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357 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 2126975 15-Nov-2018 09:24
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You know what else is a powered vehicle? A regular scooter with the force of gravity acting on it.

 

 

Seriously, these things are already low power and you want to enforce a speed regulation? If you did this nobody would use them.

5369 posts

Uber Geek
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  Reply # 2126990 15-Nov-2018 09:46
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Having spent a couple of days in the Auckland CBD this week, I have to say most lime users appear to be responsible.  There are about 10% who pass very close to people at high speed.  It's an annoying and unsafe behaviour, but very much the exception from what I saw.





Mike

 
 
 
 


347 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 2127074 15-Nov-2018 10:43
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SpartanVXL: You know what else is a powered vehicle? A regular scooter with the force of gravity acting on it. Seriously, these things are already low power and you want to enforce a speed regulation? If you did this nobody would use them.

 

10Km/H - the average runner would run faster than that too. Perhaps they should regulate runners more too?


34 posts

Geek
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  Reply # 2127137 15-Nov-2018 12:32
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I’ve been taking advantage of the Lime $100 free credit promo to test out the e-scooters as an alternative commute option for the past fortnight. Normal commute is a $1.90 each way bus fare that takes 20-25mins to travel 6 ks.

 

Timewise, (assuming I can locate an available scooter) I can be home more or less the same time it takes to ride the bus. I’m a touch paranoid (no helmet) so average speed is usually 15-20kph, lower when on the footpaths .  

 

Pricewise – the hire option doesn’t stack up at all, $9-$10 roughly for each trip means the bus fare is far more economical. OTOH outright purchase is very compelling - $599 for the Mi Scooter recently vs annual bus fares of approx $900. The scooter pays for itself in 9 months.  

 

Thoughts on Limes in particular: Decent build, wish handlebar height was adjustable. I hear Gen3 scooters on the way so will be interested to see any improvements. Suspension would be nice – a prolonged trip on the footpath is an education as to the poor state of Auckland paths!

 

Around Newmarket where I work they are extremely popular and hard to find after 4pm which is annoyingly right when I’m trying to find one. I wish midday juicers could respond better to demand and do a mass “serve” of fresh limes to business districts for the 4-5pm rush. As I type this my Lime app is detecting over 25 Scooters within easy walking distance. Yesterday @4:30pm there were just 2 and as I scanned my one another user came running up and couldn’t help herself from fist pumping in relief as she saw the other one was available.

 

Also notable is the many times I have seen local schoolkids riding them for a lark (often in tandem) and I would support moves to better restrict usage. However I foresee a drop off as everyone’s free ride promo codes start expiring.

 

Thoughts on e-scooters in particular:

 

It’s a new paradigm and as usual the various aspects of society have to grapple with all the implications. I agree with the majority of commenters opposing any heavy regulation and I believe we all have to do a bit of re-alignment in our attitudes and behaviour.   

 

For me it’s back to defensive driving lessons all the way. Hazard ID and anticipation goes a long way – along with basic courtesy of course. Auckland drivers have always made me fearful of cycling to work so were I make scooting my regular commute then I would definitely wear a helmet. It’s also hard to make do without a rear vision mirror when in a car you are so conditioned to using one. So that’s another after-market safety enhancement I’d fork out for. I see the new rollout of Kwikli e-mopeds on the Shore includes trunks with helmets, high-vis vests and hygiene caps so I’m not alone in that direction of thinking.

 

And now also I see the city council has kicked-off a 10K safety campaign and will be making a submission to the Transport Ministry by the end of the week, pushing for greater controls on e-scooters. So definitely a wait and see approach before I make a decision on whether to buy or not.

 

But all in all I’m enjoying the experience so far – hope I come out of it intact!


64 posts

Master Geek
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  Reply # 2127218 15-Nov-2018 14:29
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Geektastic:
smcc:

 

Geektastic: Story in the London Times today:

"Parents have been warned by police not to buy electric scooters as Christmas presents after a 15-year-old boy had points imposed on his future driving licence for using one at high speeds.

The scooters are illegal on roads and pavements. The boy, who was caught riding in a public place on a stand-up scooter with a powerful electric motor, appeared at Teesside youth court, which imposed six points on his licence as a deterrent."

Note - in New Zealand terms, six points equals fifty points.

 

 

 

This is interesting but not relevant here. The laws in the UK are different and e scooters are not legal on public roads or footpaths, this is not the case in NZ.

 



Yet.

 

 

 

You are right, YET.

 

I see that the nanny state (actually council) are already creating over reactive regulations which will probably remain in place for years to come without any reliable evidence based assessment. Therefore from a H&S point of view it will be almost impossible for any future council to remove the restrictions put in place (if they don't actually increase safety for compliant users).

