quickymart:

 

Lastman:

 

Couple of things about HB floods. This is about my first connectivity(2am=2 bars yah) since Tues as we have been without power or phone/cell/internet since then.

 

Obviously the failure of the substation greatly exacerbated the situation. Crazy not to have fixed that. It has been known as a key vulnerability for eons.

 

Second, surprised at complete failure of cellular system. Cell system stopped at same time as power. No back up of any kind. How could people needing rescuing seek help? Only cell coverage is where power back on except I think some cell back on in Napier. No generators in storage or anything to bring limited coverage back on without power.

 

 

https://www.newsroom.co.nz/napier-is-an-island

 

"It’s really weird being in Hastings as it feels so different to the plight of people in Napier - shops here are open, cars getting their petrol at Z, I saw people getting their Macca's in Havelock! It’s crazy, compared to 20km down the road where it’s a war zone," said Nick Fitness who took his family there yesterday to check on his in-laws and got stuck there.

 

Is this really the case? Life goes on as normal in Hastings, while Napier is totally devastated? I just find that odd - the two places are only 20 kms apart, and it's not like there's a mountain range separating them.

 

How did Napier get so hammered while Hastings appears to have escaped (relatively) unscathed?

 

Napier was fed by the substation that failed so they lost all power. Hastings has it’s own feed so outages were minimal. Also Napier more low lying except for Napier hill. In our case we are in Hastings district in an area unaffected by floods but deemed “expendable” for available power so it could go to other areas. Can’t complain about that as Havelock North people would die without their morning lattes.

Hastings used to be in the heart of the floodplain but river diversions changed that.

The loss of the substation was a huge blow as it has affected comms, recovery efforts and industry in general at a critical time of the year. Heads should roll at Transpower ….. but this is New Zealand.

At least we’ve got our two bars at 4 am 😆

Kyanar:

 

Another bit of a knot that will likely come up pretty soon if it hasn't already will be the huge increase in premiums for homeowners in affected areas for their flood cover.

 

It won't just be the affected areas, the increases will be NZ wide to cover the payouts.

Sounds OK to me, absolutely no problem with collective responsibility.

Will have a problem if they start gouging people and making windfall profits, like the parasites that are BP etc. Not that anyone'll care if I have a problem with that, but just I'd mention it...

The cost should not be evenly spread. The forestry industry needs to front a large percentage of the cost.

MikeB4:

The cost should not be evenly spread. The forestry industry needs to front a large percentage of the cost.

Handle9:

MikeB4:

 

The cost should not be evenly spread. The forestry industry needs to front a large percentage of the cost.

 

Meanwhile back on earth…

Have you seen the damage caused by Slash and hill country erosion and slipping  due to the insane clear felling? This is a serious conversation to have and four word flippant BS it plain stupid.

MikeB4:

Handle9:

Meanwhile back on earth…

Have you seen the damage caused by Slash and hill country erosion and slipping  due to the insane clear felling?

Had an interesting discussion with the head of the logging operation behind my house yesterday.
They are going to remove 8 trees that have been blown over on our section.
We chatted about "forestry slash"
The local council actually require a large amount to be left covering the ground to stimulate regrowth, and to prevent ground being washed away. Watch the councils do a full denial!

Heard some of 'Mediawatch' this morning in which ZB is criticised for downplaying the seriousness of the storm before and during it's arrival.

Some of the quotes from Hoskins and Hawkesby are repeated in this Stuff story: https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300809224/cyclone-gabrielle-scepticism-is-a-sting-in-covids-tail

They really are an odious lot.

Must be short of their much needed personal news bites, just wait for the feeble excuses

Handle9: They followed the rules presented to them.

You can get basically nothing out of the forestry industry and put everyone involved out of work or you can get nothing out of the forestry industry.

Up to you.

Again that is BS. So by your claim nothing should done to industries that are killing people and or causing immense damage to infrastructure land and waterways. hmm now lets think are there industries that have been required to change?

Auto industry required to change design and compulsory installation of safety equipment, EG Seat beats, design of front end to protect pedestrians

Building industry, banning of asbestos, earthquake mitigation. 

All industries, emmission controls.

Toy and infant equipment, must meet strict child safety regulations.

Drug Industry, must meet strict safety regulations.

Shall we go on. How many of those industries are still going strongly? Why should the forestry industry be exempt from this scrutiny,  legal requirement and  responsibility regarding environmental damage and human life? What gives the forestry some kind of right to destroy large swathes of countryside and waterways, destroys homes and businesses and take lives. 

I know nothing about forestry and will probably get a black eye for this, but I don't see why forestry slash could not be put to better use in principle. If they can get the damned logs out, they can also get the waste material. Create some employment by training and hiring people to cut it up for firewood and give that away free to people on benefit. Or burn it to fuel some extra power generation. It is going to emit carbon anyway. Forget about forestry companies crying that this will cost them money. Make it part of the price of their doing business. 

It doesn't have to be paid for in any traditional sense. Payment is also doing things that give back to the community. There has been a lot of that in the aftermath of the disaster. People literally donating the clothes off their backs. Restaurants distributing free food. Lose the capitalist obsession with balance sheets and just do what is necessary for the good of everyone.

I well remember when the notion of giving away supermarket food that was blemished or about to spoil was regarded with horror as radical and unacceptable. Today it is common practice. There are better ways of doing things if people are willing to look at the bigger picture.

Deanonzl:

 

Had an interesting discussion with the head of the logging operation behind my house yesterday.
They are going to remove 8 trees that have been blown over on our section.
We chatted about "forestry slash"
The local council actually require a large amount to be left covering the ground to stimulate regrowth, and to prevent ground being washed away. Watch the councils do a full denial!

 

 

 

They would not need to to leave the slash if they did selective logging. The remaining trees will protect saplings, stabilise the land, protect the waterways, continue to absorb carbon and make the forest sustainable and have continuous production.