Impossible burger and other alternative plant based "meats"

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blackjack17

1625 posts

Uber Geek

#2894952 31-Mar-2022 20:12

PolicyGuy:

blackjack17:

They were $9 for a two pack on Tuesday which was equivalent with the first light patties.

They do need to bring the price down but I guess they need to start some where. The technology behind it is pretty cool and is scalable so the next 5 or so years will be interesting.

~$40/kg - a bargain ... not

If all these clever vegetable products use so much less of everything as inputs, how come they're between 50% and 100% more expensive than up-market real-meat equivalents?
Looking on Countdown's web-site, you could spend as much as $30/kg for venison patties or $35/kg for Wagu beef patties, but around $20/kg will get you Angus beef patties.
"Cheap" (by Countdown standards) BBQ patties are around $11.50/kg

So, being good for the planet and good for your diet is fine for rich folks but out of reach for poor folks, then.
And we wonder why we have big health disparities.
Sigh

This doesn't seem quite fair. It is a cutting edge technological break through. They have inserted genes from a soy plant into a fungus and replicated the taste, texture and sight of meat. Sure it isn't cheap but it is a similar price as salmon. The patent holders have a huge amount of R&D to recover and capital to be able to scale up. These products will only get cheaper over time, while animal products will go up in price.

Blaming the price of products like this for health issues is like blaming the price of tesla Xs for carbon emissions.

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MikeAqua

7616 posts

Uber Geek

#2895115 1-Apr-2022 09:16

It's a big food con. Same old highly processed food, lots of sodium. Transgenic GMO (some products). Mostly replacing offcuts, not prime cuts (greenwashing). Some essential amino acid deficiencies depending on the product, and especially for small kids.

If I wanted a vego meal, I'd rather have dahl or peas-rice.

Mike

blackjack17

1625 posts

Uber Geek

#2895140 1-Apr-2022 10:01

MikeAqua:

It's a big food con. Same old highly processed food, lots of sodium. Transgenic GMO (some products). Mostly replacing offcuts, not prime cuts (greenwashing). Some essential amino acid deficiencies depending on the product, and especially for small kids.

If I wanted a vego meal, I'd rather have dahl or peas-rice.

Yes it is higher in sodium, but for most people excess sodium is not an issue as you will pee it out.

Transgenic products, most imported foods will contain some GMO foods.

Not sure why replacing offcuts is greenwashing, it is designed to replace mince or sausages, not designed to replace steak.

Is higher in some nutrients and lower in others.

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/impossible-burger#nutrition

The simple fact is the current meat farming / consumption system is unsustainable esp. as global population increases. There will always be room for the higher end naturally grown steaks but at the lower end of the market such as mince and sausage market if you can sub in plant based material with no difference in taste and potentially lower in cost then why wouldn't you?

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jonathan18

6996 posts

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#2895151 1-Apr-2022 10:21

MikeAqua:

If I wanted a vego meal, I'd rather have dahl or peas-rice.

That's great and, personally, I agree, though I'm a f/t vegetarian; I generally prefer to get my protein more directly via beans etc, or less-processed means like tofu.

But, as already covered in this thread, this kind of product is not aimed at you or me. Going by my impression that a high (though slowly shrinking) proportion of NZErs think it's not a real meal without meat, then if 'fake meat' can help that shift to reduced meat consumption that's great.

Yep, it's expensive at the moment, but that will inevitably drop; also, it'll hopefully interest people in the more natural approach to vegetarian/vegan cooking - which is typically way cheaper than buying real or fake meat, especially if one buys the raw ingredients (eg dry pulses instead of cooked and canned).

It'll also be interesting to see if/when lab-grown meat gets to the point of being commercially viable (and whether there'll be much of a market for it, while the 'real' thing is still widely available). That creeps me out even more than the realistic fake meats!

MikeAqua

7616 posts

Uber Geek

#2895213 1-Apr-2022 10:38

blackjack17:

Not sure why replacing offcuts is greenwashing, it is designed to replace mince or sausages, not designed to replace steak.

If you can't sell mince because people are buying fake stuff, you just turn the offcuts into animal food or fertiliser. You raise the same number of cattle and produce the same amount of methane but the product cascade changes. Meanwhile you've turned a whole lot of nutritious, cheap soy beans into expensive highly processed food. Personally I'd prefer a bowl of edamame to a fake burger made from soy.

And BTW on the subject of sodium NZ has a massive problem coming with the diabetes/blood pressure/kidney complex, principally driven by processed food. Sodium will become very relevant to a large number of people.

One thing I'll give impossible credit for: almost no sugar. Lots of manufacturers use caramel to simulate meat like flavours - it's often in beef stock for example (along with a lot of salt).

Mike

MikeAqua

7616 posts

Uber Geek

#2895217 1-Apr-2022 10:47

jonathan18:

But, as already covered in this thread, this kind of product is not aimed at you or me. Going by my impression that a high (though slowly shrinking) proportion of NZErs think it's not a real meal without meat, then if 'fake meat' can help that shift to reduced meat consumption that's great.

Yep, it's expensive at the moment, but that will inevitably drop; also, it'll hopefully interest people in the more natural approach to vegetarian/vegan cooking - which is typically way cheaper than buying real or fake meat, especially if one buys the raw ingredients (eg dry pulses instead of cooked and canned).

It'll also be interesting to see if/when lab-grown meat gets to the point of being commercially viable (and whether there'll be much of a market for it, while the 'real' thing is still widely available). That creeps me out even more than the realistic fake meats!

I enjoy eating a dahl or whatever, but I find those meals are filling, but not satisfying. I'm mean I'm full, but still hungry/craving.

But yes, dried pulses are under rated. With a modern electronic pressure cooker they are easy to cook. No soaking, set and forget and done in 50 minutes. I often use in mince dishes and add different texture and some soluble fibre.

Mike

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