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# 79605 19-Mar-2011 16:06
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Any good online PC shops that don't charge your CC immediately even if the item is out of stock and will be backordered?

I just had an issue with one place where after ringing to confirm a particular component was in stock, (and been told several were arriving that day) I placed the order 2 minutes later, then got emailed the next day telling me they were out of stock and the item was backordered and would be about 2 weeks away.

I rang up, cancelled the order and they said nothing about refunds etc so I presumed my card hadn't been charged.

Checked a day or so later and my CC HAS been charged.

Phoned again and they said yes, CC is charged at order time regardless of whether item is in stock or not, and the refund would automatically "about the middle of next week"

I guess it's a cheap lesson about a shop to avoid - but curious to know if all places do this? Seems like it's WAY more shop focussed than customer focussed. I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm just saying I'd prefer not to support a place with a policy like this.

Cheers - N




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Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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  # 449907 19-Mar-2011 16:57
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Yeah, they mostly do that despite being against the merchant agreements. If you are flying close to your limit then it is really annoying, and if you have been suckered into the debit card scam then its outright disgusting.

Call them up, tell them to refund immediatly or you will take it to your bank, and then take it to your bank anyway.




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  # 449918 19-Mar-2011 17:55
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yea, never add your CC details if they have an option to pay manually by bank cheque then choose that and wait for the stock to come in. Once stock is in then change your payment method to CC and pay it.  I would get emails saying I haven't paid yet I would reply back with your stock aint in yet. They want your money so they aren't going to argue with you.





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  # 449919 19-Mar-2011 17:57
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Kaos36: yea, never add your CC details if they have an option to pay manually by bank cheque then choose that and wait for the stock to come in. Once stock is in then change your payment method to CC and pay it.  I would get emails saying I haven't paid yet I would reply back with your stock aint in yet. They want your money so they aren't going to argue with you.



Nice idea... May in fact use that - bit more of a pain though...

I'd prefer to find a place that didn't charge my CC until stock was ready to be dispatched.

Cheers - N





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Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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  # 449935 19-Mar-2011 19:30
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If it was a debit card then yes, could be a major pain, but with a CC then unless you are close to your limit (and if you are, you probably have bigger things to worry about than this) then you shouldn't really be affected too much

I'm not sure why the store does this though since, AFAIK, they will pay the fees on the CC transaction even if they refund it.

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  # 449937 19-Mar-2011 19:34

Talkiet: Any good online PC shops that don't charge your CC immediately even if the item is out of stock and will be backordered?

I just had an issue with one place where after ringing to confirm a particular component was in stock, (and been told several were arriving that day) I placed the order 2 minutes later, then got emailed the next day telling me they were out of stock and the item was backordered and would be about 2 weeks away.

I rang up, cancelled the order and they said nothing about refunds etc so I presumed my card hadn't been charged.

Checked a day or so later and my CC HAS been charged.

Phoned again and they said yes, CC is charged at order time regardless of whether item is in stock or not, and the refund would automatically "about the middle of next week"

I guess it's a cheap lesson about a shop to avoid - but curious to know if all places do this? Seems like it's WAY more shop focussed than customer focussed. I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm just saying I'd prefer not to support a place with a policy like this.

Cheers - N


I think that is normal, these shopping cart systems will usually charge the CC at the time of order, so I don't beleive it is bad service.



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  # 449938 19-Mar-2011 19:38
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I think that is normal, these shopping cart systems will usually charge the CC at the time of order, so I don't beleive it is bad service.


So it's ok, if a component is out of stock, to bill the customers card immediately before knowing even how long before the item may be back in stock?

I think the fact it's automated makes it worse. IMO if something needs to be backordered, a BETTER system would be to flag the order for confirmation, and then to charge when the item is ready to dispatch.

Note I'm not saying they should/must do this - I'm only saying that this is a behaviour I don't believe is acceptable and I'll spend my money elsewhere.

Cheers - N





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Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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  # 449939 19-Mar-2011 19:40
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It actually goes against the merchant agreements to do that. Real shops like DSE etc only charge on dispatch of things.




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  # 449945 19-Mar-2011 20:28
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I can see the advantages of automated charging - means the item can be shipped instantly unlike online banking where payment would take at least a day to show up.

But any decent online shop should be keeping a inventory system which lets people know if its in stock or out of stock and not charge you unless the item can be shipped that day.

Regarding Debit cards, the worst is when you go to a hotel or hire a car. I hired a car in Wellington last month and had $1000 dollar bond taken from my debit card which i was not told about when making my booking.

I'm sure it was somewhere in the terms & conditions but really that amount of money should be in big bold print on the front page.

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  # 449947 19-Mar-2011 20:34
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Talkiet:I think the fact it's automated makes it worse. IMO if something needs to be backordered, a BETTER system would be to flag the order for confirmation, and then to charge when the item is ready to dispatch


I don't see how it being automated is worse, it would be far worse if the person knew it was out of stock but still put the charge through to your credit card.




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  # 449948 19-Mar-2011 20:35
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jbard:
Talkiet:I think the fact it's automated makes it worse. IMO if something needs to be backordered, a BETTER system would be to flag the order for confirmation, and then to charge when the item is ready to dispatch


I don't see how it being automated is worse, it would be far worse if the person knew it was out of stock but still put the charge through to your credit card.



Being automated means they have effectively enacted rules saying they WILL charge when an item is out of stock.

More than just once, in fact, every time, by design.

I think that's worse.

Cheers - N





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Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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  # 449955 19-Mar-2011 21:54
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Richms: It actually goes against the merchant agreements to do that. Real shops like DSE etc only charge on dispatch of things.

Interesting. Just had a look at an ASB merchant agreement. 3.1a says that they are obligated to dispatch and deliver your purchase immediately if they charge the card, 3.1b says they are obligated to not present the transaction for payment until the goods are available unless they have advised you otherwise.

3.1 All Card Not Present Transactions: In addition to the undertakings set out in the Agreement, the Merchant also undertakes, in relation to each ard
Not Present Transaction, that it will:

(a) perform all obligations to Cardholders in relation to a Card Not
Present Transaction immediately after any such Transaction has been
successfully completed including the dispatch or fulfilment of goods or
services agreed to be supplied;

(b) not present the Card Not Present Transaction for payment until the goods
are shipped or the services are performed, unless the Cardholder has
agreed to a delayed delivery of goods or performance of services that
was properly disclosed to the Cardholder at the time of the Transaction;
[...]


So, how would you find out which bank they have a merchant agreement with?

Giving the merchant a good caning for this behaviour seems in order.

Who was the merchant?

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  # 449958 19-Mar-2011 22:08
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gzt:
So, how would you find out which bank they have a merchant agreement with?

Giving the merchant a good caning for this behaviour seems in order.

Who was the merchant?


Most computer shops have their bank account details on their shipping, about, or contact pages.  Generally speaking, everyone who accepts transactions uses the bank they normally deal with, as most banks require a business relationship history before even talking to you.

The fact they say that the payment will automatically bounce back indicates to me they may be using Auth/Complete, in which case they haven't actually charged your card yet, they've authorised it, which means the money is still in your account, just set aside.  If the authorisation isn't used in 7 days or so, it automatically expires and the funds are returned.  This is normal process for out of stock items (though the merchant agreement doesn't forbid it, Amex recommends not doing it).




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  # 450345 21-Mar-2011 12:28
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Acquire seem to charge your credit card immediately too, even if their website says they have stock, but their supplier doesn't. This is really bad practise.

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