complete it when it suits?

Because they would be never? : )

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  Reply # 2067790 3-Aug-2018 21:03
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lapimate:

Geektastic: They can't access our property unless they trespass …


When under NZ law did it become "trespass" to approach someone's front door with an innocent purpose? I think not.



You can't approach our front door unless you breach the gates or climb the fence. The gates are electronic and cannot be manually opened.

A front door with no restrictions is an implied licence to approach. Restrictions revoke that licence implication.





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  Reply # 2067818 3-Aug-2018 22:09
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gzt:
Geektastic: Why can't they move it to an online format so people can complete it when it suits?

Because they would be never? : )


It works for the Census.





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  Reply # 2067828 3-Aug-2018 22:55
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Geektastic:
lapimate:

 

Geektastic: They can't access our property unless they trespass …

 

 

 

When under NZ law did it become "trespass" to approach someone's front door with an innocent purpose? I think not.

 



You can't approach our front door unless you breach the gates or climb the fence. The gates are electronic and cannot be manually opened.

A front door with no restrictions is an implied licence to approach. Restrictions revoke that licence implication.

 

In NZ they're not "trespassing" if they climb the fence.  Only if you after you warn them verbally or with a formal trespass notice, and they refuse to leave or come back, harm stock, leave an open gate closed or a closed gate open etc.


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  Reply # 2067831 3-Aug-2018 23:17
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Fred99:

Geektastic:
lapimate:


Geektastic: They can't access our property unless they trespass …


 


When under NZ law did it become "trespass" to approach someone's front door with an innocent purpose? I think not.




You can't approach our front door unless you breach the gates or climb the fence. The gates are electronic and cannot be manually opened.

A front door with no restrictions is an implied licence to approach. Restrictions revoke that licence implication.


In NZ they're not "trespassing" if they climb the fence.  Only if you after you warn them verbally or with a formal trespass notice, and they refuse to leave or come back, harm stock, leave an open gate closed or a closed gate open etc.



Can you warn them before they commit the trespass, for example by notice at the boundary?

And are they liable for damage caused in gaining entry (notwithstanding those exercising statutory powers for example in responding to an emergency etc)?

This is among the writing on the subject I found

"Should a person enter private property if there is a sign saying "DO NOT ENTER" ?
Occupiers of private property are not under any obligation to make their property available in the ways described above. They are able to revoke the implied licence to enter. This could be done in a number of ways including putting up signs that say "do not enter" or by locking the gate to the property. If the occupier of a private property has revoked the implied licence to enter, ANYBODY (excluding an official with special authority) who does enter may be considered a trespasser (they may be on the property unlawfully)."





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  Reply # 2067924 4-Aug-2018 10:21
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Geektastic:
gzt:
Geektastic: Why can't they move it to an online format so people can complete it when it suits?

Because they would be never? : )


It works for the Census.


Worked but not well. The 2018 Census had lowest participation rate of last 5 Censuses. Regarded as a shambles

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  Reply # 2067935 4-Aug-2018 11:31
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TL;DR - Please please please do the surveys, they are incredibly valuable and Statistics New Zealand really does value the time and effort it takes respondents to complete them.

 

 

 

I may be unique in this thread in that I've been luck enough to actually use Statistics New Zealand (SNZ) micro-data for research projects (particularly HLFS) and collaborated very closely in the past, as an academic, with those who design, administer and maintain these surveys.  I for one am really appreciative of everyone who takes the time to complete their surveys and census, as are those who work at SNZ.

 

I know first hand that SNZ treats its ability to compel people into completing their surveys with the upmost of respect.  They genuinely believe that having such authority is a real privilege and it absolutely shapes their sense of responsibility to the respondents in return.  I would go so far as to say it's a part of their culture, almost a badge of honour.  I know of surveys that have been heavily modified, or had what would be really valuable questions straight out removed, in order to limit the burden on respondents.

 

As part of this social contract, any researcher who has collaborated with SNZ will know they are incredibly protective of their data, and treat its security as paramount.  The process to even get micro-data access to the data is lengthy and stringent, and then what you can even do with it is even more locked down.  It makes working with the data that much harder, but completely reasonable and understandable. They are also very good at reinforcing that they will happily throw the book at you if you breach the declaration of secrecy that you have to sign.


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  Reply # 2067960 4-Aug-2018 12:47
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k1wi:

 

TL;DR - Please please please do the surveys, they are incredibly valuable and Statistics New Zealand really does value the time and effort it takes respondents to complete them.

