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12 posts

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  # 2250917 4-Jun-2019 10:21
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Sadly, 30 years it has been. Nothing changed. Not much, at least. 


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  # 2250918 4-Jun-2019 10:23
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DarthKermit:

 

If the protesters then had the communications tech available now, I wonder if the crackdown would have been as effective?

 

 

 

 

I guess you never heard Chinese Internet Censorship mate. 


 
 
 
 


zyo

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  # 2250940 4-Jun-2019 10:50
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shk292:

 

To me, this thread is important reading for those who claim that the US and China are as bad as each other when it comes to surveillance, human rights, freedom of speech etc - as we saw in the Huawei thread and elsewhere.

 

 

 

 

As sad as it is, I have to say the Chinese government only demonstrates its brutality towards its own citizens. US on the other hand does that towards other sovereign countries.


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  # 2250943 4-Jun-2019 10:54
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The Tibetans might have something to say about that.

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


zyo

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  # 2250948 4-Jun-2019 10:56
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Rikkitic:

 

The Tibetans might have something to say about that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Tibet has been under Chinese rule since Qing Dynasty. 

 

 

 

The map of China would look vastly different if you believe Tibet is a sovereign country.


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  # 2250963 4-Jun-2019 11:13
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@zyo @rikkitic stay on topic please.  


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  # 2250965 4-Jun-2019 11:17
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The Last Emperor may have ruled Tibet in 1912, but the PRC didn't until it invaded in 1950. You can call them technically part of China if you like, but they fought like hell not to be. They are culturally, linguistically, and ethnically non-Chinese and I think most Tibetans would probably regard themselves as a conquered country, not a Chinese province.

 

Here is some history of the region.





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


 
 
 
 


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  # 2250967 4-Jun-2019 11:22
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gehenna:

 

@zyo @rikkitic stay on topic please.  

 

 

Sorry, cross-posted. On topic, the PRC has shown itself to be brutal to anyone, foreign or domestic, who challenges their authority. I don't think there is any question of that.

 

What surprises me is that no Chinese trolls have shown up here yet. They are usually pretty quick to respond to anything they disapprove of.

 

 

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


zyo

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  # 2250969 4-Jun-2019 11:25
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Rikkitic:

 

The Last Emperor may have ruled Tibet in 1912, but the PRC didn't until it invaded in 1950. You can call them technically part of China if you like, but they fought like hell not to be. They are culturally, linguistically, and ethnically non-Chinese and I think most Tibetans would probably regard themselves as a conquered country, not a Chinese province.

 

Here is some history of the region.

 

 

 

 

Maori/Native Americans can fit the same description, but I dont see anyone jump up and down trying to label their land as sovereign country.

 

 

 

We just gonna have to agree to disagree.

 

 


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  # 2250995 4-Jun-2019 11:41
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@rikkitic @zyo last warning, stay on topic or start your own thread please.  

 

freitasm: This thread is about the human spirit.

If I wanted otherwise I would have posted in the Politics sub-forum.


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  # 2251005 4-Jun-2019 11:54
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zyo:

 

Rikkitic:

 

The Last Emperor may have ruled Tibet in 1912, but the PRC didn't until it invaded in 1950. You can call them technically part of China if you like, but they fought like hell not to be. They are culturally, linguistically, and ethnically non-Chinese and I think most Tibetans would probably regard themselves as a conquered country, not a Chinese province.

 

Here is some history of the region.

 

 

 

 

Maori/Native Americans can fit the same description, but I dont see anyone jump up and down trying to label their land as sovereign country.

 

 

 

We just gonna have to agree to disagree.

 

 

 

 

Worse perhaps, is that unlike "tank man", peaceful protesters from such groups often seem to receive condemnation and disdain from the majority.
I don't think we - and particularly minorities - (in the democratic west) are as "free" as we'd like to think we are, even if it beats the alternative.


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  # 2251043 4-Jun-2019 12:17
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I don't think anyone is trying to make that argument. Native Americans in particular are still stomped on whenever they try to raise their voice (as with the oil pipeline), even though it has become fashionable to claim to be one, and even though the Indian Nations are officially recognised by the USA as sovereign, in spite of what some may think.

 

The point about tank man, and China, is that dissent is not tolerated there, while in the west we still have some freedom. His example serves as a powerful counterpoint to that condemnation and disdain.

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


zyo

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  # 2251075 4-Jun-2019 12:38
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Tank man reminds me of this lady.

 

 

 

 

Both are peacefully opposing their tyranny government for its wrong doings and both were prosecuted (although unclear what happened in the case of tank man). 

 

Both are examples of human rights abuse and you don't get to arbitrarily decide who comes out on top.


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  # 2251086 4-Jun-2019 12:52
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Dingbatt: This made me think about the images from history seared into my brain. Mostly televisual ones.
Neil Armstrong's "Small Step"
Berlin Wall coming down
Vietnamese girl running along a road after a napalm attack
Tiananmen Square
World Trade Center Collapse.
The Asian Tsunami.
I'm sure the longer I think, the more will appear. But I also wonder if the internet generation's memory will be of "Charlie bit my finger!" instead.

 

The internet generation will probably remember King's Landing as the big disaster of their lifetime.

 

To add to your list

 

Mount St Helen

 

Japan Tsunami

 

911

 

One Australia cracking in half and sinking off San Diego





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  # 2251105 4-Jun-2019 13:18
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zyo:

 

Tank man reminds me of this lady.

 

Both are peacefully opposing their tyranny government for its wrong doings and both were prosecuted (although unclear what happened in the case of tank man). 

 

Both are examples of human rights abuse and you don't get to arbitrarily decide who comes out on top.

 

 

The difference being that the media in west highlights this and is free to do so without an censorship or persecution. China bans free press including YouTube, Facebook, Google etc because of censorship. China does not releases public information of execution it carries out every year while the West does and a lot of the cases are highlighted. There is no government social credit to worry about to deny you buying a ticket to bus, train, plane, get a mortgage etc. There are no government setup camps in west that kidnap it's own citizens of a specific religion and 'brainwash' them to follow a government manifesto.  The west does comes out on top and by a very clear and long mile.





Do whatever you want to do man.

  

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