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375 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 444748 2-Mar-2011 12:32
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... not implying that those I work with have intangible doctorates (far from it), just that specialisation has it's risks.




Things are LookingUp....  A photo from my back yard :-)
http://www.astrophotogallery.org/u141-rodm.html 


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  # 444749 2-Mar-2011 12:35
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LookingUp:
graemeh: The Admin person at a local real estate agents office has a PhD.  So sad what this country has come to.


... that said though, what's the PhD in?  I did my degree in Electrical Engineering, not because I particularly wanted to be an Engineer, but because I wanted to be employed.  I could just as easily (in fact probably more easily) have done mathematics, chemistry or physics, but the career opportunities in those areas were less defined and tangible.

If you do a PhD in Ethiopian Pottery or something similarly abstract you need to accept that there might be limited opportunities for you to ply your trade.  I now work in Science, and many of the people I work with recognise that they have very few career prospect outside their current position, due to the highly specialised nature of their area of expertise.  It is a very real issue for them.


I'm not sure of the exact subject, definitely biology of some type, so not Ethiopian Pottery, Greek Literature or anything like that.

My wife has a degree in Plant Pathology and that's why she works in IT.  There's not much research done in NZ these days, despite our huge reliance on agriculture.  Such a wasted opportunity.  The research funding is all so short term these days.

 
 
 
 


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Ultimate Geek
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  # 444750 2-Mar-2011 12:35
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LookingUp:
graemeh: The Admin person at a local real estate agents office has a PhD.  So sad what this country has come to.


... that said though, what's the PhD in?  I did my degree in Electrical Engineering, not because I particularly wanted to be an Engineer, but because I wanted to be employed.  I could just as easily (in fact probably more easily) have done mathematics, chemistry or physics, but the career opportunities in those areas were less defined and tangible.

If you do a PhD in Ethiopian Pottery or something similarly abstract you need to accept that there might be limited opportunities for you to ply your trade.  I now work in Science, and many of the people I work with recognise that they have very few career prospect outside their current position, due to the highly specialised nature of their area of expertise.  It is a very real issue for them.


What kind of science are you working in ?
I'm studying Computer Science, how is the prospect in that ? (apart from the ever advancing tech blabla all that lol) 

375 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 444755 2-Mar-2011 13:01
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miamiheatfan: What kind of science are you working in ?
I'm studying Computer Science, how is the prospect in that ? (apart from the ever advancing tech blabla all that lol) 


I'm working in Environmental Science.  My role is engineering related, in that my team provides instrumentation and engineering services to our internal and external customers.  Some of the others here are highly specialised in various areas relating to this, and while you'd think that this is a growth area, funding for pure science is not what it was and times are tough.

My suggestion would be to look for qualifications that provide an employment entry point, and once you're in, you have a base to move from.  In my case I had an electrical engineering related job (although multiple roles) for ~12 years, before deciding follow my interest in software, and take a position managing a team of software developers.  8 years of that (again in multiple roles) pretty much convinced me that software development can be a stressful place to be, so I've moved back into an engineering management position.

The best advice I can give is to be prepared to make a short term sacrifice for a longer term objective.  That may mean chasing a job you don't really want, but when you catch it, make the absolute best of it, and use it as a base to move forward to where you want to be.  Some of the most useful skills I've picked up along the way came from roles I assumed out of necessity rather than intention, and it's all about what you make of opportunities.




Things are LookingUp....  A photo from my back yard :-)
http://www.astrophotogallery.org/u141-rodm.html 


xpd



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  # 445112 3-Mar-2011 11:30
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XPD / Gavin / DemiseNZ

 

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Master Geek


  # 445362 4-Mar-2011 00:46
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Got a interview tomorrow, lets see how things go.

xpd



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  # 445368 4-Mar-2011 07:10
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Good luck :)




XPD / Gavin / DemiseNZ

 

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Master Geek


  # 446158 7-Mar-2011 04:24
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xpd: Good luck :)


Thx xpd, received word that I will be progressed into the next interview stages, so it went well.

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Master Geek


  # 446162 7-Mar-2011 07:05
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Things I find help include:

Always read the job advert properly, several times over!

On one occasion an employer asked for an explanation of what DNS is and how it worked in the advert. I took the time to do this in a couple paragraphs. During the interview they mentioned that most people didn't do this, they automatically got filtered out of the application process. I got that job too.

Write a cover letter and tailor it to the position, and address what the advert outlines - skills, experience etc and how you match that, I try to keep it down to 3/4 of a page.

CV/Resume, 2 pages, again you should tweak it for each job.

Get the format right, keep it clean and simple. Over the years I've had the odd comment about how good mine is and did I do it my self? I've poured hours of effort into getting it right, looking at how other people do theirs for examples. Sometimes you'll find one that hits the mark, it reads well, and shows you their skills quickly and clearly. I've borrowed ideas from the good ones, and it pays off by the looks. Also pay attention to how good it looks when printed.

Spelling, seriously there is no excuse to not get it correct and to use good grammar. Sometimes the spell checker will suggest a totally different word, looks pretty silly when these slip through. So proof reading everything a few times is a must. 

On average I might spend about two or more hours writing a good cover letter, tweaking the CV, looking around the companies website to see what they are about. Before sending it off, I'll leave it for a while and go do something else, often I think of better ways of wording things, or something I missed the first time around. 

I think the amount of effort you put into refining your job application skills, and getting it right reflects how likely you are to get an interview. As a few have mentioned employers get swamped with applications and they are weary of generic cover letters and CV's. Sure I don't always get interviews either, and it's frustrating, but sometimes you'll get a surprise too!

A funny thing I read on a forum thread recently where people were talking about dealing with the hiring process, one person posted about the large number of applications they received for a position, the boss threw half the of them in the bin and said "we don't hire unlucky people".