 

 

 

I may be unique in this thread in that I've been luck enough to actually use Statistics New Zealand (SNZ) micro-data for research projects (particularly HLFS) and collaborated very closely in the past, as an academic, with those who design, administer and maintain these surveys.  I for one am really appreciative of everyone who takes the time to complete their surveys and census, as are those who work at SNZ.

 

I know first hand that SNZ treats its ability to compel people into completing their surveys with the upmost of respect.  They genuinely believe that having such authority is a real privilege and it absolutely shapes their sense of responsibility to the respondents in return.  I would go so far as to say it's a part of their culture, almost a badge of honour.  I know of surveys that have been heavily modified, or had what would be really valuable questions straight out removed, in order to limit the burden on respondents.

 

As part of this social contract, any researcher who has collaborated with SNZ will know they are incredibly protective of their data, and treat its security as paramount.  The process to even get micro-data access to the data is lengthy and stringent, and then what you can even do with it is even more locked down.  It makes working with the data that much harder, but completely reasonable and understandable. They are also very good at reinforcing that they will happily throw the book at you if you breach the declaration of secrecy that you have to sign.

 

 

Totally agree with this post. 

 

It would be a good gesture from Stats to give the recipients a grocery voucher lets say $100 to complete the survery. 


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  Reply # 2067961 4-Aug-2018 12:49
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Bung:
Geektastic:
gzt:
Geektastic: Why can't they move it to an online format so people can complete it when it suits?

Because they would be never? : )


It works for the Census.


Worked but not well. The 2018 Census had lowest participation rate of last 5 Censuses. Regarded as a shambles


Ah ok. Didn't know that.





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  Reply # 2067962 4-Aug-2018 12:52
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MikeB4:

 

alasta:

 

It seems strange that they won't disclose the exact nature of the questions until the interviewer visits. I would have thought it would be reasonable to expect that the participant should be given a list of questions in advance so that they can judge whether they consider them to be unreasonably invasive and, if so, seek legal advice on exactly what they're obligated to disclose. 

 

 

One does not need legal advice to answer these surveys. 

 

 

I'll judge that for myself, thanks very much.

 

All citizens have a reasonable expectation of the opportunity to seek legal advice when threatened with fines or imprisonment by a government agency. 


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  Reply # 2067969 4-Aug-2018 13:40
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alasta:

 

MikeB4:

 

alasta:

 

It seems strange that they won't disclose the exact nature of the questions until the interviewer visits. I would have thought it would be reasonable to expect that the participant should be given a list of questions in advance so that they can judge whether they consider them to be unreasonably invasive and, if so, seek legal advice on exactly what they're obligated to disclose. 

 

 

One does not need legal advice to answer these surveys. 

 

 

I'll judge that for myself, thanks very much.

 

All citizens have a reasonable expectation of the opportunity to seek legal advice when threatened with fines or imprisonment by a government agency. 

 

 

We did a household census for around five years the only issue we had was they wanted to continue interview our son who was in the field doing pre-deployment training. It took awhile to convince the lady it was impossible unless she was prepared to go kilometers into the wilderness of Waiouru .

 

As for the questions asked you would have to give a lot more information when applying for a mortgage or a job 





Mike
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 It's our only home, lets clean it up then...

 

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Glurp
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  Reply # 2067980 4-Aug-2018 14:17
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You can choose whether to apply for a mortgage or a particular job. You can't choose this.

 

 





I reject your reality and substitute my own. - Adam Savage
 


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  Reply # 2067981 4-Aug-2018 14:23
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My last Job interview (successful) was less than 20 mins, and my CV details what I have done in my working career, NOT where I spend my money or how much I may have saved.

My last mortgage application took 1 hour, and definitely did want to know how much I earned and what assets I had available to service the debt with. Fair enough, I’m asking for half a million dollars and you need to know I’ll pay it back...

Neither of these came close to “2-3hours” and neither wanted me to prove my every statement with receipts from the last year, or preclude my lawyer going over the information they desired/required.

Bad analogy!

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  Reply # 2067982 4-Aug-2018 14:24
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If the questions aren't excessively invasive then I wouldn't have a problem with it - unfortunately we don't know whether this is the case because the questions don't appear to be widely known.

 

For a few years now I have been participating in the NZ Attitudes and Values Study which is run by the department of psychology at the University of Auckland. Some of the questions are quite blunt but not particularly personal in nature - e.g. rating on a scale of 1 to 10 statements like 'I feel warmth towards Asians' or 'people should stop blaming others for their problems'. I have found it really interesting to engage with.

 

The only question in that study that I have refused to answer is one about 'sexual orientation', partly because it seems excessively personal, and partly because I don't really understand all that new age gobbledygook. 


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