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Finch
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  #542136 7-Nov-2011 18:05
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Will make cooking dinner everynight cheaper, im in :)

talisker
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  #542152 7-Nov-2011 18:28
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Actually I don't think complexity is a big issue. Because NZ has a uniform GST rate across everything, it's seen as a big deal to have some products with no GST. The UK has a pretty complex system with VAT (e.g. none on children's clothes, books etc) and it's not an issue at all. These strange scenarios like the takeaway food one mentioned earlier always get highlighted when VAT is introduced on different products, and are used by businesses to get some free publicity and for a bit of a laugh (5 quid for a pickled onion, comes with free fish and chips etc), but that's about it.

The consumer doesn't even have to know what has GST and what doesn't, in theory it should just flow through to the prices and result in "good" things being cheaper. The systems issue shouldn't be a biggy either. Presumably most payment systems in supermarkets are designed for international markets and can easily be configured to apply different tax rates based on product type. I wouldn't be surprised if they already have multiple rates set up, they're just all currently set to the same amount.

 
 
 
 


SaltyNZ
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  #542188 7-Nov-2011 19:24
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Personally, rather than try to decide what stuff should be GST exempt, I think you should do the opposite: make crap food more expensive. Seems pretty unequivocal that McD's is unhealthy: why not make it 50% taxed instead of 15%?




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Byrned

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  #542212 7-Nov-2011 20:05
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talisker: Actually I don't think complexity is a big issue. Because NZ has a uniform GST rate across everything, it's seen as a big deal to have some products with no GST. The UK has a pretty complex system with VAT (e.g. none on children's clothes, books etc) and it's not an issue at all. These strange scenarios like the takeaway food one mentioned earlier always get highlighted when VAT is introduced on different products, and are used by businesses to get some free publicity and for a bit of a laugh (5 quid for a pickled onion, comes with free fish and chips etc), but that's about it.

The consumer doesn't even have to know what has GST and what doesn't, in theory it should just flow through to the prices and result in "good" things being cheaper. The systems issue shouldn't be a biggy either. Presumably most payment systems in supermarkets are designed for international markets and can easily be configured to apply different tax rates based on product type. I wouldn't be surprised if they already have multiple rates set up, they're just all currently set to the same amount.


Yeah, supermarkets are probably fine, but what about your smaller veggie shops that operate on an older till, but have a mixture of products. The problem is, it starts with this, and then the next item is milk, but what about flavored milk? You can see where I'm going with this.

So the whole thing in the UK where Pringles were, then weren't exempt from VAT and the only way for them to work it out was the courts. Or what about the fact that even different candidates from Labour have different ideas as to whether a prepared salad is GST exempt.   

But whether it is right or wrong wasn't what I was saying in the beginning. I just don't see how you can push something on one hand saying it'll make fruit and veg more accessible, and then on the other have a policy that will push the price up! Or are they just banking on the fact that the average Joe voter will not put two and two together?!! Maybe they're just hoping that you'll like that "fruit and veg will be cheaper" and that they're also "going after those rich pr**k farmers who don't contribute fairly". 

kiwitrc
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  #542220 7-Nov-2011 20:33
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SaltyNZ
I'm a voter who thinks that anyone who WANTS to be elected to govern should be automatically disqualified from doing so...
 


+1

mattwnz
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  #542229 7-Nov-2011 20:50
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SaltyNZ: Personally, rather than try to decide what stuff should be GST exempt, I think you should do the opposite: make crap food more expensive. Seems pretty unequivocal that McD's is unhealthy: why not make it 50% taxed instead of 15%?


Some of it is, and some of it isn't. Some of there food, eg the fish burgers even got a health tick at one stage.

richms
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  #542233 7-Nov-2011 21:05
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The prices at the supermarket are set to maximize profits, nothing to do with how much GST is being paid on something.

Also I don't buy fresh veges because they are a pain in the ... to prepare and store. I get those frozen steamfresh packs, or canned stuff. No GST off for me if labour get in :(

This policy is total idiocy IMO. Many healthy options are excluded. Like the preprepared salads that are a viable option if you dont want to buy bucketloads of fresh stuff that will go off before it all gets eaten etc.