 

 

 

Edit: Spelling/Typing


14578 posts

Uber Geek
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  Reply # 2127219 15-Nov-2018 14:29
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SheriffNZ:

 

SpartanVXL: You know what else is a powered vehicle? A regular scooter with the force of gravity acting on it. Seriously, these things are already low power and you want to enforce a speed regulation? If you did this nobody would use them.

 

10Km/H - the average runner would run faster than that too. Perhaps they should regulate runners more too?

 

 

 

 

Actually jogging is around 10km/hr, so it would be about the same speed. But also people jogging are potentially in far more control, as you can generally stop fairly instantly if you had to avoid someone.


347 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 95


  Reply # 2127230 15-Nov-2018 14:40
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mattwnz:

 

SheriffNZ:

 

SpartanVXL: You know what else is a powered vehicle? A regular scooter with the force of gravity acting on it. Seriously, these things are already low power and you want to enforce a speed regulation? If you did this nobody would use them.

 

10Km/H - the average runner would run faster than that too. Perhaps they should regulate runners more too?

 

 

 

 

Actually jogging is around 10km/hr, so it would be about the same speed. But also people jogging are potentially in far more control, as you can generally stop fairly instantly if you had to avoid someone.

 

 

 

 

I consider myself an average running and I run at about 11.5km/hr but I take your point on the control issue.


357 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 132


  Reply # 2127236 15-Nov-2018 14:51
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mattwnz:

SheriffNZ:

 

SpartanVXL: You know what else is a powered vehicle? A regular scooter with the force of gravity acting on it. Seriously, these things are already low power and you want to enforce a speed regulation? If you did this nobody would use them.

 

10Km/H - the average runner would run faster than that too. Perhaps they should regulate runners more too?

 

 

 

 

Actually jogging is around 10km/hr, so it would be about the same speed. But also people jogging are potentially in far more control, as you can generally stop fairly instantly if you had to avoid someone.

 

 

I was on one recently going around 15 km/h. I'm big enough that if I needed to at that speed I could hop off, stop myself while also picking up the scooter so that it wouldn't run off.

 

 

Not that everyone would be able to do that, there does need to be safety education just like driving. People who do stupid things will end up with consequences.

 

 

I do wonder if there will be a study on bad drivers and how they handle scooters/bikes.

12418 posts

Uber Geek
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  Reply # 2127855 16-Nov-2018 11:23
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ShiroHagen:

 

I’ve been taking advantage of the Lime $100 free credit promo to test out the e-scooters as an alternative commute option for the past fortnight. Normal commute is a $1.90 each way bus fare that takes 20-25mins to travel 6 ks.

 

Timewise, (assuming I can locate an available scooter) I can be home more or less the same time it takes to ride the bus. I’m a touch paranoid (no helmet) so average speed is usually 15-20kph, lower when on the footpaths .  

 

Pricewise – the hire option doesn’t stack up at all, $9-$10 roughly for each trip means the bus fare is far more economical. OTOH outright purchase is very compelling - $599 for the Mi Scooter recently vs annual bus fares of approx $900. The scooter pays for itself in 9 months.  

 

Thoughts on Limes in particular: Decent build, wish handlebar height was adjustable. I hear Gen3 scooters on the way so will be interested to see any improvements. Suspension would be nice – a prolonged trip on the footpath is an education as to the poor state of Auckland paths!

 

Around Newmarket where I work they are extremely popular and hard to find after 4pm which is annoyingly right when I’m trying to find one. I wish midday juicers could respond better to demand and do a mass “serve” of fresh limes to business districts for the 4-5pm rush. As I type this my Lime app is detecting over 25 Scooters within easy walking distance. Yesterday @4:30pm there were just 2 and as I scanned my one another user came running up and couldn’t help herself from fist pumping in relief as she saw the other one was available.

 

Also notable is the many times I have seen local schoolkids riding them for a lark (often in tandem) and I would support moves to better restrict usage. However I foresee a drop off as everyone’s free ride promo codes start expiring.

 

Thoughts on e-scooters in particular:

 

It’s a new paradigm and as usual the various aspects of society have to grapple with all the implications. I agree with the majority of commenters opposing any heavy regulation and I believe we all have to do a bit of re-alignment in our attitudes and behaviour.   