Another tip I can think of is identify places you'd like to work for, personally go and see them, make an appointment to see their hiring person/manager. While they might not have a job just for you then and there, they'll often keep your CV. Then rather than advertising a new opening and dealing with a bazillion applications, they'll go through the CV's they already have, make a few calls. One place I worked at did this, and several positions were filled when there was an opening with people that had previously expressed their interest by coming in and making them selves known.

Personally I think most IT courses are a waste of time if you want to be a tech, better off to go do A+, Network+, and start off in an entry level position and work your way up by doing Cisco/MS/Whatever certifications along the way. Sure if you want to do software development, then a CS degree is probably the way to go.. But that's just my thinking.

As far as getting the job done and success goes, heres a link to a forum post I found insightful. 

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  # 446321 7-Mar-2011 14:59
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lonney: Things I find help include:

Always read the job advert properly, several times over!

On one occasion an employer asked for an explanation of what DNS is and how it worked in the advert. I took the time to do this in a couple paragraphs. During the interview they mentioned that most people didn't do this, they automatically got filtered out of the application process. I got that job too.

Write a cover letter and tailor it to the position, and address what the advert outlines - skills, experience etc and how you match that, I try to keep it down to 3/4 of a page.

CV/Resume, 2 pages, again you should tweak it for each job.

Get the format right, keep it clean and simple. Over the years I've had the odd comment about how good mine is and did I do it my self? I've poured hours of effort into getting it right, looking at how other people do theirs for examples. Sometimes you'll find one that hits the mark, it reads well, and shows you their skills quickly and clearly. I've borrowed ideas from the good ones, and it pays off by the looks. Also pay attention to how good it looks when printed.

Spelling, seriously there is no excuse to not get it correct and to use good grammar. Sometimes the spell checker will suggest a totally different word, looks pretty silly when these slip through. So proof reading everything a few times is a must. 

On average I might spend about two or more hours writing a good cover letter, tweaking the CV, looking around the companies website to see what they are about. Before sending it off, I'll leave it for a while and go do something else, often I think of better ways of wording things, or something I missed the first time around. 

I think the amount of effort you put into refining your job application skills, and getting it right reflects how likely you are to get an interview. As a few have mentioned employers get swamped with applications and they are weary of generic cover letters and CV's. Sure I don't always get interviews either, and it's frustrating, but sometimes you'll get a surprise too!

A funny thing I read on a forum thread recently where people were talking about dealing with the hiring process, one person posted about the large number of applications they received for a position, the boss threw half the of them in the bin and said "we don't hire unlucky people".

Another tip I can think of is identify places you'd like to work for, personally go and see them, make an appointment to see their hiring person/manager. While they might not have a job just for you then and there, they'll often keep your CV. Then rather than advertising a new opening and dealing with a bazillion applications, they'll go through the CV's they already have, make a few calls. One place I worked at did this, and several positions were filled when there was an opening with people that had previously expressed their interest by coming in and making them selves known.

Personally I think most IT courses are a waste of time if you want to be a tech, better off to go do A+, Network+, and start off in an entry level position and work your way up by doing Cisco/MS/Whatever certifications along the way. Sure if you want to do software development, then a CS degree is probably the way to go.. But that's just my thinking.

As far as getting the job done and success goes, heres a link to a forum post I found insightful. 


+1

As an employer, this would definitely get you through the first cull.

73 posts

Master Geek


  # 446793 8-Mar-2011 20:46
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Another thing to do is to be yourself.

Do not try and be someone else because that someone else is already taken so be yourself, in life as well as in interviews Tongue out.

121 posts

Master Geek


  # 446814 8-Mar-2011 22:08
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Thank you for this, I am having this exact same trouble. I'm currently furthering my knowledge by doing my part-time studies while looking for a Full-Time job in Auckland CBD.

But even the smallest things I have been applying for, like a simple job at "Geeks on Wheels" I was turned down, They replied with "Sorry you do not fit the criteria we are looking for" I mean if I don't fit the criteria then what are they looking for? I replied with "Could you please provide me with details as to what criteria I did not meet as I would like to improve on these aspects for future employment" and guess what.... no reply.

I often think it's because they see "South African" and think "nah, we'd rather hire a kiwi"

But on another note, could you have a look at my online portfolio I have been building? Maybe give me some tips on it and thing I could add in case I am lucky enough for the employer to have a look at my portfolio.

http://www.eGuru.co.nz

I'm gonna be reading through your notes and will be making changes to my CV too.

Once again, Thank You

73 posts

Master Geek


  # 446818 8-Mar-2011 22:34
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Your website looks good. :)

I like the style in the front page.

xpd



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  # 446861 9-Mar-2011 09:32
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Crysis, Id either remove or heavily watermark your documents - maybe Im thinking slightly paranoid, but it wouldnt be hard for someone to copy those documents and modify them to suit themselves..... otherwise a nice clean layout for a online CV :)




XPD / Gavin / DemiseNZ

 

Server : i5-3470s @ 3.50GHz  16GB RAM  Win 10 Pro    Workstation : Ryzen 5 3600 / 16GB DDR4 / RX580 4GB    Console : Xbox One

 

Now on BigPipe 100/100 and 2Talk               Add me on Steam


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Master Geek


  # 446893 9-Mar-2011 11:02
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xpd: Crysis, Id either remove or heavily watermark your documents - maybe Im thinking slightly paranoid, but it wouldnt be hard for someone to copy those documents and modify them to suit themselves..... otherwise a nice clean layout for a online CV :)


Ahh watermark duhh.. Brilliant. I was actually worried about the same thing but for reason watermark never crossed my mind lol

Wow, I feel a little stupid now haha

But thank you.

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