Richard rich.ms

 
 
 
 


nakedmolerat
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  #542238 7-Nov-2011 21:13
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talisker: Actually I don't think complexity is a big issue. Because NZ has a uniform GST rate across everything, it's seen as a big deal to have some products with no GST. The UK has a pretty complex system with VAT (e.g. none on children's clothes, books etc) and it's not an issue at all. These strange scenarios like the takeaway food one mentioned earlier always get highlighted when VAT is introduced on different products, and are used by businesses to get some free publicity and for a bit of a laugh (5 quid for a pickled onion, comes with free fish and chips etc), but that's about it.

The consumer doesn't even have to know what has GST and what doesn't, in theory it should just flow through to the prices and result in "good" things being cheaper. The systems issue shouldn't be a biggy either. Presumably most payment systems in supermarkets are designed for international markets and can easily be configured to apply different tax rates based on product type. I wouldn't be surprised if they already have multiple rates set up, they're just all currently set to the same amount.


correct. all items are GST free until it reaches the customer. hence, i dont see why this would be difficult to be implemented. however, i agree that there maybe difficulty to determine which fruit/vege should be `gst free`. but hey, we have to start from somewhere and this could be improved over time. in the end, it is the customers that will benefit from this.

we can be pessimistic about everything and nothing will change.





Zeon
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  #542240 7-Nov-2011 21:15
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But seriously, what idiot buys fruit and veges from the supermarket anyway. Fresh grocer or side of the road stalls often have great deals that I guarantee are more than 15% cheaper than the supermarket.




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nakedmolerat
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  #542242 7-Nov-2011 21:19
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Zeon: But seriously, what idiot buys fruit and veges from the supermarket anyway. Fresh grocer or side of the road stalls often have great deals that I guarantee are more than 15% cheaper than the supermarket.


..... those 'fresh grocer' also have GST on it.. right? afaik GST is not only for supermarket items. if they are already cheap, you can expect cheaper price





richms
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  #542254 7-Nov-2011 21:50
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nakedmolerat:
..... those 'fresh grocer' also have GST on it.. right? afaik GST is not only for supermarket items. if they are already cheap, you can expect cheaper price


It goes to show that the price is still not a reason that people dont buy fruit and vegies.




Richard rich.ms

jfanning
409 posts

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  #542255 7-Nov-2011 21:53
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Zeon: But seriously, what idiot buys fruit and veges from the supermarket anyway. Fresh grocer or side of the road stalls often have great deals that I guarantee are more than 15% cheaper than the supermarket.


And which ones would these be? 

mattwnz
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  #542257 7-Nov-2011 21:58
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richms:
nakedmolerat:
..... those 'fresh grocer' also have GST on it.. right? afaik GST is not only for supermarket items. if they are already cheap, you can expect?cheaper price


It goes to show that the price is still not a reason that people dont buy fruit and vegies.


I don't agree. NZs prices for fruit and veges are higher proportionally with our lower income, than OZ and the UK for many things. If fruit and veges were half the price, I am sure a lot more people would buy them. However removeing 15% isn't going to make any difference, especially if supermarkets absorb that with a higher margin. Supermarkets however are not often the cheapest place to buy fruit and veges, as they are higher margin items for them. Not to mention that it is often not the best quality or freshness. Roadside stalls and markets are cheaper to buy from, or direct from the farmer. I don't agree with removing GST, but I do agree with some form of subsidy on fruit and veges, especially for lower income people.

richms
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  #542258 7-Nov-2011 21:58
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jfanning:
And which ones would these be? 


Fresh n save in birkenhead has done me well for veges as well as strange frozen asian deepfriables and also constantly has the best price on Dr Pepper and cherry coke imports





Richard rich.ms

jfanning
409 posts

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  #542267 7-Nov-2011 22:06
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richms:
Fresh n save in birkenhead has done me well for veges as well as strange frozen asian deepfriables and also constantly has the best price on Dr Pepper and cherry coke imports



Wrong end of the country I'm afraid.  But these places don't exist everywhere, and where they do, they are a considerable drive to get there, canceling out all the benefits of going to them

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