 

For me it’s back to defensive driving lessons all the way. Hazard ID and anticipation goes a long way – along with basic courtesy of course. Auckland drivers have always made me fearful of cycling to work so were I make scooting my regular commute then I would definitely wear a helmet. It’s also hard to make do without a rear vision mirror when in a car you are so conditioned to using one. So that’s another after-market safety enhancement I’d fork out for. I see the new rollout of Kwikli e-mopeds on the Shore includes trunks with helmets, high-vis vests and hygiene caps so I’m not alone in that direction of thinking.

 

And now also I see the city council has kicked-off a 10K safety campaign and will be making a submission to the Transport Ministry by the end of the week, pushing for greater controls on e-scooters. So definitely a wait and see approach before I make a decision on whether to buy or not.

 

But all in all I’m enjoying the experience so far – hope I come out of it intact!

 

 

 

 

I agree re-alignment is needed, but based on driving standards, New Zealand has yet to master the car, never mind the e-scooter!






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  Reply # 2127879 16-Nov-2018 12:08
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Geektastic:

 

 

 

I agree re-alignment is needed, but based on driving standards, New Zealand has yet to master the car, never mind the e-scooter!

 

 

New Zealand has mastered the car but there is an element in our society and probably in most societies that believe the rules do not apply to them, E.G reference use of cellphones in vehicles. They also believe that the roads are theirs to do on what they please.  This applies not only motor vehicle drivers but cyclists, skate boarders, scooter riders and pedestrians.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

 Mac user, Windows curser, Chrome OS desired.

 

A Tiger in Africa, probably escaped from the Zoo.

 

 


bmt

469 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 153


  Reply # 2128157 16-Nov-2018 20:21
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Hit 33.1kph riding a Lime down my street yesterday ;)

 

Anyway, Auckland Council's moves on Limes really demonstrates what a bunch of old fuddies we have on the council. Millennials are the biggest demographic now (at least in Australia..), so time for the boomers to either get with the times or jog on.  


2 posts

Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 2128160 16-Nov-2018 20:33
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bmt:

 

Hit 33.1kph riding a Lime down my street yesterday ;)

 

Anyway, Auckland Council's moves on Limes really demonstrates what a bunch of old fuddies we have on the council. Millennials are the biggest demographic now (at least in Australia..), so time for the boomers to either get with the times or jog on.  

 

 

 

 

37KPH down parnell rise. 


2572 posts

Uber Geek
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  Reply # 2128164 16-Nov-2018 20:48
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Until you hit a bump and go flying!




2990 posts

Uber Geek
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  Reply # 2128184 16-Nov-2018 21:12
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It really is a tricky one. And I can see why everyone is busy in the background at the local councils trying to work out the best approach to manage the usage of them and keep within the lines of the current laws without pushing the central government hand. The popularity is no doubt got them going 'how can we scam a slice of the fees off them. While not being finger pointed at if something goes wrong...'

 

Until now, we've been comfortable with little kids ripping around the footpath with a foot scooter (remember the christmas they become a fad and every shop was selling them!) I don't believe there has been any special changes to legislation for those?. And any adults using them were limited to the same speed and usually had better spatial awareness/sense. 

 

They never went fast enough to be of a concern.
Not a bike so helmets aren't mandatory (but suggested)
Wheel size is below minimum requirements that count it as a moped

 

Now we have a rocket powered one that kids (outside the non legislative rental agreement only) are using to go as fast as possible for the thrill 'cause they can' and as we have found, at times ended badly and made media due to being still 'new' to NZ

 

Same small wheel sizes. Lower power than stipulations in current legislation cover, but because they aren't under any chargable 'do/do not' specifics there's nothing stopping them being helmeted, off the road/off the footpaths. The only thing they seem to not be allowed on is designated cycle lanes due to the concise role description for those.

 

The only change I can see steering the way forward, was in Sept to classify them clearly as NOT a motor vehicle and allow the deployment?. And some guidelines to operate in a careful and considerate manner.. well. That's about as effective as the Conditions of use noone bothers to adhere to.

 

https://www.nzta.govt.nz/vehicles/vehicle-types/low-powered-vehicles/ 

 

wheels must not exceed 355mm and the motor must have a maximum power output not exceeding 300W.

 

E-scooters can be used on the footpath or the road – except in designated cycle lanes that are part of the road (which were designed for the sole use of cyclists).


1 post

Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 2128343 17-Nov-2018 10:06
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Handsomedan:

 

Long story short, I rented it and me and the kids went for a blat around the neighbourhood at high speed (me still dressed in a suit) and we had a blast - mostly for free, as I had found a bunch of codes online to add credit. All up it ended up costing me just over $2.00 of my own money and we had it for a good while.

 

 

I can only find the original codes where you get $3 off someone else's referral.  Any ideas of where else to look for codes?


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